One of the most common expressions relating to food is "eating a healthy diet", and the numerous related phrasings such as "I eat healthily" (or unhealthily!).
However, the ancient phrase about one man's meat being another's poison seems to be getting some scientific validation.
As in all things, we are all individuals. We might need a significantly different diet to someone else. What is healthy for one could be very unhealthy for another.
Blanket advice (e.g. from NHS, or Food Standards Agency, or whoever else) simply cannot accommodate these individual variations.
In particular, we see many members explaining how they have had to change their diets when they started to suffer thyroid disorders. What once they could consume without any issues, now has to be limited, or even eliminated from their diets.
Despite the sub-head, I'll be distinctly sceptical about their "new recipe for healthy eating" for now.
The current New Scientist has an article (and podcast).
Why there is no such thing as a healthy diet that works for everyone
What is good for us to eat varies so much from person to person that a universally wholesome diet is a fiction. Instead, the science of nutrition is hot on the heels of a new recipe for healthy eating
Health 9 September 2020
By Graham Lawton
FOR about a decade, geneticist Tim Spector of King’s College London ate the same thing every day: a tuna and sweetcorn sandwich on brown bread, followed by a banana. He thought it was a healthy choice, until he turned the microscope on himself and discovered that it was about the worst possible thing he could eat. He was having huge post-lunch surges of sugar and fat in his bloodstream, both of which are known risk factors for diabetes, heart disease and obesity.
There is a little more you can read at this link but the full article and podcast are behind a paywall newscientist.com/article/mg...
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helvella
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The perceived "healthy diet" would definitely not do me any good at all, I'm quite limited in what I can eat and as my Gastro Con said many years ago it's ok to eat unhealthy stuff if that's all you can do, I've just had my gallbladder removed so I'm even more limited, white rice, white bread and apples ☹️
As close to what nature provides for us as you can (tons of choice of fresh stuff until we moved to colder climes and made it more tricky) as long as it agrees with you, is my mantra. Those really old Japanese often say they put their longevity down to stopping eating when they feel full up! They eat a lot of raw fish and vegetables they grow themselves.
Oh the NHS Healthy Plate! What can you say! All those carbohydrates - with every meal! If I followed that advice I’d be diabetic and a lot fatter than I am by now.
I do think a diet that was low carb, low sugar - cut out cakes, biscuits, sweets etc, with enough ‘good’ fat and as few additives as possible in it, plenty of water, lots if green leafy vegetables, fruit but not too much and fruits that don’t have too much sugar in them, plenty of (oily) fish, not too much meat - well maybe not too much of anything - could possibly be good for most people.
How many medics actually understand their mantra, "eat a healthy diet"!
The one word often overlooked is "varied".
I'm not surprised Tim Spector suffered the effects of his rigid diet....and even more surprised that he was unaware of the pitfalls he faced by following it.
We are all different with different needs and that applies just as much to food as it does to thyroid medication!
The problem is that nutrition is a subject not given the importance it deserves in the education system. Children grow up with scant knowledge, they become parents with scant knowledge and the problem is perpetuated.
Fast food " has become the norm for many....it's quick and easy.
We just need to look along any High Street and the outcome is staring us in the face.
The health of a nation largely depends on what it eats!
I am as bad as anyone in that I can enjoy sweet foods. But what I don't like are inappropriately sweet foods.
If you look through ingredients, all too often there is sugar - as sugar, as one of the many sugar-based substances like agave syrup, maple syrup, honey, glucose-fructose corn syrup, glucose, etc., or some combination. The manufacturers play the game and use multiple sources so that none appear in the first two or three ingredients that real people actually might check.
And even when the sugar content is low, you'll find use of various sweeteners.
Why does everything have to be sweet?
Because almost everything is sweet, we are accustomed to sweetness everywhere. What happened to savour, sharpness, bitterness without sweetness?
Peanuts coated in honey.
Bread with a distinct sugary sweetness.
"Pulled" pork laden with sugar.
Foods with chilli are all too often "Sweet chilli".
I agree with you regarding the sweetness of everything. When yoghurt first became more available , around 45 years ago when I was in my teens, I distinctly remember it being quite tarty. The only type of yoghurt that even remotely resembles that taste now is Kefir. Most other yoghurts are over sweet and don't tase anything like the original Ski yoghurts of old.
And they keep us habituated to sweetness with sweeteners even if the foods don't actually contain any of the true sugars.
I think I have come to realise that the sweetness of, say, a cheese, a vegetable, a meat, a fish, is an indicator of wholesomeness. But the excessive, sugary sweetness seems to be used to overpower any wholesomeness that may exist and cover up lack of such wholesomeness.
I could not agree more! I especially react when I see "M & M breakfast cereals" and things like that...why do your breakfast cereals have to taste like candy...?!
I don't know when I stopped being pushed in a pram (and it was long before modern buggies were available). But I keep seeing remarkably old children being pushed around in buggies. In supermarket trolleys. I pretty much only remember walking.
My mantras are: To each his own, A little of what you fancy does you good, and
I also believe that if you dislike something, it's for a reason, and there's no point in forcing yourself to eat it.
An uncle of mine ate steak and chips, followed by an apple, every night of his adult life (don't know what he had for lunch, but he didn't eat breakfast), and I'm sure many would consider his diet to be pretty unhealthy. But, he led a long and healthy life, slim and very active. Oh, and he also fed his dog chocolate, and the dog too lead a long and healthy life!
I have a rather restricted diet because I don't like very much. I am very, very fussy. Not very keen on meat or fish - well, chicken and cod, if I have to. And, hate the majority of veggies - aubergines, french beans, swedes, garlic, green cabbage - just about anything green, in fact - hate brown rice, sweet potatoes, green bananas, quinoa - oh yuck! - etc. They just do not suit me. I don't feel good after eating them. And, I'm pretty certain it's for a reason. I think we all find our own food levels, the things we like, the things that make us feel good - and, before anyone mentions chocolate and cream cakes, I should think the number of people content to just live on those is pretty low. And that is why when people on here ask what they 'should' be eating, or not eating, I often say: eat what makes you feel good.
When I was a kid, my favourite foods were runner beans, peaches, liver, cod roe, kidneys - in fact, I used to eat the suet raw, (the fat that encloses the kidneys). A pretty strange diet, in fact. But, it kept me alive, even with my wonky thyroid. I think I liked the things that were necessary for me. I'm pretty certain that that diet wouldn't suit very many people, but perhaps it's not meant to. It was specific to me. And, my tastes have changed since I grew up, presumably because my needs have changed, too.
That doctor I often mention who hated fat women, he asked me to keep a food diary, once. It is something I will never, ever agree to do again! I didn't eat very much, undiagnosed hypo, I had no appetite. I ate 1 or two small meals a day. But, he freaked out at every single one - especially those that included butter! - except for one... My daughter had stewed some courgettes with garlic, to go with the meat for the evening meal. I didn't eat the meat, just a small helping of courgettes. "Now," he said, "that's what I call a healthy meal!" I didn't know weather to laugh or cry! Talk about ignorant. And, so I decided, there and then, never to talk about food to a doctor ever again!
But, I'm waffling. I'm turning into a very boring person, these days. Thank you, Rod, for posting that. It's an article after my own heart - even if I can't read it all, I can imagine the rest.
Aubergines can be OK – if sufficiently well cooked.
Swedes – dislike.
Green cabbage – dislike.
I love the smell and taste of fresh runner beans. Raw. Which we shouldn’t eat because they contain certain poisonous substances. Cooked – they can be OK.
Sweet potatoes – not my taste.
Green bananas – no. Not even slightly green. Especially the long fine stringy bits. But love when properly ripe (not overripe).
Quinoa – nothing special.
Liver – preferably lamb.
Cod roe – if I have to.
Kidneys – used to be OK, especially a tiny bit on a pork chop. But cannot abide any longer.
"A little of what you fancy does you good".....a favourite saying of my paternal Granny!
Strange foods..... I had an eccentric old great uncle who had his housekeeper make huge rice puddings which he kept in a kitchen drawer......he cut and ate slices as a snack. I don't suppose he used the word snack!
Did him no harm he was still riding a motor bike at 90....it ended up in a museum. It was 1950's rural Cumbria so I don't suppose many lives were af risk!
He drank China tea which I remember being given to drink as a child.....I thought I'd been poisoned! Like it now.
No wonder I'm becoming an ancient odd bod....it's in the genes!
I love that idea! Rice pudding in a draw! lol My great grandmother made very thick maccaroni pudding, and use to give me slices when I went round there. Loved that.
My brother and father used to put vinegar on everything they ate. I always found that very weird. But, perhaps they had low stomach acid without being consciously aware of it.
Well hey ho and a Google search, and up pops a recipe for Rice Pudding Snacking Squares! Bit grander than old Uncle Jack's kitchen drawer version....but basically the same thing!
I guess Macaroni Pudding, sliced, was also the same idea.
These old folks were on the ball!
Later....curiosity killed the cat.....or discovered a porridge drawer!
"dressers in the Scottish Highlands may have a “porridge drawer” — a tin lined drawer into which freshly made porridge was emptied and left to cool. When cold, slices of the porridge could be cut out and taken out of the house for later consumption”
I had a feeling that I remembered something about porridge in a drawer (I was born in Scotland) and sure enough thanks to google here it is below. Let’s hope they were able to keep mice and rats etc out if the drawer.
“Superstition would have you believe the porridge should be stirred only using the right hand and in a clockwise direction to ward off evil spirits. This paste was then cooled and stored in a wooden porridge drawer. From the drawer, the paste (porridge) would be eaten over several days.”
Really interesting Helvella, many thanks for that.
Two things would alarm me about Tim's lunch.
First I'd try and eat something different each day as far as imagination and access to foodstuffs allows.
Second, pudding is a bad move, so save the banana for later in the afternoon when you are running out of steam e.g. before a drive home if you are lucky enough to be able to be out.
Hmmm I'd also worry about heavy metals in the Tuna . . .
Anyhow, great that people are looking at this kind of thing.
As humankind our progress on some of the simplest of things we need to do to function does seem somewhat slow e.g. eating. So great scope for anyone looking for an opportunity to identify some positive change.
Tim Spector ran - The British Gut Project - examining the gut microbiome. I registered and took part - sending in my sample from Crete. This in turn was sent to San Diego for analysis and it seems my gut bugs were in keeping with the Eastern Med. Took me several months to analyse the findings... some good news and some not !! A combined project with The American Gut ...
Yes a really interesting project. I visited a Nutritionist and had a poo sample analysed which showed that some of my gut biome was par for the course but some of it was really quite weird! I cannot eat gluten, eggs, chicken, coconut, soya, milk or cream. Most of these were diagnosed 20 years ago by an NHS Allergy Consultant (I went privately) after an elimination diet. I love any fish or shellfish, any meat, all veg except parsnips and sweet potato (too sweet) and all fruits. My go to snack is nuts, fruit or chocolate and I enjoy red wine. There is no "one diet for all". The only diet is eat less and exercise more if necessary, says she who needs to lose 12 lbs or will have to buy a new wardrobe!!
I registered for another gut project back in June (US based) but it has been delayed due to Covid but will report back if it ever goes ahead.
I wonder if Biobank researchers are looking more at diet etc now?
Biobank was a big recruitment exercise a few years ago to get people (500,00 I think) aged from about 40-60 to go to special centres have bloods taken, blood pressure and wieght check etc and answer questions on diet, health, current meds. The info is no freely available to bona fide research groups. I get updates every so often about what they have discovered, very interesting stuff.
Sounds interesting although these days I am becoming more and more paranoid about data sharing !! I know - talk about bolting the stable when the horse has gone !!
Helvella Thank you for addressing this great topic. I personally do for *For Your Blood Type* by Dr D'adamo . It's been over 10 years since I totally switched over. But truth be told that it was very easy for me to switch over to * For Your Blood Type* because those are the foods that Dr D'adamo studied and researched and recommends for the different blood types works best for me. Some of my family members follow Dr D'adamo's way of eating for their blood type and feel great on it. In fact when they try to cheat every once in a while they can tell the difference. So yes I truly believe it's not one size only for all.
That's very interesting . Greygoose I guess there are exceptions . I would love to know why this happened to you? Besides weight gain did you feel better and stronger ? From my experience when I first started with dosing with NDT . I was having terrible itching and breakouts. I was tested for food sensitivities that I had daily and did fine. However I did not do fine with was NDT. Once I switched to synthetic T3 the itching and breakouts stopped for me.
No, I most certainly didn't feel better or stronger. Most of the time I felt hungry, because there wasn't much I liked on the list of permitted foods. It just wasn't right for me at all.
My view on blood group diets and such like is this:
While the genes which determine blood type might be associated with other features, this might well not be 100%
For example, say 70% of group A seemed to do well on a particular food (or diet). That would come out in a simplistic analysis as associating the group A gene(s) with the specific food. But it might just be that the food genes happen more often to travel alongside the group A gene(s). And not actually be the group A gene(s) themselves.
I’ve had to re educate my kids over the years because of the narratives they receive at school 😩 They end up debating with their teachers and get into trouble! Lol
The only thing I can’t get my kids to eat is the fat on meat 😞 They just can’t get over the idea of it.
And I can’t get my mum to get of low fat everything, her mind has been brainwashed! She’s struggled with yo yo-ing all her life. Whereas even with my Hashi’s I’ve been quite even.
I don’t know who invented calories 😩 it seems to be sticking around! And I don’t know why parents think their kids can eat an unlimited amount of fruit, or worse still dried fruit! And it’s soooo hard to get a diluted juice without the ‘no added sugar’ range 😩
As soon as you say "fat on meat" I am transported back to times (for example, but not only, school) where I have been served lumps of fat in something like gravy or a thin layer of batter. Usually pork but, possibly, lamb (or was it mutton?)
I am happy enough that meals have fats in them - but not as those semi-solid squidgy lumps.
meat fat bring's back childhood memories for me too, like whatever was hiding in school dinner 'chicken supreme', and sitting in front of cold lamb fat that i wouldn't eat on my plate for three hours on a sunday afternoon. yuk....... but i love meat fat nowadays. must be a 'grown-up' thing
Well, yer learn summat new every day here don't ya! Porridge Drawers indeed
I've always eaten reaaally slowly, as a child it was really annoying (for everyone else)
But i think it's good, because i then feel full and stop eating when i've had enough ,even if there is food still on my plate. Meanwhile everyone else is on seconds before they realise they are full.
I agree that the loss of food science,cookery, and nutritional education has caused a huge problem in society. At junior school we sat round octagonal tables with a teacher for the server on some tables, and roving dinner ladies for the rest who 'encouraged' you to eat some of everything, and didn't let you have pudding if you didn't. At senior school we had to learn how to plan nutritionally balanced menu's and cook them. I learnt about proteins and essential amino acids etc etc
Armed with this knowledge and freed from children to cook for, i now eat whatever i like , and make sure it kind of balances out over the week. This evening i ate homemade apple crumble for dinner, because i can.
tomorrow i might eat belly pork on it's own, because i'm too lazy to cook anything with it, and sometimes just like the fairy tale about the witches garden i want nothing more than a bowl of fresh steamed greens, and would steal to get them.
I'm with you on the 'buggies' rant helvella, they are as bad for toddlers as TV and sweeties are.
A friend of mine got away with giving her kids little bowls of frozen petit pois as treats for years until someone spoiled it and told the kids they were vegetables.
With a name like Tattybogle it sounds like you have to come from the land of the porridge drawers, as I do. I’ve never seen one either, I’ve heard rumours though. Wonder if the idea dates back to farming communities when people were busy working in the fields all day - can’t see that you could go to a kitchen fitter and ask for your new kitchen to come with a porridge drawer nowadays.
Fifty years ago when I was young and foolish I used to keep an ‘emergency’ packet of cream crackers in an otherwise empty staff room drawer. Then one day I noticed that someone had helped themselves to half of a biscuit. Further investigation found mouse droppings!!! I’d been sharing my emergency crackers with at least one mouse. So who knows who you could be sharing your porridge in a drawer with 😉
I'm not Scottish more's the pity, but a Scot's friend of my parents called me this when i was a new baby, and since there seem to be no photo's until i was about 8 mths old i can only assume i wasn't pretty at first !
I have adopted some Scot's habits though... (i like my porridge with salt and a dash of whisky). It's one of my favourite places in the world, I had a lovely visit to the Appplecross Peninsula a couple of weeks ago on an impulse ...... ie . an impulse to spend September's council tax ,and blood test money on doing something more interesting and eating tender lamb dinners at the Inn !... oops, but i'm not sorry
School, especially boarding school, encouraged wolfing food down. (Not intentionally, but if you ate slowly, you'd delay the whole table from leaving to do whatever they wanted after the meal, you would not get a chance of any seconds, etc.)
Shepherds pie with spring cabbage, carrots, turnip, fresh peas from 'the pod'; braising steak, liver, onions slow cooked in oven for hours until it melted in the mouth served with lots of fresh veg; pork and lamb chops served with lots of fresh veg, beef or pork joint on Sundays with a variety of fresh veg; always fish on Friday. Delicious home made Yorkshire puds with grated onion in them; home made steak pie (thinking about it makes my mouth water). School also cooked delicious fresh meals daily (50+ years ago).
Both parents were fab cooks. Portion sizes were not big just adequate.
For me around 8 fish shop was a go to 5 nights a week.
However, Mum, Dad, myself, siblings never had weight issues, all Healthy.
I loathed the smell of tripe and elder (parents had for breakfast)- hated the smell and the 'in my eyes rubbery look it had). I would have rice krispies even though Bacon, eggs, sausage were 'always frying' - we were told 'rice krispies aren't enough, you need a cooked breakfast' - I ignored that advice as once again 'the smell early Morning' - yuk to me!
'Diets' - had never heard of them back then...
To this day I have Never thought about dieting and never will.
I only eat when hungry, but, eat what I fancy..Albeit, I am a vey slow eater and stop eating when I feel full.
The only time I recall putting any weight on was 10 years ago when periods ceased. Over several Months I noticed clothes etc getting a little tight.
As I rarely got weighed (with exception of being weighed if I had GP/Hospital appmnt, I knew I was usually 9st 10-12lbs - I had gone up to 10st 12lbs, and since then I haven't put any more weight on but fluctuate now between 10st 7 - 10st 10lbs. Height 5ft 5 now as lost a little height due to spine fractures.
Over the past 30+ years I have noted that any fresh meat doesn't taste the same! Even so called good cuts are frequently bland, same goes with 'fresh veg'. No doubt all the 'junk' animals are fed along with antibiotics etc they're given; I find very similar with so called 'organic meats'.....
Fresh veg including potatoes go 'off quickly', whereas in 'the good old days' sacks of potatoes lasted approx 3 Months, carrots, turnip, spring cabbage also lasted some time in the pantry.
I now use mainly frozen veg because of aforementioned. In particular frozen birds eye garden peas, chantennay carrots (delicious), spinach.
The 'mantra' when I was pregnant 40+ years ago was 'you need to eat for 2 now' - I did literally as well as consuming full jars of pickled onions, beetroot.
Sorry going off on a tangent. If foods don't 'disagree with us', why not just eat what we fancy, when we fancy.
Common sense prevails 'we know too much sugar is bad for us'. But, 'low fat anything', usually if not always means added sugar/sweetners.
One size fits all is rubbish, we each are unique individuals and 'one mans 'beef' is another mans poison'.
What a gripping read; I’m tempted to subscribe! I learnt the hard way that there’s no one-size-fits-all “healthy” diet when I discovered that many of my digestive issues were caused by my “healthy”, whole grain food choices. These days, the only “diet” that I would advocate for is a well controlled elimination diet and only for a limited period of time. The idea behind this is that it’s a fairly inexpensive way to find out what works and doesn’t work for your body. Science is never truly conclusive but rather, constantly evolving. This is something that’s totally discounted whenever a narrow stance is taken on nutritional science.
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Have a wonderful Christmas everyone and here's to a happy, healthy and fun New Year!
