DGL (licorice) and Seriphos

[Portia1974]

Does anyone have any experience of using these two supplements to, respectively, boost too low morning cortisol, and suppress too high evening cortisol? Been chatting to someone who's under an FMD and has successfully used this combo to reverse the wonky body clock of adrenal fatigue. Wondered if anyone else had experience of it too?

[humanbean]

DGL Licorice : I've taken DGL licorice for medicinal purposes but it was several years ago and I can't remember why I took it now. I did have to stop taking it though, because my blood pressure went up quite dramatically.

I actually wondered at the time if there were any legally binding production standards for DGL licorice. How much of the glycyrrhizin in the licorice must be removed for it to be allowably described as DGL. I decided there were probably no standards at all because DGL Licorice isn't a prescribed medicine, but I'm only guessing.

Seriphos : I've also taken Seriphos three times. I never got on well with it. The first time I took it I was extremely ill with a non-thyroid-related problem. I was desperate to find a way to get myself better because the doctors were utterly useless. I discovered my cortisol was over the range on three out of four saliva samples, and very high in range in the remaining result. I started the Seriphos and took it for about three or four weeks. It made me feel like I had severe flu on top of my existing health problems. It had one beneficial effect. It improved my life-long insomnia for a short time (probably less than a month). At a later date I tried Seriphos again, for about a week or two each time. I simply couldn't tolerate it for any length of time and it made me feel terrible. I don't know how much my pre-existing illness affected my response to it.

Do you have the results from a cortisol saliva test that you could post? It is far easier to understand what issues you are having if we have some numbers and reference ranges to see.

[Portia1974 in reply to humanbean]

No but I intend to get one done before deciding whether these supplements are appropriate for me. I have only ever had morning cortisol done and each time it has been low but in range. Including one just a fortnight ago. So am fairly decided that the DGL is worth a shot. Especially since I have digestive issues and reflux too. (I think I've read max 1-2% glycyrrhizin as a recommendation). When it comes to Seriphos I'd definitely check my 24 hr cortisol first. (See todays other post). I feel it will be high. But I'd want to check first.

Thanks for sharing your experience!

[humanbean in reply to Portia1974]

If you are going to do a cortisol saliva test in the UK then the companies to choose are Regenerus or Genova Diagnostics UK. Regenerus will deal directly with the public, Genova won't - they send results to Thyroid UK and we have to get them from TUK. Since Regenerus is the easier one to deal with they are the ones to go for in my opinion.

The reason I specified the two companies I have is that their cortisol saliva testing includes a result for DHEA as well as for the four cortisol results. Other companies don't include DHEA, but it's important.

thyroiduk.org.uk/tuk/testin...

thyroiduk.org.uk/tuk/testin...

...

In the specific case of results showing low cortisol at the beginning of the day and high cortisol at the end, the way to deal with this is to increase cortisol output at the start of the day. Over time the body should reduce cortisol output later in the day all by itself. If cortisol is too low at the start of the day the body tries desperately to produce more later in the day, which is why the night time cortisol can become high.

I don't know how good Licorice is for raising cortisol. If I had to do that I would use adrenal glandular or adrenal cortex supplements myself.

[humanbean in reply to Portia1974]

Another reason for choosing Regenerus or Genova is that they use reference ranges with an actual result at the lower limit of the range, rather than using zero as many companies do. Reference ranges are supposed to indicate the results you would expect to get from healthy people. But having zero cortisol at any time is probably only healthy for a corpse. So I don't trust the reference ranges with a lower limit of zero.

[Portia1974 in reply to humanbean]

Thank you. Yes SeasideSusie has tipped me off on that as well 👍I feel like the licorice could be a better option for me as had a bit of a bad experience with cortex supplement. But sounds like it's worth trying the licorice on its own and leaving the night cortisol to take care of itself?

[humanbean in reply to Portia1974]

I can't say whether it is a good idea or not without any results.

The symptoms of low cortisol and high cortisol have a lot of overlap and people make assumptions about their cortisol that turn out to be wrong.

In 2013 I was convinced I had low cortisol, based on symptoms alone. I did a Genova saliva test, sent it off, then went on a two-week holiday. I was so convinced that my cortisol was low that during the two weeks I was away I started taking an adrenal glandular or adrenal cortex product of some kind, to raise my cortisol. It made me feel worse than I already did.

When I got home my results were ready and I discovered that samples 1, 2 and 4 were over the range, and sample 3 was very high in range. So I'd been taking exactly the wrong thing.

So, I would say that you shouldn't take DGL Licorice until you know for certain what your cortisol results actually are.

[Portia1974 in reply to humanbean]

I know my morning cortisol is consistently low in range from several blood tests. I wasn't asking whether you recommend I take it. I was referring to your statement:

"increase cortisol output at the start of the day. Over time the body should reduce cortisol output later in the day all by itself"

I know my cortisol is low. I was more ruminating in the fact that if I just concentrated on that, and did nothing at the end of the day, just let it be, it would eventually come good and balance out anyway. Which seems to be what you are describing in the above statement.

[humanbean in reply to Portia1974]

People do sometimes find that saliva cortisol results and blood cortisol results give different results. The saliva test measures cortisol on its own i.e. free or unbound cortisol, whereas blood cortisol measures (mostly) cortisol bound to transport proteins, and a tiny smidgen of free cortisol of the type found in saliva. (The cortisol levels in blood are many, many times higher than in saliva, which is why people shouldn't do saliva testing for cortisol with bleeding gums or any other contaminant containing blood.)

Without saliva testing results I'm not prepared to commit myself as to the likely outcome of using licorice to raise your cortisol early in the day, and the effect it might have later in the day.

[Reykua]

This is sooooo interesting.

I've been taking DGL Licorice Root for my IBS. I had no idea it had other uses.

Thank you so much for this very late education.

Is it possible that my use of DGL could impact my thyroid readings?

Totally fascinating!!!

[Portia1974 in reply to Reykua]

It's all fascinating stuff isn't it?! Does it help your ibs out of interest? When it comes to thyroid tests I dont know I'm afraid as only just learnt about its existence so no expert. What I have gleaned is that it can help elevate cortisol. So a) I wouldn't take it at night as that's the wrong time to have elevated cortisol if you want to go to sleep and b) idk if cortisol levels are linked to thyroid hormones and therefore whether that affects thyroid results.

It would impact on any cortisol testing though I should think.

[Reykua in reply to Portia1974]

Thank you so much.

Loads of reading and research to do, so little time today.

It explains so much - especially struggling to sleep at night when I'd chew one of the tablets to settle my stomach!

Hope you get the answers you're looking for after answering some of mine.

Have a great day and thanks again.

[Portia1974 in reply to Reykua]

Gotta love when you find a piece of the puzzle! Yay!