Missing outer third of eyebrow. Endocrinologist disagrees that it is a symptom of hypothyroidism.

[AlisonL]

I have just come home after an absolute disaster of an appointment with an endocrinologist. I went with my neighbour, who is in her mid 70s and diagnosed hypo a couple of years ago. She is only taking 50mcg of thyroxine per day and has been very unwell over the last few months. I am pretty sure most of this is due to being undermedicated. She has the classic signs - always cold, hoarse voice, extreme fatigue, and is missing the outer third of her eyebrows, among other things.

Her GP tried to fob her off with antidepressants, but after going through the pain of being ignored for years myself, I convinced her that wasn't right. We managed to get the GP to agree to an appointment for her with an endo, which took place today.

I have never met such a patronising doctor in my life, and I have been through a fair few before I managed to sort out my own thyroid health. He was appalling. He wouldn't entertain the idea that her symptoms were in any way thyroid related and actually shouted "I will not speak about this any further. Her thyroid is perfect. I am an endocrinologist!". I knew there was no point trying within the first minute of the appointment, so the search to find a different doctor for her continues. (He is a diabetes specialist, which I know is no surprise).

One of the many things he said which I did not agree with was that a missing outer third of eyebrow is not a symptom of hypothyroidism "any more". He said this is outdated advice, and I was wrong to think it was relevant. He also said supplementing Vitamin D is a waste of time and there is no evidence that it has any benefit.

It just makes me so angry, and I suppose I just wanted to write this all down to share with people who understand my frustration. Just out of interest, has anyone else ever been advised that the eyebrow thing is not a symptom? I was hoping that he would take notice of this one as it's a physical sign that can't be ignored, but sadly not.

Thanks for reading. I feel better just for writing it all down x

[greygoose]

That is appalling! A doctor who shouts as his patients shouldn't be tolerated, and your friend should write a letter of complaint to his superiors.

It is a symptom, and I have it, but I've never discussed it with a doctor because I know they know nothing about symptoms. It's just not worth the hassle. The only symptom they ever took any notice of with me was weight-gain - and most GPs/endos deny that that is a symptom, too! So, I've just kept quite on that front and concentrated on my blood test results.

Sorry you had to go through that, but thank god you were there! Imagine what he would have been like to your friend had she been alone.

[AlisonL in reply to greygoose]

Thank you. He really was awful and was trying to blame everything on her age. She's feeling so unwell at the moment she doesn't have a lot of fight in her, but I won't be giving up. Sadly it's the usual story of her TSH being in range (2.1), so he wouldn't entertain that there was any room for improvement. They've never tested FT3, again no surprise there. We were hoping that going armed with the Thyroid UK symptom list would help her cause, but I knew there was no hope as soon as he shut me down when I dared to mention her thyroid. Sigh.

[Hidden in reply to AlisonL]

That sounds awful. So if she's already diagnosed and on levo it's weird that her GP doesnt accept 50mcg isn't sufficient to manage her symptoms and just try an increase in her levo...? She still has plenty of wiggle room for a lower TSH. Do you think it's because she's an older woman that her experience is dismissed?

Mike

[greygoose in reply to Hidden]

Older + woman + thyroid + pig-headed endos = a lethal combination.

[MissGrace in reply to AlisonL]

It makes me so angry to read the stories on here of the way thyroid patients are treated with such utter contempt by ignorant ‘experts’.

I also have the missing third of the eyebrow (only on one side, which looks even more stupid.) The comment about Vitamin D is so ridiculous I would have laughed out loud if I’d been there. Why do they test to see if it is deficient if supplementing makes no difference? Do they just test and then say ‘sorry you’re deficient, but there’s f*ck all anyone can do about it’? He is a clown.

You really must contact PALS and complain about this endo’s (I use the term loosely) attitude. It seems like your friend will be best placed getting some medichecks blood tests to have a look at T3, getting all her test results from the GP to see where she is in the range and using the information on this site to inform her treatment.

I’m sorry your friend has had to go through this. At least she has you to support and help. Many people end up lost after facing something like this. I’m sad for your friend and raging angry about this pompous idiot. I’ll end with a quote from Shakespeare’s ‘Measure for Measure’ that always comes to mind in these situations. How I’d love to say this to the man himself!

‘But man, proud man,

Dress'd in a little brief authority,

Most ignorant of what he's most assur’d

His glassy essence—like an angry ape

Plays such fantastic tricks before high heaven

As makes the angels weep; who, with our spleens,

Would all themselves laugh mortal.’

🤸🏿‍♀️🥛

[humanbean in reply to MissGrace]

I think this is the first time I've read a Shakespeare quote on this forum. It is amazingly appropriate under the circumstances, thank you!

[AlisonL in reply to MissGrace]

That quote is perfect. I'm still raging thinking about it now and the fact that some of the things he said were just blatant lies (like the Vitamin D thing). He is an absolutely awful man.

[greygoose in reply to AlisonL]

Well, don't let him get away with it. Do what you can to get her to complain - write the letter yourself, if you have to, and just get her to sign. I'm over 70 - 74, in fact - and I'd like to see some doctor try and blame things on my age! I would not be at all happy with a TSH of over two.

[AlisonL in reply to greygoose]

Thanks everyone. It makes me really angry too and rest assured I will be making a complaint. I was absolutely stunned at some of the things he said that were just plain wrong. I did wonder if the fact she was an older woman had made things worse, and I'm sure it didn't help, but he had such a sense of his own self importance I don't know if anyone else would have fared any better.

I was hoping my friend might have at least been able to try an increased levo dose before going down the self testing route, but am doubtful now. She's very scared to go against her GPs wishes unfortunately. I did suggest she tried adding an extra 25mcg to get dose to see how she felt, but she is too anxious to do that. And now this pr1ck has shattered her confidence even further.

It's just good to know you all understand too and fear not, I will not rest until she's sorted out!

[Nico101 in reply to greygoose]

I agree, a complaint should be made. This patronising git should remember we pay his wages and if he knew all there was to know about endocrinology there would be no more sick patients after they had been treated by him.

[greygoose in reply to Nico101]

Well said!

[AlisonL in reply to greygoose]

I second that!

[Flecmac]

Sounds like the first nhs endocrinologist I had the misfortune to meet!!!

[AlisonL in reply to Flecmac]

Scary how many of them around there are 🙁

[pennyannie in reply to AlisonL]

Hello Alison

What a good friend you have been to this lady and how upset you both must be feeling because of this ignorant man.

It's disgusting, but sadly your post isn't the first and will not be the last regarding these " jumped up " so called medical professionals.

Many of us have been there ourselves, and if you can, a complaint letter might, at least, result in the idiot into bought into line for his inability to relate like a human being.

I do believe I read somewhere that Levothyroxine is recommended to be reduced down when patients reach a certain age, though I can't remember the facts, and just thought how stupid, and moved on with my own research.

I have Graves Disease and post RAI became hypothyroid, and I have had my eyebrows tattooed back on. I am also self medicating and getting better giving myself sufficient thyroid hormone despite my 72 years.

[AlisonL in reply to pennyannie]

Thank you. I am glad to hear you've managed to help yourself and applaud you for doing so. It is so sad there are so many stories like this isn't it? I'm going to show this thread to my friend tomorrow and I'm sure she will be reassured to know she is not alone and that she has other options.

[Marz in reply to AlisonL]

I'm almost 73 and self-medicating 😊

[SlowDragon Administrator]

Well done for standing up and supporting your friend

Your next step is to organise FULL Thyroid and vitamin testing for her privately

Or have you got test results already?

Does she have low vitamin D?

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/286...

Vitamin D deficiency is frequent in Hashimoto's thyroiditis and treatment of patients with this condition with Vitamin D may slow down the course of development of hypothyroidism and also decrease cardiovascular risks in these patients. Vitamin D measurement and replacement may be critical in these patients.

endocrine-abstracts.org/ea/...

Evidence of a link between increased level of antithyroid antibodies in hypothyroid patients with HT and 25OHD3 deficiency may suggest that this group is particularly prone to the vitamin D deficiency and can benefit from its alignment.

TSH, FT4 and FT3 plus both TPO and TG thyroid antibodies tested. Also important to test vitamin D, folate, ferritin and B12

Low vitamin levels are extremely common, especially if Thyroid antibodies are raised

Recommended on here that all thyroid blood tests should ideally be done as early as possible in morning and fasting. This gives highest TSH, lowest FT4 and most consistent results. (Patient to patient tip, best not mentioned to GP or phlebotomist)

Last Levothyroxine dose should be 24 hours prior to test, (taking delayed dose immediately after blood draw).

Meanwhile email Dionne at Thyroid Uk for list of recommended thyroid specialists

My endo admitted loss of outer eyebrows was common when hypothyroid

[AlisonL in reply to SlowDragon]

Thanks, I've been through it all myself so luckily am aware of what we need to do. She's just a bit nervous about it all, so was hoping we might get a sympathetic doctor she could work with. Sadly that wasn't the case!

[MissOphelia]

I’m so sorry that happened today, the man sounds like he has a terrible God complex!

I can honestly say for me my outer eyebrows falling out again was my definitive indicator that my thyroid was going off kilter after being stable for a while. The eyebrow loss happened a good few months before my blood results showed anything up. I remember having a normal blood result before it showed up and ringing my mum & saying my bloods are lying my eyebrows are telling a different story!!

It definitely is a symptom I’ve noticed over the years.

I really hope your friend manages to get some help I’m so sorry you both went through that

xx

[AlisonL in reply to MissOphelia]

Thank you. If only he was a bit more willing to listen I could let him know about all the people on here who have backed us up! There would be no chance with him though.

[Nico101 in reply to MissOphelia]

Same here with the eyebrows - and the rest of them stop growing. I used to trim them but for a while there has been no need. and my eyelashes are only about 5 mm long.

[MissOphelia in reply to Nico101]

Same, I’m looking to get them tattooed on when I can afford it, they make me look so unwell being so patchy

[Nico101 in reply to MissOphelia]

I looked into this last year - it's bloody expensive. also, my eyebrows are blond, so I'm worried about colour.

[MissOphelia in reply to Nico101]

Mine are dark and the colour is a bit worrying isn’t it, I worry they’ll look really black! I’ve been wanting to do it for years but as you say it’s so expensive!!

[AlisonL in reply to Nico101]

How on earth this fool of a doctor can say it isn't a symptom is beyond me.

[Nico101 in reply to AlisonL]

I know. It's a classic symptom.

[AlisonL]

I most definitely will be doing

[TSH110]

He is the waste of time and he is wrong

[Milpol]

Alison L , not only have I lost most of my eyebrows to thyroid disease, but most of hair on my head and body. It has got worse since being on Levothyroxine which is why I’m thinking of switching to NDT to see if it helps at all ! So yes, a very real symptom of this problem 😢

[AlisonL in reply to Milpol]

Thanks for your reply, and sorry to hear you're going through all that too. It's such an awful thing. I've been very lucky that my hair hasn't been too badly affected by my thyroid disease, but can imagine it is quite distressing.

[silverfox7]

I'm just watching Dr Finlay! Nothing thyroid related but bags of common sense and compassion!

[Yammie1973]

Oh wow, just realised reading through the posts that my mum in her middle to late 70's also has partial missing eyebrows. (which she is quite stressed about)She is currently on 100mcg's of T4 only. Am thinking about getting her bloods check by Medichecks, a DI02gene test and all the vits checked as well. It's never too late to feel 100% better than S.H.1.T!! She is also beginning stage 2 of Alzheimer's. She has a somewhat pro active GP but it may well be worth testing the waters on just how keyed up he is on Thyroid issues????

[humanbean in reply to Yammie1973]

Be aware that there have been moves in the UK to reduce the amount of thyroid medication provided to the elderly. They are doing this partly by refusing to diagnose hypothyroidism at all. There have even been suggestions that no treatment should be given until TSH > 20. It doesn't have the force of guidelines (yet) but somebody did write a post on here where TSH > 20 was quoted at them by a GP, within a week of the article appearing in the BMJ. (Unfortunately I've never been able to find that post again since I read it.)

bmj.com/content/365/bmj.l2006

Have you had your mother's vitamin B12, folate, vitamin D and ferritin/iron tested? Vitamin B12 deficiency can be mistaken for dementia in the elderly. And if your mother is anaemic that could cause all sorts of brain fog and thinking difficulties too.

[Yammie1973 in reply to humanbean]

Hi humanbean

I have her on a great deal of vitamins and minerals, the same ones I take for my underactive thyroid, I think that she is covered as far as those are concerned. Her GP has given her the same meds for years without even bothering to re test every year...boy is he in for a shock!! by the time I get finished with him!!

[guysgrams]

Too bad he is an endo, he needs to go back to school. He must have been absent the day they taught the class on the disease!