Hypothyroid and Depression/etc

[Niki345]

Just come from a second opinion from GP and he won't refer me and said I have mental health issues. I've been off levythyroxine since Dec on the guidance of a (different) GP at the same surgery and my blood tests are "borderline". I know I am suffering heart rate issues, low mood, aches and brain fog but cannot get anyone to help since a GP at a surgery in another city mentioned my T3 was what the problem was. I'm so frustrated and upset I cant talk properly.

[SlowDragon Administrator]

Can you add your results from when on Levothyroxine. Why was Levo stopped

What are results now

For full Thyroid evaluation you need TSH, FT4, TT4, FT3 plus TPO and TG thyroid antibodies. Plus vitamin D, folate, ferritin and B12.

Essential to test thyroid antibodies, FT3 and FT4 plus vitamins

Private tests are available. NHS often refuses to test FT3 or antibodies

thyroiduk.org.uk/tuk/testin...

Medichecks Thyroid plus ultra vitamin or Blue Horizon Thyroid plus eleven are the most popular choice. DIY finger prick test or option to pay extra for private blood draw. Both companies often have money off offers.

All thyroid tests should ideally be done as early as possible in morning and fasting. This gives highest TSH, lowest FT4 and most consistent results. (Patient to patient tip, GP will be unaware)

If antibodies are high this is Hashimoto's, (also known by medics here in UK more commonly as autoimmune thyroid disease).

About 90% of all hypothyroidism in Uk is due to Hashimoto's

It's very common for untreated, or under treated Hashimoto's to be mis diagnosed as anxiety, depression, generalised anxiety disorder or similar

Getting full testing is essential to reveal underlying low vitamin levels or deficiencies as well as high antibodies and/or low FT3

[Niki345 in reply to SlowDragon]

This GP has never discussed the numbers with me. I started on 100mg of levythyroxine but had heart palptations and then it decreased to 75mg but I've since found out I need a T3 heavy tablet but cant get heard to even talk about it. I get flustered and start crying when they refuse to help because I don't know what to say?

[trelemorele in reply to Niki345]

You're not the only one they don't listen to.

I'm and plenty of others are in the same boat as you.

Same as you, I would also get very emotional at doctors when I was under medicated and hypo and felt helpless.

You either change to another doctor or star self medicating. That's really only two choices you have.

[Niki345 in reply to trelemorele]

I'm in the process of changing doctors @trelemorele and whilst I'm not going to hold my breath, I'm hoping for a clean slate so I can get some help at a basic level. Its clear to me reading these pages that I need to educate myself to help myself and use the system where and when I can. All the while I am sapped in energy and the low moods continue with loss of work time and subsequent issues this will no doubt cause.

[SeasideSusie Remembering]

Why are you off your Levo?

Were you originally diagnosed with hypothyroidism? If so you aren't hyperthyroid as per your thread title. You can't suddenly change from hypo to hyper, it's not possible.

Can you post your latest test results, with reference ranges, for members to comment. Also say if you have had thyroid antibodies tested and whether they were raised.

If you've had vitamins and minerals tested please post those results/ranges too and say if you are supplementing and the dose:

Vit D

B12

Folate

Ferritin

And maybe

Iron panel

Full blood count

[Niki345 in reply to SeasideSusie]

I don't have any of these. They aren't shared with me by my GP.

I have hypothyroid and am struggling to come to terms with the language so forgive me as a newbie. Current GP asked me to stp taking tablets for blood test but it wasn't offered as a fasting blood as they felt I didn't need them. Gradually experiencing worse issues which I feel are related but cannot get them doctor to listen.

[ShinyB in reply to Niki345]

I'm sorry you are feeling so awful.

I think your first step is to ask your GP surgery for a print out of all your test results. You are legally entitled to have a copy. Some surgeries will charge you, but many will do it free of charge. If they do insist on charging you an admin fee the maximum they can charge is £10. Ring them up and ask for them and arrange a time to go in to get them.

Then post your results, including any ranges, and then people here will be able to advise you better.

Try not to worry, and focus on one step at a time. It's very difficult when you have brain fog and feel overwhelmed. Just focus on this one step for now.

[SeasideSusie Remembering in reply to Niki345]

In the UK we are legally entitled to our test results, so just pop along to the surgery and ask for a print out. Don't accept hand written or verbal results, mistakes can happen, it must be a print out.

The advice given here about fasting for blood tests and having an early morning blood draw are patient to patient tips, we don't discuss them with doctors or phlebotomists because most wouldn't agree. Some do but they in the minority so it's just not worth discussing.

If the GP said to stop taking your Levo for the blood test, why didn't you start taking it again immediately afterwards? I doubt he meant stop taking them altogether, just for the actual test.

"I've since found out I need a T3 heavy tablet"

How do you know you need T3, surely you must have some test results to say that, and what do you mean by a T3 heavy tablet?

[Niki345 in reply to SeasideSusie]

I was told by a previous GP before I moved to this area that my T3 was what was deficient, and has contributed greatly to low moods and other symptoms I have had (aching limbs, weight fluctuation, dry skin, hair thinning). I've seen online (whether this is true or not I don't know so bear with me) that a tablet with more T3 active elements is available but I fully realise NHS wont have this or probably fund it. Not being a chemist or science person, I don't truly understand it, but have started researching and hence joined this forum.

The results came back after the first draw as 'normal' which I imagine they would as the levy was still in my system and the initial GP I saw (its always different) did not prescribe me anything. And so it went on. Then the bloods after that changed slightly but she still would not prescribe me levy. I was however asked if I wanted anti-depressants.

[SlowDragon Administrator]

UK GP practices are supposed to offer online access for blood test results. Ring and ask if this is available and apply to do so if possible, if it is you may need enhanced access to see blood results.

In reality many GP surgeries do not have blood test results online yet

Alternatively ring receptionist and request printed copies of results. Allow couple of days and then go and pick up. They can make nominal charge for printing but many will do so for free (£10 max)

Although morning fasting test is ideal, any testing is better than nothing

[Niki345 in reply to SlowDragon]

SlowDragon I asked to join this months ago and only when I asked before this very appointment did I get given them, I am now changing GP practices to see if I can start afresh and get some help. In each blood test, I have never been asked to fast either. But as I mentioned below, these are General Practitioners, not specialists. I asked to be referred to a specialist to see if I did in fact need to take levy or whether there was something else I could do to help myself; this was outright refused.

[Rapunzel]

If you started on 100mcg of levo it's no wonder you had heart problems. Levo has to be started low - typically 50mcg then test again in 6 weeks and gradually increased until patient feels well /TSH at 1 or less

SeasideSusie dust off the award for clueless GP tw*t of the week...we got another live one.

[Niki345 in reply to Rapunzel]

I could cry reading some of your replies, it makes me feel less of a freak and more like I am being understood. You guys are fabulous. I've registered with a different GP but I'm not going to hold my breath.....

[shaws Administrator]

We do not want doctors who have an attitude such as the one you saw.

It sounds as if you cannot convert levothyroxine (T4) into sufficient T3.

T4 is inactive and has to convert to T3. T3 being the only active thyroid hormone needed in our millions of T3 receptor cells and our brain and heart have the most.

You can source your own T3 but you'd have to put up another post asking for a private message to be sent to you of where to source. No information is permitted on the open Forum of where to source prescription meds.

We seem to get on much better when doctor is out of the picture. Get our own blood tests and post info for members to comment. Always get a print-out of your results and make sure your ranges are also stated.

Our heart struggles if we don't have sufficient thyroid hormones and our brain and muscles/joints need thyroid hormones as well.

You should get a blood test every six weeks initially, with a rise in levothyroxine. Blood tests have to be at the very earliest, fasting (you can drink water) and allow a gap of 24 hours between last dose of T4 or T3 and take afterwards.

GP should also test B12, Vit D, iron, ferritin and folate as deficiences also cause symptoms.

[Niki345 in reply to shaws]

@shaws this is excellent help. And yes, I have now changed doctors though I won't hold my breath. A former GP identified it was T3 I was deficient in and this was what has contributed (quite considerably) to my low moods. I will ask for a print out of my results at the new GP and see how this goes but your information is indeed very helpful and makes me feel less like a freak that this GP has made me feel like.

[Jump1]

Why is the gp saying you have mental health issues

[crimple in reply to Jump1]

That's how they deal with Thyroidies that they perceive to be a nuisance!

[Churchy12 in reply to crimple]

I completely agree I went to get a second opinion yesterday on my latest results....

TSH 5.48

T4 12.8

Antibodies 1300

I was told by the GP this is fine I should not be on Thyroxine and that it was psychological and to carry on with my CBT

[Niki345 in reply to Churchy12]

But GP's are GENERAL practitioners, they have no actual field of expertise. They help us find out why we are feeling so unwell and send us on to someone who can help surely???? I'm now off sick for the second time in a week and no doubt will be hauled before an enquiry but I just cannot face work.

[Niki345 in reply to Jump1]

Because I have a history of low mood/depression. I actually had reactive depression after being threatened by a person I was helping which is when it all came to a head for me but some 2-3 years after this, a GP in a different practice diagnosed me, sat and explained the T3 and T4 and that I was T3 deficient and prescribed levythyroxine within the first appointment. Now I cant even get them to do a blood test which distinguishes between T3 and T4 because "that's not what they do".

[Espisnowwoman]

What kind of heart issues r u having?

[Niki345 in reply to Espisnowwoman]

Heart palpitations, severe low mood, appetite loss and coldness in hands and feet. I have rapidly thinning hair and weight gain despite the appetite loss. I'm off work again as well now, I have zero energy and have legs that feel like they ran a marathon last night.

[Niki345]

I am just so frustrated Hidden because a previous GP even broke it down to explain about T3 and T4, but this GP cannot even do a blood test to distinguish the two!!! Because I have a history with anti-depressants, its been looked upon as exactly that. But either I have an issue or I don't and I asked for a referral to look into it which again, he refused. Plus he stated he didn't want to undermine what his colleague had written about me in her notes.

[Churchy12]

I decided to go away and be pro-active as the GP I saw upset me so much and made me feel like I was going mad,so on the advice of people on this website my lovely son paid for me to go and have private blood tests through Medichecks I’m having the full thyroid check plus all the vitamins as I want to get to the bottom of my symptoms once and for all, I’m then going to take the results back to the GP and see what they have to say.

[Espisnowwoman]

No energy comes with any auto immune disease because its in the blood. Have ur doctor run a full blood count.

[SlowDragon Administrator]

For full Thyroid evaluation you need TSH, FT4, TT4, FT3 plus TPO and TG thyroid antibodies. Plus vitamin D, folate, ferritin and B12.

Essential to test thyroid antibodies, FT3 and FT4 plus vitamins

Private tests are available. Thousands on here forced to do this as NHS often refuses to test FT3 or antibodies

thyroiduk.org.uk/tuk/testin...

Medichecks Thyroid plus ultra vitamin or Blue Horizon Thyroid plus eleven are the most popular choice. DIY finger prick test or option to pay extra for private blood draw. Both companies often have money off offers.

All thyroid tests should ideally be done as early as possible in morning and fasting. This gives highest TSH, lowest FT4 and most consistent results. (Patient to patient tip, GP will be unaware)

If antibodies are high this is Hashimoto's, (also known by medics here in UK more commonly as autoimmune thyroid disease).

About 90% of all hypothyroidism in Uk is due to Hashimoto's

Most patients start on 50mcg of Levothyroxine. But some find even that too much too soon and may need 25mcg daily or even 12.5mcg daily. Dose increases should be in 25mcg steps (maximum) sometimes even slower, until TSH is around one and FT4 towards top of range and FT3 at least half way in range. Testing 6-8 weeks after each dose increase

Come back with new post once you have copy of your last results