In my idle moments I was browsing around and came across Livestrong.com where it states many false ideas, including that B12 is not excreted in urine, too much can give you HEART ATTACK, and a few others.
I have pointed them here and asked them to correct their information, but I don't suppose they will. I just wanted to warn anyone interested that there's a lot of misinformation out there.
That brings me to what I was searching for....
I've had very high blood pressure for a long while, several years, in fact. Until NHS stopped my 8-weekly injections and I started my own research I assumed, as I had been told, that it was age-related.
I have increased my dosage to 1500 micrograms twice-weekly and have found my blood pressure going from typical 170/94, peak 210/100, to a fairly consistent 128/68.
Too soon to claim permanence, though hopefully it is, but that's a rather dramatic effect and hadn't known of a connection with B12, though nothing else has changed to explain it. Just wondering if anyone had experienced anything similar?
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tomdickharry
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I had not heard of a blood pressure connection. Thank you for sharing. Good to know. I am not surprised as blood pressure is controlled by the neurological system.
I also have not heard that some believe that B12 is not excreted in the urine and can be toxic. I do know the retention times from testing are not as conclusive as is often quoted and no testing seems to be done on those who have or are experiencing B12 deficiency.
I also know that what happens from injection to urination is not the same in all bodies and not completely understood.
I know my body reacts favorably to injections 4- 6 hours apart and unfavorably if longer than 8 hours.
Nice one, Wizard. Our old favourite Schilling tests relied upon measurement of urinary excretion of radiolabelled B12 to prove or disprove that the B12 had crossed the intestinal epithelium and entered the bloodstream, and thence to the kidneys, because we had blocked the transcobalamins by giving a 'cold' B12 injection at the start of the process.
A 24 hour urine sample was required, as the peak excretion was difficult to predict. Likewise, the non-absorbed [labelled] B12 was excreted faecally, and this could be shown by counting the radiolabel there too, although that wasn't part of the process.
There's lots of stuff on the web. Some of it's useful, and then there's the rest. Take care!
I am familiar with the "obsolete" Schilling test. Abandoned due to the risks.
In at least part of the USA the blood smear is being abandoned as other tests make them obsolete. However the reality is a blood smear is not profitable for the hematologist and the hematologist do not want a technician performing that work as it diminishes their perceived status. According to my evaluation.
You're not far off, mate! The Schilling test went due to a variety of things, including the incorporation of animal-sourced Intrinsic Factor, and the 'horror' of radioactivity. But as a test, it worked.
As for the blood film, well, terminology rules. The description as a 'smear' is somewhat derogatory! A well-spread, well-stained film still has things to reveal that other tests don't quite get. The adoption of 'Digital Morphology' is only half the battle, but the availability of good quality microscopic analysis is possibly more of an issue. Like nostalgia, 'things ain't what they used to be'!
You are correct that a well executed blood smear can reveal information that has value. Just not to the physician's current flow chart. In the USA.
There is now what is called a blood smear review where a technician not a hematologist performs the blood smear and if they see anything a blood smear is again done by a hematologist.
Once upon a time, we had a cadre of staff who were referred to as 'technicians' and that eventually became a pejorative term, and the cadre [providing they were qualified] became Biomedical Scientists. Many with first and second level degrees, and some with PhDs. More and more specialised, and with more detailed knowledge and skills than the medical folks. It soon became obvious that the hematologist wasn't generally adding much to the report on the Romanowsky-stained blood film. We accepted the restrictions of one another's area, and the blood film became a primary source, although it became secondary to the numerical stuff the analysers produced.
I wouldn't want a diagnosis in Haematology without the blood film report of a competent scientist. Or a competent technician; a good doctor is in effect a technician too.
In 2019 my blood pressure suddenly started to rise and I ended up with heart failure ! My heamatologist had prescribed me folic acid prior to this. In 2020 I were diagnosed with a low B12 and have since wondered if it were all related.
From what I have read a low B12 would cause a low blood pressure which is the opposite of my assumption. A low vit D on the other hand can increase the risk of heart disease which seems more feasible seeing as I suffer from Hypoparathyroidism. But having said that I have been prescribed vit D3 for the condition for many years. It was a year or so before the diagnosis of a low B12 that my BP started to rise. it had been pretty stable up until then.
I also need to mention my thyroid at the time was being 'very over medicated' which could have added to my issues and also my heart failure.
I am now prescribed diuretics ( which cause other unwanted problems ) but my BP is now in range. I definitely pee out excess B12 that my body does not use. There are many on here who inject more than once a day myself included. If anything my heart condition has improved albeit I have a slightly enlarged aorta but that could be due to my sticky blood - APS.
I am a little like Wizard and simply do what makes me feel better and helps with my mobility and stamina, without B12 I would be bed ridden.
There is a lot of false information and scare mongering out there but hope others find the link informative.
I was diagnosed with very high blood pressure around 2015. I always had suffered from low blood pressure so it was quite odd. I was put on medication and controlled. I then was diagnosed with low vitamin B12 and commenced on eight weekly injections. I still take a very low dosage of my BP medication but often my BP is very low. My GP was in two minds to take me off it at last visit. I definitely think my high blood pressure was related to my low Vit B12.
I totally agree - and to all patients that are wary of what is good or not good and refer to the NHS expertise. Occasionally, attitudes by doctors can be negative.
In the late 2014 and the beginning of 2015, my Locum doctor said that my vitamin b12 level was far too low, and did point out that I should be introduced to vitamin b12. Instead, I had a stroke.
As it happens, my doctor did not refer to my level of vitamin b12 was again far to low. After the stroke, I went back to my doctor- who did not recognise that my vitamin b12 level was still far too low - and in order to sustain a good beneficial and healthy life style. Again it was through the Locum doctor's knowledge, that I received vitamin b12 injections - which enabled me to better my health conditions and to live my life with normality
To this day, for patients, its worth asking for any appropriate blood reading assessment - which can be helpful
Months ago you expressed if feels like you need B12 drip drip drip. That was one of the many reasons I did trials of increased frequency to good success.
Although I inject 2ml daily I still feel the need for more. Due to my having Sjogrens and very sensitive skin I am not able to inject more frequently. I also have APs which is sticky clotting blood so tend to bruise easily and have to be a bit cautious. I most certainly dont want to cause a clot.
I have an ultra sound scan on the 22nd to look at my anterior abdominal wall, I have already had a MRI but doubt if I will get the results until after Xmas.
A recent bout of covid caught whilst at the hospital didn't help my situation.
If it works for you keep doing what your doing and enjoy life.
Lots of us report low blood pressure but I don't think you can go too much on it - there's no regularity of reporting or collecting the information.
Obviously it would stand to reason that if your body gets the vitamins and minerals it needs, it will work better.
Quite often one of the only ways we can tell that an animal is ill rather than just apathetic, is heart rate and blood pressure, especially if it's not got a temperature, indicating an infection.
Yes, I have. Consistent EOD SI has lowered my BP to the mid one twenties and 70s from 150-60 and 80-90 in about a year (good for a 73 year old). This was an unexpected consequence of adequate B12. My BP was elevated for a matter of years, I think now as my B12 declined and my liver store depleted. If I hadn't been diagnosed with PA I would probably be taking BP meds by now. Although no one seemed particularly concerned at the time.
The PA/B12D story just keeps on getting worse as the condition continues to be neglected and misunderstood by the medical establishment. The collateral damage of this is immense.
Hello, mental note to self not to use Livestrong site, thank you
Before diagnosis my blood pressures was worryingly continuing to rise. SI. I noticed my pulse was 15 beats per second lower. Whenever stressed a racing heartbeat is one of the symptoms to reappear.
If the only source of B12 is food or supplements then, because of the very low absorption, B12 is excreted in faeces, not urine. But in the case of injections, excess is excreted in urine.
The change in blood pressure with injections frequency is interesting, the link from Jillymo above at b12d.org gives good information on a blood pressure/B12 link.
Thanks for that. I have often wondered about B12 in stools. Good to know it is thought that excess B12 is excreted in urine. Based of course on current understanding which does not test anything other the EOD. If that.
Livestrong, even with its claims of article reviews by experts, etc., is chock full of misleading information - if not downright wrong.
Some contributors try very hard. I have read some good articles. But simply can't be bothered to wade through it all.
One example:
Vitamin A and Your Thyroid
Vitamin A is another nutrient that's been shown to play critical roles in your thyroid health. According to an August 2012 report published in the Journal of the American College of Nutrition, vitamin A helps regulate the metabolism of thyroid hormones by shutting off the production and release of TSH, when necessary. The report notes that women who were given vitamin A experienced lower TSH levels in their blood.
To keep your thyroid functioning normal, it's important to meet your daily vitamin A needs, which are 700 micrograms per day for women and 900 micrograms daily for men. Fruits and vegetables that are rich in vitamin A include:
None of them contain vitamin A. All contain beta-carotene which, in healthy people, can be converted into vitamin A. That conversion process is well documented to be impaired in hypothyroidism. Hence consuming more beta-carotene often does not enhance vitamin A. But it can make your skin go yellow/orange!
So some truth but inappropriate in precisely the circumstances claimed to be the target of the article!
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