Hi Everyone. I was wondering if any other members find they are experiencing any symptoms of Severe Clinical Depression. I appreciate people’s reluctance to talk about mental illness. Mainly because sadly, it carries a stigma in general society. Basically their attitude is if you can’t see it then it doesn’t exist. My own 25 year long struggle appeared around the time I was diagnosed with P A. my low levels of B12 coincided with low self esteem, and a feeling of being worthless.
I don’t mind revealing there have been several occasions when there seems no point in carrying on.
Below is a poem I wrote to try to explain to a psychologist what was going on inside my mind, I have seen other posts referring to brain fog amongst other symptoms relating to a lack of B12. It made me wonder if the two illnesses were linked. In the verse I’m trying to make my thoughts which can’t be seen become tangible.
“ Dying Deep Inside “
Help I feel so lonely
confused in disarray
How can I face tomorrow
when I feel like this today
Darkness always finds me
pervasive thoughts reside
Friends just see a smiling face
though I’m dying deep inside
Depression always finds me
controls my inner voice
Believe me when I tell you
it’s not a companion of choice
Why does it always find me
will this torture never end
I can’t continue forever
when fears my only friend
Why won’t it take a holiday
my mind just needs a break
Allow one day of freedom
so I can enjoy being awake.
It’s a never ending journey
maybe it’s too much to ask
When it’s shrouded in ambiguity
It’s a thankless lonely task.
I sincerely hopes revealing my own experiences
will help others understand they are not alone.
Blessings.
Varna1968.
Written by
Varna1968
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Thank you for confiding in us . I hope that it has helped you .
One can get depressed if one doesn’t get sufficient treatment for P.A. and because of the general ignorance of doctors about the condition . But ofcourse they can be totally unrelated also .
Maybe you need more regular B12 injections? It’s something worthy of consideration . There is no danger of overdosing Vitamin B12,. Most of us on this forum self-inject . If you would like to try this just ask us for information on how to go about it .
I’m really sorry for what you are going through , so well-expressed in your poem . Very best wishes .
Hi Nackapan. As you suggested I will increase my b12 injections. I only take them every two months. My post was to confirm through this forum that the two conditions can co exist. Hopefully, I have a chance of experiencing some relief.
Sorry you feel so bad, your poem is wonderfully written and is touching. I know PA or low B12 can cause depression it is happening to my brother. He tried to take his own life. The pain meds he takes for his Multiple Sclerosis also have depression as a side effect. The GPs have been hopeless and he has opted out of seeing anyone calling them F**** quacks. So you must take the others advice and perhaps more aggressive treatment taking many more jabs of B12 will help to let you out of your dark tunnel. The advice from the more experienced folk on here is always excellent. Good luck 😎
This is wonderful coincidence today. My son sent me his beautiful poems and your poem made me cry with the sadness and joy. You are not alone. I will send my son your poem and if you like to get his email please let me know. You are such a similar beautiful people. Greatly appreciate your kind sharing with us. ..."Every conversation must begin with the awareness of the severe limitations inherent in our language and thought. Not only are we at the very best only partially right about anything. We are also severely constrained in our expression and mutual comprehension of whatever we think we might know. Thinking and speaking is an effort to find each other in the dark, separated by infinite labyrinths of the unthinkable and inexpressible"...
Hi olgadimitri. I would be happy for you to share your son’s poems . It’s a really strange situation. For some reason my thoughts always come to me in rhymes.
It seems as though when I write what I’m feeling, when I read my words back to myself, it’s as though someone else has written them. I must have wrote dozens of them. The mind is a very delicate entity . Still I try to keep on smiling .
Alas, it doesn’t always work that way. I wish your son well and hope he can gain some respite dealing with his situation. Varna1968.
Thank you for your kind reply. My son was diagnosed with bipolar disorder. Painful to see him depressed, he's the most kind, supporting, carrying human being I've ever seen. Maybe he didn't express his talent in poetry and philosophy and it's one of the reason for his illness. I see you have a lot in common. It's not exactly the poems, just his thoughts , just some of them...."Heaven and hell, you are both here. In me and around me. At all times, in all places. Sometimes one of you predominates. Sometimes one of you eclipses the other. But you are always inseparable. Two dancers in a terrible, glorious dance. It is from your dance that we are born. In it we suffer and celebrate, fight and love, destroy and create. And in it we cease when the dance ends"....
Travel, like our lives, like history and evolution, has no destination. You never arrive anywhere, other than to the journey's end. Nothing gets resolved. There is no grand revelation or transformation. No solution to problems personal or collective. Travel is instead a form of worshiping the world, moment by moment being reminded of how strange and extraordinary it really is. And how strange and extraordinary it is that you get to experience any of it.
The cosmic significance of our lives is not in their scale or duration, which are almost nothing in the grand scheme of the universe. It is in our rarity and complexity. We may be brief and microscopic, but we may also be the rare or only exception to the infinite ocean of silence surrounding us. We, along with our sentient kin on this earth, are each a process that stands in sharp contrast to the rest of creation. Lonely gods in an empty world, our existence is a celebration of the impossible.
Somewhere deep within my chest, I sometimes hear a quiet but persistent voice. It tells me that despite my sincerest efforts, I am missing some key secret of life. Some essential answer to why I am here. It tells me that no matter what I do, the secret will never reveal itself. The answer will never come. And that fills me with both sadness and joy. It is the feeling of losing something essential about existence. A sense of it slipping through my fingers every moment, of it passing right before me irrevocably while I blink. And it is also the feeling that the mystery is always greater than what anyone thinks. That it is far beyond our grasp, incomprehensible and irreducible, and therefore an infinite source of awe and freedom.
I can totally comprehend where your son is coming from. He’s obviously highly intelligent . There in lies what I believe is the cause of most of our problems. Intelligence comes with an unfortunate side effect. My IQ according to Mensa is 155. in the top one per cent. I believe this opens pathways and corridors in my mind, that usually are not visited by most people.
In order to deal with my symptoms, I have created rooms in my mind so I can look around and see what I’m thinking. I wrote a poem about this coping mechanism I use in everyday life. It’s called Never Ending Journey . I will share it with you and if you think it’s worthy you might share it with your son . I can’t say if that’s a good or bad idea. We are all so different.
“ Never Ending Journey “
You are invited along on a journey of a most unusual kind
No one else has been before welcome to my mind
I wonder which rooms we’ll visit if the doors will be closed or open
Do you have any questions so far, or will your thoughts remain unspoken
This first room is all to familiar and may leave a lasting impression
It’s overrun with fear and anxiety shrouded in a mist of depression
I can often be found in this next room it is dark and contains just one chair
The place where I sit when i’m crying frustrated alone in despair
I seldom visit this last room it’s so hard too locate you see
Inside lives peace and tranquility I just wish I could find the key
Maybe one day I’ll finish the journey and discover some reason or rhyme
Until then I’ll just keep on thinking is my life a complete waste of time.
Thank you so much. It's so beautiful. It's magic around when I'm reading your and my son poetry. Maybe you can talk with him if you like and share your experience and struggles, he also can feel that he's not alone. I believe your talk would be so helpful to him. I believe that you are not mentally sick at all, totally opposite. It's just our world sick and corrupted. My son lives in Canada, doing Social work. His email emptyhighways@yahoo.com Nikola
I have very little if any self esteem or self worth. I truly don’t like myself.
I have a feeling though, that maybe this is something I can do. Knowing I might offer hope to someone else. I am in my twilight years and my mind is not as clear as it once was. One final thought . A poetic gift for you. “
“ Thank you for caring and being so kind
For giving me hope and peace of mind. “
Once more I’m thinking in rhyme, my brain if I still have one ,clearly must be wired differently.
Take care my friend. Maybe we can keep in touch . I think i’m known as a Silver Surfer. Im not sure how to do private messages, I am totally useless with social media. Also I find it much easier to answer questions than ask them . I think I’m well past my sell by date. I can only type using one finger.
Another poem related to mental illness has just come into my mind . It’s one I wrote over ten years ago , dealing with abstract thoughts that conflict in my mind. I will try to remember it here goes …
And yes, not getting enough B12 definitely effects our mental health. I notice I start feeling down when I don't have enough. The next day after I take my shot I start to feel a lot better. Please ensure you are getting all the B12 you need.
Hi VellBlue. I recently purchased some B12 injections, It’s becoming clear that indeed it is a necessity to self inject more often. Thank you for replying.
I was treated for severe depression for thirty years with talking therapy and every single antidepressant - NONE of it worked. Then they thought it might be bipolar disorder type 2 which is largely experienced as depression with brief periods of high activity short of paranoia. These highs resulted in my achieving quite spectacular things on the leading edge of knowledge. They thought lithium might help and all that happened was I lost the good bit and was left with a slightly eased depression.
One day I collapsed on my sofa and when I recovered I checked my temperature and blood pressure ( I had worked in human biology research and thats why I had the equipment and knowledge to do that.) Temperature was normal and the blood pressure was through the floor. 999 call and a high speed paramedic was with me in five minutes and rushed me off to a hospital with flashing lights and siren wails. I got priority in the queue and blood taken promptly by a medical student who sat with me till they got the results back. Within the hour I was in a ward on a drip with B12 and folic acid being infused. I stabilised within an hour and was kept in for a few days.
The GP followed up OK yet within a few months reduced the folic acid to 2.5 every other day as she was worried with my taking 5mg per day. She agreed with increasing the IM dose of B12 to one every two months and was happy for me to inject myself given my background.
I moved to a town to be closer to my Daughter and her twin Daughters, who will be 20 tomorrow and never had the same GP so never built a relationship. When covid hit I felt I was dying more and more every day and not from the coronavirus. I was falling about all over the place; could not walk straight; felt cold all the time; lost hair all over my body; white specks in my nails that had no luni; and many, many more symptoms.
I ordered in supplies from Germany and Medisave, quarantined them and began injecting every other day. That was February 2020 and I am still doing it. I have recently had problems again and after experimenting find that folic acid needs to be at least 2.5 daily. Some bloods next week will check out the folate level which may well need to be raised again.
So your not alone and thank you for sharing your story.
Hello Bellabab . Oh my word , you have really suffered through the lack of receiving the correct medication. I’m afraid some G Ps think they are God.
If as the adage says “ Ignorance Is Bliss “. Then I’ve met many happy doctors whilst being treated for depression. I’ve lost count of the number of different medications I’ve been prescribed.
After years of complying with different doctors remedies. When I was in my forties, I decided I would fight back . In a conversation with a psychiatrist he wanted to reintroduce some medication that had made me feel suicidal previously.
I asked him what he thought the patients roll was in making such decisions . He said he was the expert therefore he new best. Needless to say I told him I wasn’t putting anything he prescribed into my body. He was a bit taken aback by my reaction. It was then I told him I would never be treated by him in the future.
He said he would write to my G P about my refusal to comply. I said that was a brilliant idea, and immediately changed my GP as well.
I now take a variety of medication to try to keep my depression under control. Obviously it doesn’t always work all of the time and the dark clouds still return. That’s the nature of the illness . At present I can manage my condition reasonably well.
I figure you can’t have rainbows without rain. But nothing lasts forever and I make the most of the sunny days.
Thank you for that caring answer. I didn't say that part of my journey to discover for myself what had caused my "depression" was to study to become a counsellor and then a qualified psychotherapist before becoming a consultant psychotherapist. I am sure you have looked carefully into it yourself - should there be anything you would lik to discuss please do not hesitate to contact me.
Wonderfully accurate picture of depression /anxiety.It is a lonely place to be because you are so deep down inside yourself. I hope putting pen to paper will prove to be cathartic for you.
Thank you for responding to my post. It is always difficult to deal with mental health issues. Sadly , it still carries a stigma , in general society. Basically if you can’t see it then it doesn’t exist.
Only people struggling with the symptoms and realities of depression,will ever appreciate , how debilitating this illness can become. Even so , I chose to write openly about the condition. I feel certain many people choose to suffer in silence. I sincerely hope they now know , they are not alone. Varna1968
I have read that psychiatric symptoms are often among the first symptoms of B12 deficiency, and can include irritability, depression, mania, and psychosis. My personal belief is that the initial symptoms can be among the last to resolve. Very little is known about treatment of B12 deficiency with neurological symptoms. (I previously said "Very little is known about treatment of B12 deficiency with psychiatric symptoms." That was a typographic error. I am sorry about the error and hope it didn't lead to confusion.) Among pertinent questions about treatment of neurological symptoms of B12 deficiency not yet addressed by research are the following: 1) What is the optimal amount of injected dose? 2) What is the optimal frequency of dose? 3) Why would a person ever reduce the frequency or amount of dose before symptoms are totally resolved? My personal goal is to have symptoms all resolve, until I can see no improvement from one year to the next. Given those unanswered treatment questions, and given that one of the few things known about treatment is that B12 is not toxic at any level, I inject daily. I would rather injection more B12 than is useful than inject less B12 than is needed for optimal recovery.
I am not medically trained, and I understand that not everyone will want to inject daily.
Thank you so much for your thoughtful,and informative comments. With the B12 injections, I intend to be increasing the frequency I use them. I will do this gradually , until I feel comfortable with my mental health issues.
It would seem , each person’s condition requires differing amounts of B12.
I will most definitely keep a record of how much I take and how I feel. Until I determine what amount of B12 , my body and mind need.
I had a typographic error in my initial response, saying "Very little is known about treatment of B12 deficiency with psychiatric symptoms." That was a typographic error. I meant to refer to treatment of neurological symptoms of B12 deficiency. (Psychiatric symptoms are included among neurological symptoms, so other than being too narrowly confined to psychiatric symptoms, the original statement was correct.) I am sorry for the error and hope it didn't lead to confusion or misunderstanding.
Hi Wiscguy. Everything is fine, I understood what the basis for your advice was. Thoughts have a tendency to linger in my mind. It has no off switch, if anything, I seem to overthink everything. Thank you for the clarification.
Thank you for sharing your poem. I concur with others more B12 may help. I would add that the only way I know to determine if it is helpful is to try it. It also takes time to be effective for many. It was important to me when I started injecting .5 mg hydroxocobalamin every day.
Thank you reading and responding. A majority of members seem to have come to the same conclusion. That is to increase the amount of B12 I’m taking. I intend to do this. Hopefully , it will bring about the improvement I’m seeking.
I have suffered from Depression for 26 years since I was 21, I am now 47.
I only found out about my B12 deficiency in 2017 about 7 years ago.
I had to take the self injecting route as GP’s weren’t helping much.
I’ve had a lot of relief from Depression and Anxiety by self injecting B12. There was a huge difference after 3-4 months of weekly injections (one per week).
B12 definitely affects Depression hugely and also if you’re low on Iron, Folate or Vitamin D3.
If any one of the above are low you will feel very depressed.
I appreciate the amount of suffering you must have been through. There have been many times in my own situation , where no matter which way I turned , all I could see were dark tunnels, encouraging me to dwell inside them.
Looking back can sometimes be the only way to move forwards. Sorry if that sounds somewhat paradoxical. Please remember there is no wrong or right way when dealing with Depression. We must all seek our own pathway to freedom.
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