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Pernicious Anaemia Society

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retesting blood?

Sea_cells profile image
6 Replies

good afternoon All,

After being diagnosed P.A and having my loading doses, my symptoms are no better, the dizziness is unbearable and I keep dropping things with the pins and needles on my hands.

I’ve been and seen my doctor again this morning as it’s getting dangerous nearly falling down the stairs . He has referred me to an audiologist to check my hearing before starting neurological tests and wants me to have repeat bloods on Thursday morning .

My heart rate at home was 55 at resting and shoots upto 105 on standing up but it was ‘ok’ at the surgery .

I’m honestly fed up of feeling like I’m going to hit the floor at any given moment!

Am I wrong in thinking they shouldn’t repeat bloods for P.A? And also denied anymore b12 until September which will be 3 monthly.

thank you for listening to me.

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Sea_cells profile image
Sea_cells
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6 Replies
Nackapan profile image
Nackapan

I got worse before better.Vertigo

Migraines

Tinnitus

Ect

Fof me after othef things ruled out with a brain CT scan and Brain mri I went back tk every othef day b12 injections

If felt like I was being poisoned at the time.

Was well before so nothing else going on and nothing else found.

Make sure your folate iron and ferritin and vit d and full blood count done .

You are right in thinking b12 levels and IFAB does not need repeating.

It take time, b12 and alot of pain and patience for many of us.

Sea_cells profile image
Sea_cells in reply toNackapan

thanks for reply.

I’m already on vitamin d3 & folate supplements.

My ferritin levels were 121ug/l lab says 6.00-81.00ug/l which was tested 4 weeks ago, doctor has said he doesn’t see the point in repeating my full blood count just wants b12 & folate retesting.

We shall see what Thursday brings I suppose go from there.

jade_s profile image
jade_s

Neuro symptoms require continued every other day injections. You might try writing a letter to your doctor b12deficiency.info/writing-... see point 1.

Failing that, self injection is a last resort.

You could get lucky & b12 levels could be low. If they are in range or high they'll likely say you're fine, unfortunately. But correct, b12 levels need not be retested. Go by symptoms.

Sleepybunny profile image
Sleepybunny

Hi,

I hope some of this info is useful.

I post a lot of info so you might want to take a week or so to sort through it.

It's possible that some links may have details that could be upsetting.

A couple of articles about Testing B12 during Treatment

pernicious-anaemia-society....

stichtingb12tekort.nl/engli...

Has your GP checked your potassium levels?

Some people may experience a drop in potassium levels when treatment starts.

Other test results

Have you got recent results for folate, iron and Vitamin D as forum members often report deficiencies in these as well as B12.

It's also quite common for people here to also have thyroid issues. I suggest putting any thyroid results on Thyroid UK forum on HU.

Neuro symptoms

Pins and needles, dizziness count as neuro symptoms.

With neuro symptoms present, I would expect you to be on the treatment pattern "For people with neurological involvement" outlined in link below.

cks.nice.org.uk/topics/anae...

Maybe you can ask GP in a letter or face to face why you are not on this treatment pattern.

Unhappy with treatment?

How to write letters to GP about B12 deficiency.

b12deficiency.info/writing-...

Point 1 is about under treatment of B12 deficiency with neuro symptoms.

I prefer to put queries about treatment/diagnosis into a letter as I feel it's harder for the GP to ignore. Always keep a copy.

It's vital to get adequate treatment. Inadequate treatment may increase the risk of developing permanent neurological damage. In severe cases, the spinal cord may be affected.

If your GP is reluctant to give adequate treatment, it may be worth discussing the risk of permanent neuro damage with them.

Next article may be a good one to pass to them.

PAS article about SACD, sub acute combined degeneration of the spinal cord

pernicious-anaemia-society....

Have you considered joining PAS (Pernicious Anaemia Society)?

PAS membership is separate from membership of this forum.

PAS (Pernicious Anaemia Society)

Based in Wales, UK.

pernicious-anaemia-society....

There is a helpline number that PAS members can ring.

UK B12 documents

NHS article about B12 deficiency (simply written)

nhs.uk/conditions/vitamin-b...

Summary of BSH Cobalamin and Folate Guidelines

pernicious-anaemia-society....

BSH Cobalamin and Folate Guidelines

Aimed at health professionals.

b-s-h.org.uk/guidelines/gui...

Diagnostic flowchart from BSH Cobalamin and Folate Guidelines which mentions Antibody Negative PA

stichtingb12tekort.nl/engli...

BNF Hydroxocobalamin

bnf.nice.org.uk/drug/hydrox...

NICE CKS (Clinical Knowledge Summary) B12 deficiency and Folate deficiency

cks.nice.org.uk/topics/anae...

A new NICE guideline "Vitamin B12 deficiency in over 16s: diagnosis and management" is due to be published in 2024.

nice.org.uk/guidance/GID-NG...

Tracey Whitty, a UK campaigner on B12 deficiency issues has blogged about this.

b12deficiency.info/vitamin-...

Local B12 deficiency guidelines

I urge UK forum members to find out what is in the local b12 deficiency guidelines used by their ICB (Integrated Care Board) in England and Health Board in Wales/Scotland (not sure about Northern Ireland).

If you can't find them online or by searching forum threads then best bet is to submit a FOI (Freedom of Information) request to ICB or Health Board asking which B12 deficiency guidelines are used locally and for a link to or copy of them.

Some local B12 deficiency guidelines are not helpful. See blog post below.

b12deficiency.info/gloucest...

Misconceptions

Many forum members have met health professionals whose knowledge of B12 deficiency is lacking.

Misconceptions about a B12 deficiency

(From Dutch B12 website - units, ref ranges, treatment patterns may vary from UK)

stichtingb12tekort.nl/engli...

Diagnosis and Treatment Pitfalls

(From B12 Institute in Netherlands - units, ref ranges, treatment patterns may vary from UK)

b12-institute.nl/en/diagnos...

May be worth telling your GP about these.....

1) PAS have a page for health professionals that your GP may find useful.

pernicious-anaemia-society....

2)Club B12 is a group of researchers, doctors and other interested people who are looking into B12. They have regular zoom meetings and a conference in UK later this year.

club-12.org/

3) This in my personal opinion is one of the best b12 articles I've found.

Aimed at researchers and health professionals.

B12 article from Mayo Clinic in US

The Many Faces of Cobalamin (Vitamin B12) Deficiency

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articl...

Table 1 in above article is about frequent misconceptions about B12 deficiency that health professionals may have.

Links to forum threads where I left detailed replies with lots of B12 deficiency info eg causes and symptoms, more UK B12 documents, B12 books, B12 films, B12 websites and B12 articles and a few hints on dealing with unhelpful GPs.

healthunlocked.com/pasoc/po...

healthunlocked.com/pasoc/po...

healthunlocked.com/pasoc/po...

Link to thread about Patient Safety, has useful links for those in UK having difficult health experiences.

healthunlocked.com/pasoc/po...

I'm not medically trained just someone who struggled for years with unrecognised and untreated B12 deficiency.

Some UK forum members turn to treating themselves if NHS treatment is not enough. Some get extra B12 injections from private GPs or beauty salons, some try high dose oral B12 eg 1000mcg or higher but these don't work for some people and some as a last resort try self injection (SI).

Sea_cells profile image
Sea_cells in reply toSleepybunny

wow thank you!

That will take a lot of reading for this evening whilst waiting for my X-ray & Ct scan which he has sent me for.

My iron levels 18umol

My folate 3 ug/l - treatment started.

My vitamin d 34nmol- treatment started.

Potassium 4.9 mmol/l range is 3.50-5.5mmol/l

Thank you again for all the information.

Christine48 profile image
Christine48

Hi Sea cells, your doc needs to look up the NICE guidelines for PA it states quite clearly that loading doses should continue until symptoms improve and then injections should be every 8 wks.

Good luck

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