Injections for PA

[lupin23]

Because I am needle phobic why is B12 not available using an auto pen device.

[fbirder]

Presumably because there isn't the same demand as there is for insulin. It is believed that those suffering from B12 deficiency only need jabs every two or three months, whereas diabetics need injections much more often and at irregular intervals. That makes self-injection almost compulsory.

[Gambit62 Administrator in reply to fbirder]

Not quite sure it really works that way.

The main expense of people reliant upon their GP to give them shots is the time of medical staff.

Looking briefly at the cost of insulin pens they cost about £50. 100 Needles costs about £15 ... and working on an estimate of staff time being £20+ having a pen and teaching people to use it (minimal investment) you could be recouping the investment well within a year, even assuming that people are only on 3 maintenance shots a year. So could save the NHS heaps of money.

However,

Think its more likely to be the fixation on intramuscular injections, which could not be done with an insulin pen as it is just subcutaneous.

[fbirder in reply to Gambit62]

Yes, that's true. But how many B12 pens could the manufacturers sell? With self-injection not being necessary for the majority I'd doubt there would be that great a demand. Certainly nowhere near the demand from diabetics, who have little choice apart from self-injection.

When I see my GP next time, to request presciptions for my self-injecting, I shall be enphasizing the cost savings.

[Gambit62 Administrator in reply to fbirder]

most pens come with reusable needles so not a question of how frequently people are injecting - it's how many are going to want to be injecting ... and to be honest the numbers of people who need B12 must be pretty comparable to the numbers of insulin dependent diabetics so huge market that just isn't being tapped into.

[fbirder in reply to Gambit62]

My impression was that the vast majority of those with B12d do not self-inject. Whereas there are a lot of diabetics that do need to self-inject - because they not only need to inject more often, but at random times.

[Gambit62 Administrator in reply to fbirder]

True, but that is only because medical practitioners are being really blinkered over focusing on intramuscular injections done by a nurse and not thinking about other solutions, such as subq with a pen that could actually be a lot more cost effective.

Unfortunately there just isn't enough research being done on other methods of delivering B12. SubQ may be a bit less effective and require more frequent doses but it just isn't recognised as an option ... and saving on staff time would be considerable ... and from a manufacturers perspective the market would be considerable ... one problem may be that the manufacturers of B12 haven't thought about it so they aren't packaging the B12 in a way that would be compatible with pens ... though it probably doesn't make much difference to them on the packaging - long term at least ... though there might be a short term need for investment but if they got into bed with the pen manufacturers I wouldn't have thought it would take that long to recoup the investment.

[fbirder in reply to Gambit62]

Yeah, I must admit I would prefer doing SubCut with a pen.

[lupin23 in reply to Gambit62]

the nhs is planning to switch over to the pen system for all injections so I was told recently. My daughter is on methotrexate with pen delivery so it could be done for B12

[Gambit62 Administrator]

In the US the CDC (US equivalent of NICE) recommends nasal sprays as an alternative to injections where there are issues around injection. Not available on the NHS of course but if injections are a real issue for you then it might be worth looking at it as an alternative.

[Frodo]

It would be great to be able to self-treat with a pen especially if it was available OTC.

[clivealive Forum Support]

In over 40 years since 1972 of having over 500 B12 injections administered by a practice nurse the time it takes is less than 5 minutes per shot. They love me at the surgery because I never use up the 10 minute appointment slot.

Over twenty years ago, whilst my wife was still alive I asked our doctor whether she could give me the injections at home - permission was refused.

I'm 74 now and still "clivealive" so I guess the jabs are working...

[lupin23 in reply to clivealive]

The jabs don't take the time but waiting in a busy

Surgery uses up a good hour of my time. Getting there waiting at least 20minutes if lucky then off home again. To be able to get on and do it myself at home would be so much easier.