Help or advice or thoughts!

[Mummy23]

Hi all. I haven’t posted for quite a while...feeling very despondent...

Long post....sorry....background first....

Completed C25k May 2019, was up to 10k by last December, gradually increasing distance from there.

I should have been running New Forest half this year (September).... but I couldn’t make the new date, so chose to go ‘virtual’. Turned out, it was just as well as I ‘injured’ my knee, second week of August. Had got my distance up to 10 miles and was running a 10k, when had to cut it short due to pain in left knee, not sudden onset, just a niggle that got worse....

The pain was below and to the left of my knee cap (not on the side of my leg) painful to walk, sit, stand, stairs and couldn’t completely straighten my leg. RICE for a couple of days, no change. Went to sports physio. She never actually gave my ‘injury’ a name, but did say that through running I had strengthened the muscle on the outside of my leg which had pulled my kneecap to the left. She gave me a set of exercises to do to strengthen the muscle to the right and just above my knee cap.... leg extended and push back of knee into the floor, leg extended and raised- hold for 1 minute, sit on chair and really slowly lower leg from straight to bent, foam roller on outside of leg (IT band??). I followed the exercises to the letter, visited physio twice more, massage/ultrasound performed. Pain reduced hugely and more mobility. Knee was now uncomfortable not painful. Second week of September she said I could run, slowly and not too far.... first run was 3.5K and slower than my usual... masses of pain after (uncomfortable during, but no more than what was now normal). Rested totally for a week and continued the exercises.

Have tried running a few times since, wk1r1 c25k was ok! More was ok, but a 5k straight (beginning of October) meant masses of pain to even walk for 3 days.

Not been able to get another physio appointment, knee is back to being ‘annoying’ and uncomfortable and occasionally painful (have been doing decorating - up and down the steps and kneeling) have continued exercises, ran this morning...ran for 2 minutes, walked for 1, repeat x6. Knee is same as always!

So, questions...

1. Should I now accept that I will NOT be completing a virtual half before the end of December? 😢

2. GP friend (not examined me) has said I should get insole arches in my shoes (don’t know if she meant trainers or ALL shoes) Do you think this will help?

3. Another runner friend has said gait analysis...is it ok to do this now, while I must be running differently and compensating?

4. Do I have ‘runners knee’?! Can anyone be more specific???

5. Should I stop running...or do a little...or what....

If you’ve read all of this, thank you and if you have any advice it will be very much appreciated.....sooooooo sad I can’t run 😢😢😢😢

[C3PO Marathon]

Since you're still in pain, I think you definitely need to take things slowly, and not think of any long events until the pain subsides. You aren't supposed to be in pain when walking for the next few days.

I used insole arches when I had plantar fasciitis. They were for use in all shoes. They eased the pain, but I'm not sure that they actually helped, so I ditched them after about 4 months. If you get them, you might also need to go up a shoe size because they really limit space in your shoes.

If you do gait analysis now, it will mean buying shoes that work with your current situation. That could be helpful. On the other hand, those shoes will not be what you need once you're over your problem.

Good luck!

[linda9389 Administrator Marathon]

Oh no, how frustrating. I feel your pain - the roller coaster of healing followed by pain, the fading hope of a once distant target getting closer and closer but as unreachable as ever ...

I'm no medic so anything I say should be taken with a pinch of salt, but the first thing I would say is ditch the December HM goal, right now. That is probably causing you more anxiety than anything. Once you accept that is gone you can approach the healing and comeback in a timeframe dictated only by your knee - i.e. the only sensible one. It will feel rotten for a few days, but then you are likely to feel relieved that that added pressure is finally gone.

Did you ever get back to your physio to report that running caused the pain to reappear? If you can't speak to that same physio, is it worth trying to find another one? I think I'd want to discuss it again given all the effort you've put into the exercises from the first physio visit. It might be worth a second opinion?

If a private physio isn't an option then I think I'd be knocking on my GP's (virtual) door to let them know that months on you are still in pain, that that pain is affecting everyday life not just running, and that your mental health is not being improved by not being able to run.

Although it might be something simple that a gait analysis can fix (unless you mean a full bio-mechanical analysis), I'm surprised that the physio didn't spot it if that's the case.

Don't despair though; there is very likely a solution to be found. You need to be persistent in hunting it down - and your comeback runs will repay you many-fold.

[Beachcomber66 Administrator Half Marathon]

I am not an expert Mummy23, but I have just come through 3 months of trying to fix a knee injury and have got there, thanks to my brilliant sports physio. I will briefly give you my story, but only a good sports physio will know whether this has any relevance to you. I had two problems together; discomfort under the knee cap (as in underneath the cap not lower down my leg) and a really bad acute pain on the inside of leg, next to my knee cap, which got a lot worse if I ran on it . The under knee cap discomfort was diagnosed as runners knee, which I could run with, but I always apply heat treatment(hot water bottle and gentle massage) to it for 15 mins before I run. That really helps.

The acute pain was caused by a plica, a small fibrous growth which catches as you run...and had me limping after every run. I kept going back to the physio until it was fixed. My problem was complicated by a heavy fall; I was limping as I ran and I am sure that this was a major cause of the plica. I would never run with a limp again! My rehab involved a lot of exercises, both for the knee and my hips; I think it was all about getting my knee alignment right which is a whole leg thing, not just the knee. My knee cap had moved too, and physio applied KT tape ( which I learned to do myself...as you know you have to get the tensions right).

It took 3 months; there were days of despair, but one day, magically, the pain had gone and the tape has now gone too. That was at the beginning of July, and I have now built back up to 10 miles, doing 3 runs per week and have my eyes on another HM. So right sports physio, right diagnosis, right exercises and a bit of determination from me got the job done. Hope you find a solution soon.

[Mummy23 Half Marathon]

Thank you all. I have a bit of an update... I visited a ‘proper’ sports shop for a gait analysis and the guy there was amazing! I was apprehensive as I still struggle to call myself a ‘proper’ runner!! He listened to my history, filmed me running in my shoes (ASICS), a pair of neutral shoes and a couple of pairs to ‘help’. I was stunned by the obvious over pronation on my left foot (it’s my left knee that is a problem!) and no issues at all on the right. I tried Brooks which totally ‘fixed’ it. He talked to me about the exercises my physio has suggested and said I should continue with those, he also suggested and demonstrated a few others to increase strength in other leg muscles. He says that the over pronation will exacerbate the knee problem, the Brooks will prevent that, so I have a green light to run. 😁😁 Both he and the physio have said running is ok, I have to keep up the physio exercises to stop the knee discomfort, running won’t make it worse, squats, strengthening and stretching will help in future. Start small and build slowly. I ran C25K wk 4, r1 this morning.... in my ‘new shoes’... no additional pain or discomfort. 😁😁

Beachcomber 66, I will definitely be trying your heat and massage trick before running... my knee always feels better after a hot bath!! Standing for a long time is not good, neither is sitting still.

I feel I might be at the beginning of a new beginning.... New Forest Half 2021......!!

🤞🏼🤞🏼🤞🏼🤞🏼🤞🏼🤞🏼

[linda9389 Administrator Marathon in reply to Mummy23]

Wow that's amazing. I'm very happy to take back all I said 😊

[RunBrianRun Half Marathon]

Some good news there! I hope it continues to improve for you.