Good Sleep Provides Benefits in the Morning

[jimcaster]

A few months ago, I was persuaded by Art's (Chartist's) posts to try high nightly doses (80+ mg) of melatonin. My sleep is much better and I have also felt completely normal while unmedicated for a couple of hours after waking up. Maybe it's coincidental for me, but there appears to be a correlation between sleep efficiency and symptom reduction in the morning.

parkinsonsnewstoday.com/new...

[Zardoz]

How do you feel throughout the day after taking so much melatonin? Tired and sleepy?

[Zardoz in reply to Zardoz]

Other questions: How did you take the dose and in what form? All at once or did you spread it out by waking at intervals? Immediate release or extended release?

My bladder gets me up about 4 - 5 times a night. Could the melatonin cause a problem by putting me in too deep a sleep?

[jimcaster in reply to Zardoz]

Surprisingly, I don't feel any more sleepy during the day than I did before. It's immediate release and I take the pills just before going to bed. I sleep a lot more soundly, but still wake up to use the bathroom, as needed.

[chartist]

Thank you for the update, Jim! I'm glad that you are finding melatonin helpful. In some people, melatonin seems to help improve the circadian rhythm and thus, sleep, but it doesn't work for everyone as a sleep aid :

my.clevelandclinic.org/heal...

A relevant quote :

' Researchers and scientists still have a lot to learn about melatonin and all of its effects on the human body. The main way melatonin affects your body is by playing a role in your body’s circadian rhythm and sleep-wake cycle. '

In one of the 50 mg studies, they did barely start to notice an improvement in motor function during off time, but I don't think that was seen until near the end of the study :

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articl...

Interesting quotes from the study :

' At baseline, the activity of mitochondrial complex I and the respiratory control ratio were significantly lower in PD patients than in the healthy control group (Figures 2(a) and 2(b), respectively). Compared with the placebo group, the melatonin group showed significant increases of both parameters after 3 months and reached values similar to the healthy control group. '

' No serious adverse drug reactions were observed with melatonin at the doses used during the trial and were mild and transitory. Accordingly, melatonin is a molecule with an uncommonly high safety profile [19, 20]. '

' At the end of the trial, in patients who received melatonin, we detected a significant diminution of lipoperoxides, nitric oxide metabolites, and carbonyl groups in plasma samples from PD patients compared with the placebo group. Conversely, catalase activity was increased significantly in comparison with the placebo group. Compared with the placebo group, the melatonin group showed significant increases of mitochondrial complex 1 activity and respiratory control ratio. The fluidity of the membranes was similar in the melatonin group and the placebo group at baseline and after three months of treatment. In conclusion, melatonin administration was effective in reducing the levels of oxidative stress markers and restoring the rate of complex I activity and respiratory control ratio without modifying membrane fluidity. This suggests that melatonin could play a role in the treatment of PD. '

In this second 50 mg study, one of the things they found was a slight improvement in motor function testing :

sciencedirect.com/science/a...

Here is a relevant quote from the human study :

' The motor activity of the patients in OFF showed a tendency for a lower score with MEL than placebo (d = 0.43) Table 4. '

This sounds similar to what you are describing, Jim?

I think Jim, you have been taking a higher dose than the study dose for a longer period of time if I remember correctly? This study used a placebo period and a melatonin period, so actual melatonin use was not as long as the study.

Art

[chartist]

One other thought, Jim, did you have this improvement right after starting high dose melatonin (HDM) or did it appear over time while taking melatonin. If it appeared over time, I would be more inclined to consider melatonin as the reason for the benefit because melatonin should have improved your sleep very quickly if it was going to improve your sleep, in which case the benefit would have been noticed right away, but it sounds like it took months.

The last time you reported about melatonin, I think you just said you were feeling better overall and you did not know what to attribute that to.

Art

[jimcaster in reply to chartist]

The sleep improvement was immediate, but feeling symptom free in the morning was very gradual. I only realized it recently, after months of high dose melatonin.

[Jean-louisVLR]

Many thanks, jimcaster, for this personal testimony.

During your experiment with high dose Melatonin, where you under LevoDopa ? What daily dose ?

[jimcaster in reply to Jean-louisVLR]

Yes, I take 1 25/100 carbidopa levodopa four times per day.

[Jean-louisVLR in reply to jimcaster]

I thank you.

[Marcia123]

I agree I have the same results

[chartist in reply to Marcia123]

Marcia123,

What dose of melatonin are you taking and for how long?

Art

[Marcia123 in reply to chartist]

I don’t take melatonin I responded that I function well first thing in the morning after a good nights sleep. I had been taking levodopa carbidopa, and I have been slaving very well. I tried amantadine and mucuna yesterday and my back and stomach and toes started to itch intensely. Also, I have terrible Lipo atrophy

[Esperanto]

Indeed, it is unpredictable whether Melatonin will work in individual cases. Therefore, it may be wise to first investigate whether a low dosage has an effect. Personally, I have been using 1 mg/d for a month to address my severe sleep problems. With great success, as my sleep has lengthened from 3 hours to 6 hours after the first pill. In addition to the disappearance of the debilitating fatigue, I also notice an immediate effect on the C/L medication. This was already greatly improved by the B6 supletion, but is even more effective and especially seems to work longer. My GP himself suggested increasing the dosage of Melatonin to 2 mg/d. This might be worth trying, but even with supplements I try not to overdo it, especially if low doses are also beneficial. 🍀

[Lionore]

Jim, my sleep is much improved also; I take 10 mg of melatonin . I do occasionally have problems falling asleep but when that happens I thank God for my comfortable bed and opportunity to rest, unlike health care workers putting in 13 hour overnight shifts.

Sending a big thank you to Art for his amazingly hard work in researching and sharing complementary treatments for PD. Happy New Year to all!

[chartist in reply to Lionore]

That was very thoughtful of you to say, Lionore!

Art

[Ghmac in reply to chartist]

We all appreciate you Art!

[LindaP50 in reply to Ghmac]

Heartily agree!

[Ghmac]

Apparently there is a well known sleep benefit for people with PD who wake up system free:

parkinsonsnewstoday.com/new...

[jimcaster in reply to Ghmac]

That is the exact same link which was attached to my original post. 🙂