B1 and HCL

[Beckey]

I usually buy Vitacost but I'm finding other brands that are cheaper. But none label their products as HCL. Are they as good?

[park_bear]

The HCL version is water-soluble and therefore any unused thiamine is excreted. The mono nitrate version is fat-soluble and retained in the body. Since we were using high doses it is considered to be better to not store any excess.

[Hidden]

Beckey,

It seems like the manufacturers who are using Thiamine HCL/HCI in their products tend to list them as such. The others tend to be the Thiamine Mononitrate which is fat soluble while the HCI/HCL version is water soluble. Dr. C only recommends HCI/HCL.

Art

[Yhae in reply to Hidden]

Which sites are the best place to buy these vitamins

[Hidden in reply to Yhae]

Yhae,

It seems one of the more popular choices is the house brand from Vitacost, because their capsules are easier to swallow than the pills which are fairly large and in some PWPs , swallowing may be a big issue. On the other hand, members have mentioned that they just chew up those big pills and then wash it down with a drink of grape juice or similar.

For people who are vegan/vegetarian or are looking for B-1 that has no fillers in it, there is a thiamine HCL/HCI supplement available in capsule form that uses non gelatin capsules and no fillers and this may be an important point because if you are a responder to HDT, you will be taking it for life. You can get this same effect using the raw pure powder form of thiamine HCL/HCI, but the pure powder form is very bitter and not as convenient as you have to measure out each dose accurately each time.

Here is a link that will take you to a page that not only has a ton of information about HDT, but also has links to many suppliers of thiamine supplements that members have tried or have mentioned. Just scroll down to the links section of the post in order to find the correct links.

healthunlocked.com/parkinso...

healthunlocked.com/parkinso...

Good luck!

Art

[Yhae in reply to Hidden]

Thanks so much for your help

[Jennyjenny2 in reply to Hidden]

How do you do all this Art? You are such a wealth of knowledge on what has been written in the past and by whom! Do you have a computer in your brain or have you documented all the info for future reference? That would be such a huge job!! We really appreciate everything you do, but please don’t burn out!

[Hidden in reply to Jennyjenny2]

I'm sweating so much, I can't burnout !!! 😅😅😅

Art

[Tenafterten in reply to Hidden]

I second what jennyjenny2 said. Thank you Art!

[Mogul1 in reply to Hidden]

Hi Art,

Just a question/clarification; I think I remember reading instructions from Dr. C. Saying do not take the thiamin with any sweet drinks. I used to take it with fruit juice, but now it’s filtered water from the filter in the fridge. It tastes so much better and is a nice step towards a very nice cup of tea. I’ve been enjoying a cup of “Sleepy Time Extra”before I go to bed. The “extra”

Is Valerian Root powder. That plus capsules of Valerian root powder and liquid Melatonin 3 times in equal intervals before I go to bed. Thank you for that recommendation, it is so exciting to go to bed and actually sleep!

I feel the liquid melatonin gets in my system more quickly. I use Whole Foods “365” which is organic, is not preserved with alcohol, and is $5.75 for a 2 fl. oz dropper bottle. It doesn’t take much.

I also take “Sleepthru”, a product by Gaia designed to help you get back to sleep if you wake up at 4:00AM. It helps, but I do not have a 100% success rate with it.

I stay away from sugar in the evening and do a self check to get a sense of how sleepy I am right before I go to bed. My neurologist said it’s ok to take one Rytary before I go to bed if I think I’m going to have trouble getting to sleep.

As you know I’ve been battling insomnia for close to a year. Your help and advice has helped me turn the corner. I can’t thank you enough for your time and involvement in this exceptional forum.

[Hidden in reply to Mogul1]

Mogul1,

I am very happy to hear that the "melatonin 123" is helping you to get past the long standing insomnia and finally get the rest and sleep you need to help maintain better health! Your feedback may help others who are in a similar boat of poor or no sleep. That is part of the purpose of this forum where the members can share what is working for them and what is not.

In the case of melatonin, many have tried it including myself and it did not work for sleep, but just dividing the dose up was all it took to make a world of difference for me and that is why I wanted to share that message on this forum, to let people with insomnia know that there may be hope with an over the counter product that is non addictive, inexpensive, readily available in the US and has a very good safety profile!

Other things that are helpful for inducing good sleep are darkening your bedroom at night so that you can not see the palm of your hand right in front of your face when in bed. Failing that, wearing the soft fabric blinder glasses will give total darkness which should tell your body it is night time and time to go to sleep. It should also help with natural melatonin production in the body. It is also helpful to get bright outside sun exposure in the morning to noon range for a few minutes minimum to help get your circadian clock in sync. No tv or computer use for 3 hours before bedtime, because the displays are bright enough to convince your body that it is daytime and this also may inhibit natural melatonin production that occurs as the sun fades to night. I believe that melatonin 123 works because it is somewhat simulating the natural buildup of melatonin that occurs as daylight fades to night and ultimately reaching a peak melatonin level around 1:00 in the morning.

Regarding Dr. Costantini and taking B-1 with certain juices, he "advises against" taking the B-1 with citric acid type juices such as orange, lime, grapefruit, lemon and pineapple juice because these can have an affect on how the the B-1 is metabolized and I think it can vary from one person to the next. I think his reasoning is that anything that affects how the B-1 is metabolized or absorbed is adding a variable to the equation that can make it harder to figure out the proper dose when testing HDT. Given the fact that some people have a very frustrating time trying to find their optimal dose of B-1, I can fully understand why he would not want to introduce another variable into the dosing picture!

If you look at forum member Wriga's recent posting about grapefruit juice, it is a very good description of how and why this effect of certain juices can also affect medications that you take and that is an important point that Wriga made!

Sweet dreams!!!😫😫😫

Art

[Hidden in reply to Mogul1]

Mogul1,

One other thing that may be helpful to induce sleep is to check the PH of your urine around bedtime and in the morning with PH strips or a basic ph tester which may be a bit more accurate. Around 7 would be good. If it is too low it could be affecting your sleep negatively in which case you can try the different methods of alkalinizing.

Your blood PH is very tightly regulated, but other areas of the body such as the mouth, bladder, gut and tissues can be altered.

selfhacked.com/blog/steven-...

It is thought that getting to a more neutral ph level in the low 7's will also help in improving sleep and better sleep quality.

Art

[Mogul1 in reply to Hidden]

Thank you. You are something else!

[jimcaster]

Solgar tablets are identified as Thiamine HCl on the back side of the bottle where the ingredients are listed.

[Hidden in reply to jimcaster]

Jim,

I wasn't aware that Solgar had a thiamine HCL 500 mg "capsule" available. I only knew about the pills which are fairly large and what I have posted a link for. Can you post a link so I can add it to the HDT Primer page so that we have more choices available in capsules?

Thank you!

Art

[enjoysalud in reply to Hidden]

My Solgar HCL, which I purchased thro Amazon.com, comes in 100mg....that's why I switched to Vitacost. I did not see an offering of 500mg by Solgar.

[jimcaster in reply to enjoysalud]

Just FYI - Solgar does have 500 mg HCl tablets.

[Hidden in reply to enjoysalud]

enjoysalud,

Sorry, I missed your post. Here is the Amazon link to the 500 mg tablets of Thiamine HCI.

amazon.com/Solgar-Vitamin-B...

As you now know, the Vitacost capsules are smaller and less expensive.

Art

[enjoysalud in reply to Hidden]

Hi easilly, sorry my response mislead you. I take HCL capsules, NOT tablets. In my response I did not differentiate between the tablet and the capsule....mea culpe. Also, the response was intended for jimcaster....oh well. Obviously I was NOT focused.

I was trying to let jimcaster know that my experience with Solgar was only 100mg HCL and THAT IS WHY I SWITCHED to Viscot. As we all know, Viscot sells the 500mg in capsule form.

Thanks again..............I will try and be more careful with the wording of my responses. Yesterday I had lunch with a 93 year old woman friend from my past church (switched to a new church because of time and traffic). She is so sharp, still drives with a CALIF driver's lic. I'm sure she would have made herself clear. Next time.

Los Angeles, CA, USA

[jimcaster in reply to Hidden]

I'm sorry. I misspoke. It comes in the form of a large tablet, not a capsule. I have now edited my previous comment.

[Beckey]

Thanks, all!

[GBAMIGOD]

Hi everyone, I just bought Solgar 500mg HCL tablets.What is the dosage for PD management please?

[Hidden in reply to GBAMIGOD]

GBAMIGOD,

The following link may give you an idea on dosing.

healthunlocked.com/parkinso...

Art

[Erniediaz1018]

No good, if it's not hcl.