The attached article reports apoptosis of cancer cells by low frequency vibration (not CLL & experiment was in-vitro)
Vibration platforms claim multiple fold increase in lymphatic circulation and drainage. Lymphatic drainage is good for CLL.
Can there be a small chance that vibration platforms are good for us??
I’m planning on doing a daily 10 minutes vibration platform experiment on myself 🤪🤣
At 65yo I don't think I would dare have a go on one these machines.....I think bits of me would be flying across the room..😳
😅😅 You are humorous Misty. The low frequency setting is like a good massage. I’m not too far behind you age. I decided to Hop on it 🤣
I’m sure you are much stronger than you give yourself credit
Just my little j🌝ke! I would try it, but it wouldn't be a good l👀k....
All that wobbling flesh.
🤣 You are funny… I like your sense of humour
Hello nuji
Sounds like something worth trying, after all the CLL is in our lymph nodes. Blessings. keep us posted.
I’ve used a proper vibrating plate machine for decades now and have no idea whether they have a beneficial effect on the CLL. However, they’re pretty good for cellulite! 😉
Newdawn
I have used one but have not tried it since my diagnosis. I will have to try!
We got one even before I had CLL. Love the massage feeling!
where do you get these machines?
Just google ‘vibrating plate machines’. There’s masses online but do your research by looking at credible reviews first.
Newdawn
I use it regularly once or twice a week
I am intrigued by the article saying it could aid apoptosis of CLL cells. Well I think I just bought myself a Xmas gift!
Admin - the title of the paper is "Low‐frequency mechanical vibration induces apoptosis of A431 epidermoid carcinoma cells." The abstract describes experimental results of "cells maintained in static culture", that is, not in a human body but 'in a test tube' or' in vitro'. That's a long way away from effective results in a human being for a chronic blood cancer.
No, no! The article did not say it helped in apoptosis of CLL cells. It just said there was apoptosis of some cancer cells (don’t know which).
Before investing in a machine, note that few have responded that they have been using it for a long time, even before CLL diagnosis. So read between these lines as well. Perhaps it delayed time to treatment???
One this is sure, it’s a good massage for sure. 😅
I sit all day at my computer WFH so even having this under my desk for a mid day massage sounds great!
Thanks
It’s said faith can move mountains. Much is discussed about placebo effect. Perhaps believing the claims about lymphatic drainage of the vibration platform can delay TTFT or hasten MRD. BELIEVE….
A good read is Biology of Belief by Dr Bruce Lipton.
From my studies on the placebo effect, it affects how you feel. It's generally accepted that while the placebo effect can't change the outcome of a cancer diagnosis, it can change how much pain you might feel. That's why it is considered unethical to include a placebo arm in clinical trials for cancer. You'll only find arms including treatments that are thought to be inferior to the new cancer drug under trial.
Neil
AussieNeil -
I've read that the placebo effect has been getting stronger, at least for neuropathy, and possibly for psychiatric drugs, but the trend has only been shown in the U.S.:
bigthink.com/health/placebo....
Why is the placebo effect getting worse, but only in America?
The placebo effect is not the "power of positive thinking." The fact that it is getting stronger is not a good development.
"Moreover, the likely reason we are seeing the placebo effect strengthen in the U.S. for some conditions is because clinical trials are growing longer and more elaborate, not because we are growing more adept at thinking ourselves into better health."
Psychology can have powerful effects, and it's hard to design studies to properly isolate psychological bias.
=seymour=
Totally agree that for conditions like cancer, it’s unethical to give inert material to study placebo effect. In the same token, if it’s known that one arm of a trial will be inferior, I feel it’s a bit unfair for the inferior arm - if it’s know for sure it’s inferior.
That being said, if we know exercise, good diet, massages, mind calming activities are good, even if it’s a placebo, it should be promoted ALONG WITH MAIN THERAPY.
Totally agree! With respect to CLL/SLL clinical trials, the best in my opinion are those that permit crossover to the out-performing arm. With respect to complementary therapies, I would like to see more discussion on these. Unfortunately, there is a great deal of competition from providers who like to make distinguishing between integrative holistic, complementary, etc., very difficult to their advantage. Approved therapies for CLL are nowadays very effective, so anything that dissuaded us from undergoing treatment with an approved therapy or a trial using proven drugs, or even drugs that look very promising from research testing, is in my opinion unethical.
Neil
CLL, blocked infected tear ducts, and DCR
Paper about immune deficiency in CLL
Covid infected CLL patients recovered!
The Impact of Diet on CLL
