I know this is a controversial topic, but would like to put it out there anyway and get some views.
There is a massive debate about fat vs carb and its merits on health in general. Any personal anecdotes or research that points to following a low carb diet for healthy heart health? What do cardiologists say about low carb? I do recall my cardiologist vaguely mentioning low carb? Not sure if it was for losing weight or something else tbh.
What do you guys think? My personal view is that too much of anything is bad - so I cant give up on wholemeal carbs or have low keto diet. Middle way is more sensible without the usual processed/bad stuff.
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I went low carb about 6 months after my heart attack. My primary driver was an intolerance to many of the meds I had been prescribed - I had to find a different path.
I was clean keto for just over 3 years and saw numerous health improvements, I became totally med free about half way through this. I was still having some issues though.
I changed my diet again at the start of this year, which I would now describe as 90% carnivore. I've seen further health improvements and am doing better now than even a number of years before my HA.
This is working for me and a particular set of issues I was facing. It doesn't necessarily mean it is suitable or would work for others.
With respect to bread, I was addicted to it and would have bread with every meal (wholemeal because I preferred it). Since going keto I haven't eaten any bread. I do miss it, but am of the firm belief I'm better off without it.
I have type 2 diabetes, recently heart failure EF 40% probably caused by my left bundle branch block and covid. I am also intolerant to many meds and cannot take statins as it sends my blood glucose into overdrive and was given spironolactone but it damages my kidneys. I have been on a low carb real food meal plan since July last year. Meat, fish, eggs, Greek yoghurt, vegetables, nothing processed, Lost 20kg in weight, blood sugars are now normal, just need to get my EF improved now. My tryclicerides are right down. It works for me but as you say it works differently for everyone.
Hi Sukaya, I was alarmed by the first sentence of your reply to AlfredV. I was diagnosed with left bundle branch block 10 years ago and told it was nothing to worry about! Would you mind telling me what your symptoms were as I’m worried.
Before taking any decisions, particularly based on "alternative" options such as high fat Keto diets etc, remember this is a progressive disease. It is very easy to get stents or a CABG and then embark on, as you say, controversial diets thinking they are the way forward, but you need to try and slow down the build up of plaque. It is very difficult to stop and certainly impossible to reverse. The patching up that has been done should be treated as a temporary fix that allows you to make lifestyle modifications such as diet, medication and exercise, which together are the only way forward in my opinion, and is certainly mainstream advice. If in doubt speak to a BHF Cardiac Nurse? When people talk about Carbs being bad for you they are mostly taking about refined carbs found in, for example mass produced bread, which at the end of the day is a processed food. Just try and cook everything from scratch as often as you can and make sure you have a proper exercise regime.
I think this is a great way to go. You know exactly what is in your food, and keeping carbs and certain fats low in your diet, alongside plenty fruit and veg, you'll do yourself the world of good.
Your thinking sensibly.A low carb/ high protein diet with restricted processed sugar and processed foods, with less salt, incorporating a variety of vegetables , fruit, grains and pulses and fibre , what's often known as "The Mediterranean Diet" , still seems to be the most recommended and successful 'Diet for Life' option for most chronic health issues , including heart problems. Avoiding artificial sweeteners, restricting alcohol and keeping an eye on your portion control is also part of the key to success, especially if you also need to lose weight.
The more extreme versions of a low carb diet , or high fat/ low carb diet like keto , paleo or carnivore aren't recommended by medical research for people whom aren't generally healthy or people whom have long term health issues, particularly if you also have insulin dependent Diabetes or certain kidney and liver conditions.
Basically it's because they can be overly restrictive, often nutritionally low, and unsustainable which can cause yoyo eating habits and an unnecessary increase in food guilt.
Many of the diets involve eating at least 50% less carbs (often 25 net carbs or less is the diet rule) than the minimum healthy carb intake for providing energy for basic body functioning each adult individual .
Plus, even if you eat healthy fats it is still better to eat less of them with certain cardiac and cholesterol or pancreatic issues.
According to more recent medical research into high fat / low carb diets research Consultants have concluded that the instant "cure" that many seem to experience is often anecdotal or short lived and the restrictive diets could store up problems which could affect your health in the future.
The most interesting conclusions from these pieces of research has been , however, that it's the quality of the protein , carbs and fats in the diet that has a more beneficial effect than the severe restriction in itself.
The extreme versions of low carb diets can also mean that people take in less of the essential vitamins , minerals and fibre which helps improve cardiovascular and digestive health as well as their role in supporting the bodies daily recovery from symptoms , reducing inflammation, improving brain health and helping us metabolise food and medications.
This can also be found at both ends of the scale with diets that are solely meat based or 100% plant based if certain nutritional groups are being left out altogether.
And, it can happen with other diet choices that are made based on recommendations like choosing to go gluten free or dairy free or overly restricting certain groups of fruits and vegetables without having yourself tested first to see if you have a medical intolerance to them which would mean you need to stop using them.
So why do people feel so much better on these diets if extreme restriction isn't the way to go?
Well, often it is because of that "Quality" thing the researcher's mention.
When a person goes on a very low carb / high fat or restricted foods diet they have to stop eating the types of foods that aren't great for your health in general like sugar, cakes , biscuits , sweets, alcohol, sweet drinks, ready meals , processed and junk foods, and they are forced to reduce their portions of unhealthy or "white carbs " like peeled potatoes, white bread , white rice and pasta which might have been too high on the menu in their previous diet.
These are things that can increase weight gain, cause sugar spikes , increase inflammation and are often "empty calories" which can also cause things like high heart rate and blood pressure or arrhythmia triggers to occur. They are tasty but not " quality" items for your health.
Removing these rather than going to extremes and cutting out nearly all of the carbohydrate from your diet is what makes people feel better , it's actually a coincidence of the fact that bad foods are restricted within those regimes.
They often also include more protein to keep you full longer and if the choices are right like lean white meat and fish, eggs or meat free proteins this also helps people to get energy and feel satisfied.
Increasing the Fats works in a similar way that using more fat in low sugar processed foods helps the cash roll in for the food industry, it adds taste and makes you feel happy. But if the individual chooses too many poor
fats like butter, cream , meat fat etc. it's not going to end well in time.
No matter what new healthy diet style you choose , even if you allow yourself the occasional or rare treat to sustain your good work , you usually limit these bad foods and need to replace poor quality foods with healthy ones without the same feeling of limitation or loss of fibre and nutrients .
With Patience, Persistence and Portion Control you also lose weight but in a way that doesn't go straight back on if you fall off the wagon or have the odd indulgence.
It's still a matter of cutting out the rubbish and not eating more calories than you require to fuel you each day that works, not torturing yourself eating stuff you hate or over restricted food groups in mad quantities that works in the end.
Most medically recommended diets recommend fruit , vegetables , and whole grains , pulses and fibre that are excluded in the extreme fad diet plans . They also suggest quality , polyunsaturated and lean fats in a more limited amount to get the balance between the benefits of certain fats alongside improving cholesterol.
Eggs, Olive, nut or seed oil and products, Nuts and Nut Butter, oily fish , some cheeses in controlled portions, avocado, all fit the bill.
Eating a sensible portion of foods such as , whole grains and seeded bread , spuds with skins, root veggies, pulses and beans, brown or wild rice, high protein or wholemeal pasta, oats and fibrous fruits like berries and bananas, even small amounts of honey or maple syrup, in other words, Complex , Quality Carbohydrates, that are enjoyable but can weight loss while also improving your health in the long run is a wiser option . Plus, when you are used to the small healthier changes you are more likely to stick to it for good.
Food is meant to be a pleasure not a punishment , and it can be with sensible , moderate changes rather than extreme limits.
It's still a matter of cutting out the rubbish and not eating more calories than you require to fuel you each day that works, not torturing yourself eating stuff you hate and restricted food groups in mad quantities that works in the end.
Thanks for your reply and excellent summary. I am glad to say that I am broadly following this type of diet.
I have cut out all of the junk food and also reduced salt dramatically. I have discovered that my palete has adjusted for the good. Also, this type of diet or a form of life - I can follow long-term too.
Have lost weight too in the process, which is an added bonus. Unfortunately, I dont know what is happning in the body on the back off this change - but suspect lots of positives.
Give it 3-6 months and go and have your blood monitoring done by the GP, especially your Diabetes and Cholesterol tests , again just another one of the indicators but good results add to that feeling that you've done a good job.
In the UK, cardiologists probably adhere more or less to the advice given by the NHS. The NHS has promoted for many years their Eatwell Guide, which is the one I more or less follow.
This guide hasn’t, however, been updated in the “fats” section, as it says you should go for low fat options. This opinion is a bit out of date as we now know that manufacturers (to get low-fat foods to taste acceptable) incclude all sorts of additives. And if these additives are those that you wouldn’t get in a normal kitchen, then our bodies dont know how to deal with them. I think dieticians would say to avoid these.
Anyway all this is based on my general interest in diets, not on specific research.
I’d fully concur with your remark at too much of anything is bad.
Have a look at the CSIRO diet guidelines and cookbooks. They’re great and the recipes are fresh and tasty.
I have for many years eaten a low ‘ish’ carb, high fibre, fruit and vege diet and have no cholesterol issues at all. My most recent CTCA showed 0% calcium in my arteries. Yes, I get that’s not ‘complete research’ but it works for me and especially as I’m almost 60. I obviously don’t have a genetic link to cholesterol either which helps!
I’m not a big meat eater, nor am I a fan of packaged, pre-made and processed food. It’s it’s not in its natural state - I usually avoid it. Obviously staples such as sugar, flour, milk etc is not included in that.
I believe in moderation for everything. Exercise, diet, sugar and fat. Just stick to the rule that the greater majority of your diet is good for you and don’t stress about the little bits you may splurge on.
No. As above, Ive never had cholesterol issues and have 0% calcium in my arteries. Apparently that’s unusual at my age (almost 60). My cardiac issues are electrical and genetic.
the first cardiologist I saw (who I subsequently ‘sacked’ as he had no bedside manner whatsoever and was generally evasive and unhelpful) did tell me that bread is the worst possible thing you can eat, closely followed by jacket potatoes. He claimed there is the equivalent of 14 teaspoons of sugar in the latter once the starch has converted into sugar. I haven’t fact checked his statements but he was very insistent.
Wow . I love jackets , but shocked about the sugar content you mentioned . Think I need to make different choices, especially as I like my spud smothered in cheese , which is not good for my cholesterol
As regards cheese, its best to buy mature cheese as a small amount is satisfying and brings the same flavour as much larger amounts of less mature cheese. All in moderation, as aged cheese has certain health disadvantages.
What a nonsense , he should’ve stayed in his lane . How many thousands of years have humans been consuming root vegetables , fruits , honey ? Sounds like your consultant heard a Michael Mosley or Tim Spectre ( Dim Sphincter 🤦🏼) podcast , both make a £££ living out of this type of business. The pancreas does a great job unless you are diabetic. Eating sugar does not cause diabetes. When you eat carbohydrates – which include sugary foods and starches – they are digested into glucose (also called sugar). Glucose is the body’s primary energy source. Glucose levels in your body are regulated by hormones; insulin lowers glucose and glucagon raises it. Diabetes is caused by an impairment in insulin secretion and/or function, not caused by sugar !
I suppose it’s like most things in life - everything in moderation. If someone is pre-diabetic, maybe a jacket potato limit would be sensible. I’m not a doctor or nutritionist - just recounted what my then cardiologist said.
Not strictly true Dwizza when you are discussing Type 2 Diabetes and Insulin Insufficiency. And remember , I'm not an advocate of extreme low carb diets.Over consumption of sugary and simple carbohydrates, combined with bad portion control , artificial sweeteners and poor nutritional value in foods eaten is one of the most common causes for Insulin Desensitivity and eventually Insufficiency to occur and eventually trigger Prediabetes and Type 2 variations in the otherwise generally healthy population.
Insulin insufficiency happens before we get the outward signs and symptoms of any type of Diabetes (including Type1 Diabetes variants) and can have various causes not just problems with the pancreas or metabolic dysfunction.
Insulin insufficiency originally caused by a poor diet , obesity, inactivity, required medicine induced diabetes, and nutritional or other hormone related deficiency causes for Type 2 Diabetes can often be reversed by improving the diet and reducing simple sugar intake and limiting simple , " white" starchy carbohydrates (but not overly restricting complex carbs below the bodies daily functioning requirements as in certain diet regimes).
I helped my Mother reverse her Type 2 Diabetes three times with diet management to the point that she no longer required medication, each time it was her return to eating too much sugar and processed foods with the rapid spikes and drops that causes that triggered her to become Type2 again.
My husband is adult onset Type1 and I've managed him successfully over the last 22 years with a sensible Mediterranean Diet with a controlled amount of complex carbs since his diagnosis. He's nearly 50 now and still on the same daily insulin doses with no additional diabetes related conditions because of these diet controls.
My Aunt had a rarer form of Medical or Type3 Diabetes caused by changes in her liver and kidney function after various surgeries, she also requires restricted sugars and fruits and lower carb intake because this is a more severe diabetes variant.
Different types of Diabetic require different restrictions on sugar and carbohydrate to maintain good insulin sensitivity and reduce the risk of other diabetes related conditions.
I'm not just talking about Diabetics either.Many people have insulin insufficiency or develop insulin Desensitivity before becoming Diabetic or ever developing Type2 Diabetes and are otherwise healthy commonly because of years of a diet to high in sugar and simple white carbohydrates.
The way they resolve the issue before they become Prediabetic or Type2 Diabetic and require any medication is to alter their diet and reduce their intake of processed sugars and too many simple starchy foods.
So the point about moderation, a diet not high in sugar and refined , processed carbs … the med diet .. which is what we were alluding to . The pancreas does a great job under normal conditions . Slather shite over the jacket potato , over eat , consume more calories than needed , eat processed food at the expense of nutrient dense whole foods… “years of diet im high sugars and white carbs” I’m not advocating that …
It's probably a good idea to point that out in your replies then because to state that sugar or empty carbs isn't an issue unless you are a diabetic, or that the pancreas does a great job whatever it's dealing with isn't accurate as a blanket statement.
I took the Zoe approach over about 18 months ago and learned that, through the testing, that we are all different so there is NO one approach. I can take some carbs but struggle with clearing fat from my system so need to be careful. I use Extra Virgin Olive oil a LOT as that has good evidence that it can be helpful and I do have some butter. We need fats especially as we get older so the worst thing you can do is go to a ‘low fat diet’.
Eat the rainbow has been my mantra for some years now and focus on gut microbiome so fermented foods - both vegetable and dairy, no processed meats, red meat restricted to once weekly, oily fish once or twice weekly, lots of pulses, eggs and whole grains - basically an adapted Mediterranean Diet.
I agree NO ultra processed foods - but that is incredibly hard to adhere to 100%, no sugary foods - preferably fresh and organic and freshly cooked - everything in moderation.
I assume that you mean a sugar spike? I didn’t - period. I was using a continuous sugar monitor for two weeks and never exceeded 7 and range was 4-7.
For fats - it was a one off blood test after controlled food intake. My gut test showed that I don’t have the bacteria in the gut to clear fats in the blood stream so I need to be limiting animal sourced foods.
Our genes determine to a certain extent, which food types are ‘healthiest’ for ourselves but even then individual context is everything.
The one thing we do know is that the WORST is UPF’s because our body has not yet evolved to process chemicals.
There is a pile of information now about Processed food and ultra processed foods. A lot of the former are perfectly healthy in themselves or in moderation.
It is the UPF stuff that on the whole needs to be avoided. Its worth looking at ingredients if you buy something regularly so you can determine if you should find an alternative.
Most ready made meals are UPF and so is a lot of vegan food and soya milk etc.
I too last year tried the ketovore diet and lost 14lbs in 3 months , the weight that I'd put on post heart attack piling myself with fruit and veg and actually went 1 point into being pre diabetic. I was completely unaware how much sugars are in things like blueberries etc . I went on holiday last November and things started creeping back into my diet as I knew they would and I put back on 9lbs . So mid January I restarted what you may call the ketovore diet (the only fruit/veg am I eating are avacado, mushrooms, peppers, cucumbers and tomatoes and got rid of 7lbs .I decided as I go abroad 3 times per year to just do what u want whilst on holiday, I'm currently on one now and back home on sunday and know I've added some weight but life is for living, I love /loved pizza, i had 1 last night , I was never a big chip eater but I had some on weds night with a tbone steak . Eating the ketovore way I've noticed big differences in my energy levels and dont feel as sluggish but I'm not doing it as a religion or banging a drum , I'm doing it as I enjoy the foods , nothing processed and I buy all my meat from an online butcher . I'm also of the view of I'd rather die on my feet than live on my knees so when iam on holiday I'm going to do what i want
You need to be very careful, particularly in your plan for holidays, and especially if your diet is very restrictive in general.People still need to take care on holidays as a big swing in activity , travel , added exercise, plus a sudden change in diet , and potentially alcohol consumption, can cause "Holiday Heart Syndrome" , a cardiac event brought on by sudden change in physical and mental stressors that seem to come like a perfect storm during holidays and events.
People know about it more because of hearing about it happening at Christmas, but it happens to many people on holidays and trips out too. People with cardiac and other health issues are more at risk of this than others.
My father's second major heart attack happened in those circumstances mid holiday , his fourth and final heart attack three days after Christmas.
Keto diets can also cause stomach cramps and a funny tummy if you decide to eat the odd slice of birthday cake after eating no sugar or wheat for some time. It's because the body reduces the amount of enzymes it produces and releases into the stomach to help metabolise sugars and gluten and therefore it's not prepared to cope with the digestion of these foods and you feel very ill even if you aren't intolerant to them.
A good tip is to actually bring in some small portions of complex healthy food options that contain sugar, wheat or gluten before you are likely to go on a holiday or to an event with food so you don't get this "rebound stomach" and add stress on your heart.
Second tip is even if you've prepared your body remember to keep to portion controls and limit yourself to the odd treat but still try to keep to your general healthy varied diet . And if you don't drink usually still stay off the alcohol.
Adding in plenty of short rests throughout the day rather than trying to be on the go in non stop fun you reduce your risk of having a heart event while on holiday.
People forget that Stress isn't just a bad thing.
It's just any physical or mental activity that's too much for the brain and body to cope with at it's current health level.
So a fun night out or holiday can cause the same Stress as losing a loved one or having an accident.
No , not at all, I've just seen so many people suffer with these things and my Mumsy side wants to help others suffer from it if I can..... especially on holiday there's nothing worse! As I usually say to people I'm too tired ( or too lazy😆😆😆) to get wound up about anything these days.
I understand what you are saying but when I say do what I want I dont mean eat cakes and trifles , I never have much and dont whilst on hol , I'm not a sugar freak , I've walked over 60 miles since arriving on the 14th and off for another one in a mo . The main weakness for me was barmcakes as I call them and bread . I've had 1 barmcake here so far although obviously a pizza is along the same lines which I mentioned was my treat . My job is also very physical so I'm not sat behind a desk or at home mon to fri , I walk between 4 and 6 miles per day just at work and have come off blood pressure meds . People get so fixated on what they eat and do it makes them miserable . Anyway theres a sunrise, something I now appreciate daily
Caleta de fuste, fuerteventura. First time in this resort , prefer jandia, morro jable tbh as I'm more of a beach lover . Booked to go to menorca at the beginning of oct , never been before. And costa teguise, Lanzarote in December, which I've been many times
Sounds great, I took a photo of the sunset a couple of nights ago on Anglesey pretty similar to yours, but I bet you didn't need to wear a bobble hat and coat when you saw yours, it's still so cold in the evening here in Wales!😆😆😆
I can't contribute much to your question as regards heart issues specifically but I can say that I have known several people who lived to 100 and beyond and they all just ate plain wholesome foods like meat fish eggs fruit vegetables nuts etc. None of them was vegetarian and they'd pry never heard of vegans. They were all physically active.
After my heart attack and the fitting of two stents I changed my diet, I wasn't overweight to start with but by cutting out sugers, treats, white bread and as much prosessed food as possible I've lost ten kilos and do feel generally better, pretty much followed NHS guidelines.
Hi,Everyone is going to have a different view on this, based in their own beliefs, what they have read, or what they have been advised/ told. My own personal belief I'd that I am happy eating an NHS healthy diet that includes all the major food groups. Protein, carbs, fruit and veg. I do t eat junk food and stay away from processed foods. Low salt and sugar, and brown bread, pasta and rice. My cardiologist recommended this diet, as did my surgeon when I had my gallbladder removed. It has to be right for you, and you have to weigh up all the pros and cons. I had to go on a liver shrinking diet for 2 weeks before having my gallbladder removed. It was an extremely low cal diet as the carbs were all weighed out and very restricted. The paperwork stated this was for temporary use as it was not a healthy diet. Most of the info I have read states that a low carb or no carb ( keto) diet is not good for heart health and can cause problems I the long run. Maybe others have read something else though. Having had heart attacks and a double cabg I am happy having listened to my cardiologist, surgeon and GP, and just follow a healthy diet which doesn't ex rude any major food groups. Good luck de doing what to do. Just di.whats right for you.
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