I had my CRT-D fitted 4 weeks ago. The ICD part as a precaution. No one in my medical team warned me that this could stop me driving - just that I had to inform DVLA. Imagine my shock this morning to receive a letter saying my licence has been revoked and I can’t reapply for at least 6 months!!
Has anyone else had the same - is this normal or did I inadvertently fill the forms in wrong?
I feel that getting back to my normal independent self is farther away than ever...
I'm really surprised that no one has explained this to you.
I had it explained to me by a number of people - the hospital which fitted my ICD, and also the cardio rehab team who went through this with me.
Here's link to the BHF article on driving
bhf.org.uk/informationsuppo...
Despite asking about driving I was not given much information really. Most just said there wasn’t likely to be an issue unless I received a shock from my device. Even the BHF article suggests that it’s only 4 weeks if you’ve had an ICD and didn’t have a cardiac arrest.
Did you have any dizzyness or fainting before the device was fitted? What was the reason for fitting it?
May be worth ringing the DVLA medical team to discuss why they've revoked your licence for that length of time &, depending on the reason why they've done so, perhaps your consultant could write to them.
Yes I had some dizziness on exercise but no fainting. It’s a good suggestion to call them, I’ll try that tomorrow. Thanks 😊
Good luck.
My understanding is that there are two classes for fitting an ICD
Primary Prevention - this is where the patient has not had a cardiac event and the device is fitted as there is a risk that the patient could develop an arrhythmia and the ICD is intended to prevent cardiac arrest - with this the licence is normally revoked for a month
Secondary Prevention - this is where the patient has suffered a cardiac event and the ICD is intended to prevent any additional life-threatening arrhythmic event in survivors of sudden cardiac death or patients with recurrent unstable rhythms - with this the licence is normally revoked for 6 months.
I'm wondering if you've told the DVLA you suffered from some dizziness, that may have let them to regard you to be in the category Secondary Prevention.
Do you have any paperwork from the hospital saying why they were fitting it, I had a letter(copied to my GP) saying it was being fitted for Secondary Prevention (I had suffered a cardiac arrest)
I'd ring your GP to see what he/she says
Thank you so much for explaining this - it helps me to start making sense of things.
Although I haven’t had a heart attack, cardiac arrest or fainted I did present with complete heart block (is that a cardiac event?). After many tests including MRI my cardiologist suspects Cardiac Sarcoidosis and on that basis he has fitted the ICD pending further assessment.
He has not been specific in the letters to my GP about whether this means Primary or Secondary prevention.
I maybe should have understood all this better before filling the DVLA forms out - I may have ticked the wrong box 😱.
Have a chat with your GP to get an answer as to whether it's Primary or Secondary - then have a go at getting this through to the DVLA. Good luck
Thanks I will do.
Like others, I am surprised you were not give information on the driving issue. As others have said it depends on the reason you had the ICD fitted. Another warning, don't wait until 6 months has been completed as it takes many months after you reapply to get the licence back. Once you reapply the DVLA will write to your consultant and or GP. They take about a month or longer to reply to the DVLA. Then a medical screener assesses your consultants report. My partner waited a full 11 months until his licence was returned. The DVLA said it had a large backlog of reapplications and we just had to wait.
Also don't forget you must tell your insurance companies. So car insurance and travel insurance.
On a positive note now you have the ICD implanted you have your very own paramedic with you 24/7. So relax and enjoy life to the full. My partner is 2 years post implant and we have just returned from exploring Japan. We are back to living life in the fast lane.
All the very best.
Gosh 11 months, I’d better start applying now!! Thanks for the warning!
I’m glad to hear that your partner is back to living life to the full. Japan sounds amazing.
PS I told my insurance company about the ICD - they said it made no difference and couldn’t even find it as a medical condition 🙄. That surprised me so I got them to make a note on my file that I’d informed them! Of course they may think differently now I’ve lost my licence ha.
Glad that it didn't affect your insurance but as you can't drive they should refund you the premium for the period you are off the road. Travel insurance is more difficult we have found only one company that offers us £10k worth of cancellation insurance. The premiums are also very much higher especially for USA insurance.
The DVLA is a real problem area. You can't reapply until you know your consultant or GP will say you are fit. They can't say that until you have 6 full months clear. My advise is to start the reapplication process about at about 4 months the DVLA will then write to your medic' to get the report. That way you should speed things up as they can at least give you the all clear at 6 months and you should shorten the period by a month or two. Hope that makes sense. We may just have been unlucky with the backlog at the DVLA.
Under the disability act, it is illegal for an insurance company to increase your premium/excess or impose terms because of your medical condition. If/when the DVLA confirm you can drive again, the previous loss of licence should not be an issue.
They can increase your premium if they have evidence that you are an increased risk. This also happens with travel insurance if you want cover for your pre-existing medical issues.
Travel insurance is completely different to car insurance. If the DVLA have confirmed you can continue to drive with your medical condition then, under the disability act, it is illegal for a car insurer to impose terms or increase your premium.
My professional field is Equality and Diversity but from Citizens Advice:
Example
You have cancer and apply for car insurance. Cancer counts as a disability under the Equality Act. The insurance company accepts to provide you with car insurance but only if you pay a higher premium than they would charge other drivers.
The insurance company is allowed to do this under the Equality Act but only if they can show that there's a greater risk in insuring you because of your disability. They would have to base their decision on your actual health condition and objective information about cancer. Also they mustn't have a general policy to charge people with cancer more as this would be unlawful discrimination.
I was in insurance for years and the only time I came across insurers refusing/imposing terms was for someone who did have cancer and the risk was linked to the driver taking morphine.
Any insurer would have to prove you are a greater risk then someone else with the same medical condition, that would be very difficult to do as a consultant/GP will have confirmed you're OK to drive. Plus the DVLA have clear guidelines covering medical conditions & will also have confirmed you can drive.
My husband has HF and has an ICD and he's never had to pay a higher premium or terms involved. Icd/crtd support-uk will be able to give more information.
Also, if you select the magnifying glass at the top of the page and type in car insurance you'll find lots of info on this subject.
Thanks for your reply. It may not happen often but it is legally a possibility. That is the only point I was making.
Hello, 3Squirrels. My husband had an ICD, and it was explained to him that he would not be allowed to drive for six months if it was activated. He had to not drive for six weeks after it was first fitted, but was OK after that as long as it didn't activate. However, he did have to retire from coach driving, as his PCV licence was automatically revoked. Understandably, he was extremely frustrated at not being allowed to drive for any period of time! I hope you get this resolved, and that you recover well from your procedure, and continue to have decent health for many years.
As a side issue I don't really understand this. Seems like the powers that be think it's OK to possibly cause one or two serious (or worse) casualties as a result of having an event at the wheel of a car, but not if it involves a bus load? If there is even the remotest chance that an accident could result then there should not be any debate surely? A mate of mine has just had his son knocked over on a pedestrian crossing by some old bloke who didn't even realise he had hit him, it's outrageous.
I tend to agree, lateguitarist - my own view at the time my husband had the ICD fitted was that I should take over driving us around. He was a professional driver, of course, and to have driving taken away from him completely was the ultimate "punishment", as it were. He abided by what he was told at the time, though. His illness (he had heart failure), though, progressed fairly quickly, and it was clear that he didn't actually have the strength to drive his car anymore, and he didn't drive at all for over a year before he died this June.
I too had a crt-d implanted in April this year. I was told very clearly no driving for 4 weeks and that if the ICD activated then I wouldn't be allowed to drive for 6 months. Reading the comments above I suspect that you had your license revoked due to previous fainting episodes. Your GP will have supplied the DVLA with your notes or relevant excerpts and it occurs to me that their criteria for the risk assessment will have ruled you out. If I was you I would contact the DVLA and your GP to get a better understanding and to see if your license could be reinstated as your device should vastly reduce the possibility of future fainting episodes. Hope this helps.
I have never had any fainting episodes due to my heart problems so I wonder if there may be crossed wires somewhere. Hopefully my GP or DVLA can shed some light.
Apologies, I miss-read your previous comment. Well that is quite baffling. I'm sure you could get it reinstated. Good luck.
Not sure what the difference is here, but I have a two lead Boston Pacemaker (CRT-P) I am also a type 1 diabetic insulin dependant and already have a three yearly restricted licence and when informed dvla of my pacemaker, there wasn’t a problem and just did the initial 4 weeks don’t drive recovery period. I do about 25k miles per year and it’s a devastating loss when and if the dvla take your licence away. it is even more of a loss if you know you’re a good driver and knowing there are idiots who are far more a danger to themselves and other road users are allowed to drive on our roads. You see it everyday: people on their phones; talking to passengers in their car and not concentrating on their driving; poor lane discipline like cutting into your lane when going around corners on two/three lane town roads and many more errors you see everyday...
Good luck!
You are not a good driver if you have a heart event at the wheel though, are you?
Neither are those who use their phones at the wheel.
There are more RTA’s caused by DRINK driving and whilst using a phone than any RTA caused by a heart event. You can prevent a death by driving responsibly i:e do not drink & drive and do not use a phone whilst driving!
I consider myself a very good driver 42yrs of driving experience. Driving my father’s car and van on our private land from about 8 yrs old onwards. I passed my test 1st time with examiner & chief examiner in the car in 1977, I also have an advanced driving licence and been on advanced police driver training courses and passed with flying colours. I like speed in the correct places and driving in all weathers and road conditions. I also have a motorbike licence and have a 900cc Italian bike; a 6.1L V8 American car; and a Mercedes Vito people carrier. I’m also a type 1 diabetic with a Pacemaker.
A heart event could happen to anyone at anytime and anywhere; it’s not just to those who have history of heart problems. Even the fittest/healthiest of people meet their demise unbeknown anything is going to happen and I know many who have gone that way and not through driving either.
Yes, no one is disputing the fact that you are are great driver, and that the roads are full of idiots who probably should not be allowed to be on them, we see them every day. I agree with you, the standard of driving is getting worse. Do you know when they changed the Highway code and started to advise that indicating was no longer necessary?
All I am saying, is that there is a greater risk from someone with a know heart condition, then this must be dealt with responsibly, irrespective of the drivers experience and ability. There was a program on only the other night where a guy caused life changing injuries to a totally innocent person, and guess what he had already had 5 heart attacks and had another at the wheel. If there is any doubt, we must always err on the side of caution and follow guidance from the GP?
I entirely agree. But was only emphasising that, phone users and drink drivers are a bigger threat to life on the road, than heart patients. But being mindful at the same time of one’s heart related issues.
I’ve used that non indicating rule for a while now, though I believe it’s courteous and pisses less people off if you do indicate. I tend not to indicate back into a lane on the motorway, but always indicate if pulling out to overtake. Another one, It’s surprising the number of people who won’t enter the yellow box whilst waiting to turn right, turning right and stationary in the yellow box is correct; it’s going straight ahead and stopping in the yellow box is when you’ll get a ticket.
Good luck!
Hi like the others I am surprised that no one mentioned a driving ban before or after your ICD was fitted. However when your 6 months is up and according to the DVLA if you if you have not been shocked and comply with there requirements you can drive, technically without a licence. The DVLA will dirt you to the appropriate we'd page for your information - good luck
Hi 3Squirrels
Actually, if you have had no ventricular arrhythmias that have caused you to black out, and your ICD was implanted prophylactically (in the event you will need it, but haven't needed it as yet) then you should only stop driving for 1 month.
Below is a link for clinician's to refer to, (it sounds like in your case the relevant section for you is 'Prophylactic ICD implant or ICD implanted for sustained ventricular arrhythmia not associated with incapacity' although your clinician can clarify this for you. and note there are several criteria to meet in order to resume driving after 1 month:
gov.uk/guidance/cardiovascu...
Hope this helps!
Ashleigh
sounds like you accidentally ticked the wrong box. So confusing the dvla’s medical questionare same questions repeated using different words sort of stuff; trying to catch you out. Scumbags!
I think you’re spot on there!
I surrendered my licence voluntarily after syncope, after 6 months & a successful ablation for svt it was reinstated after clearance by Dr's. I then had a pacemaker implanted & informed dvla but only had to stop driving for one week. ICD may well be different rules,
Seems neither my GP or Cardiologist have been asked for any info. Just spoke with the DVLA and they say because I have a CRT-D (pacemaker and defib) it’s not just a preventative measure even though I haven’t had a cardiac arrest or fainted .... I can apply again 8 weeks before the 6months is up so long as I haven’t had any issues in the meantime...
Did you speak to the medical department?
Hi I had mine 6 weeks ago and they should of told you it’s just a precaution just in case it triggers no one at risk
It’s only 4 weeks you will get a letter from DVLA and you will need to fill it in and they will reply back to you saying you can drive after 4 weeks all being well with your ICD
Nothing to worry about you can drive
Hope this helps
Hi
I had my i.c.d fitted August 2018 i had my car licence revoked for 6 months.
The hardest thing for me was my h.g.v licence also was taken and I will never get it back.
I've written letters to d.v.l.a stating they let me drive class 1 h.g.v. While using insulin . We're i could of past out of sugar went to low they came it's government legislation .
The defibrillator hasn't have me a shock up to now .
The DVLA seem to be a rule to themselves a lad I know had a ICD fitted when it was shown it wasn't required when it came to get his HGV license back they are telling him not while you have the ICD fitted whether you need it or not how can this be right
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