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Asthmatics' must start to take control of there own health

I have been on this forum for less than 2 weeks and have listened to what people are going through with there asthma I think all would love to be cured but this will not happen. Pharmaceutical medicines do not cure asthma they at best if you are lucky control it some people talk about this disease they have and seem to be waiting on the next major episode and tell what happened to them as they wait on the over worked N H S to come and save them please take control of your illness by all means use your meds to get you through a bad patch but look at other ways to keep you well ie eat loads of fruit and vegetables reduce alcohol intake stop smoking yes asthmatics' smoke and please research magnesium deficiency and symptoms of magnesium deficiency it can be taken orally or through the skin in the form of magnesium oil spray also look at the relationship between calcium and magnesium as calcification of internal organs ie heart lungs kidneys arteries is the main cause alot of illnesses

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Whilst eating healthily and leading a healthy lifestyle will help everyone I don't think it can help you gain much control of your asthma. It is a disease of the airways after all and regardless of how you live your life will kick off particularly in those who are severe. I doubt eating more fruit and veg will really help much then!

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what about the relationship between magnesium. And calcium calcification of organs fruit and vegetables are loaded with magnesium a mineral we all need to survive magnesium is needed in the body to allow calcium to reach the bones and teeth if there is not enough magnesium in your body calcium has to go somewhere ie your organs arteries joints brain causing untold damage or Harding of lungs heart joints brain fog if your lungs have deposits of calcium in them they will go hard you WILL have breathing difficulties look at it this way they put calcium in concrete calcium hardens concrete what do you think it would do to your lungs at best stop them from working normally so getting back to fruit and vegetables eating plenty of these will increase your magnesium level l hope you can see that what you have said about fruit and vegetables is wrong

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So I presume if everyone followed your advice asthma would be in not cured in fact alleviated and would require less treatment and admission to hospital? I have never heard of magnesium helping in respiratory disease? Perhaps you could put a link in here explaining this?

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yes some hospitals do give magnesium in there asthma protocol.all I am saying is this may help your asthma help you control your asthma stay out of hospital as much as possible an live your life to the full instead of waiting on the next episode like I did

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I can't see anything about asthma or magnesium in your link?

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sorry should have been medicalnewstodayasthmamagmesium

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Can you put the link in please.

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medicalnewstodayasthmamagnesium

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I don't see anything in there about magnesium helping to prevent asthma symptoms? This is what I read below:

'Doctors mainly use magnesium sulfate to treat people who are having severe asthma flare-ups.

Magnesium sulfate is not a first-line treatment for asthma flare-ups. Doctors typically only administer the drug in the emergency department, when other treatments have not succeeded.'

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yes but you said you have never herd of magnesium being used for asthma now you have

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did you get the link

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I find it hard to eat the amount of fruit and vegetables you should be eating but if you blend or juice them it is alot easier to digest

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I several occasions when I have gone to a and w with an asthma attack that give u intravenous magnesium because it helps the airways open , in my opinion it shouldn’t just be give at this stage

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Robert, the vast majority of people will get enough magnesium from their daily diet. There is more of an issue for older people - as there is with vitamin D - but that is not difficult to rectify. Nor is it the cure all you seem to think. I would also point out that it is not wise to have too much of it; that can do more harm than good.

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due to soil depletion there is alot less magnesium in our soil which means alot less in our food 80% of the population may be deficient in this mineral with regards to too much magnesium tell me what harm will it do

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I’ll give you your own suggestion in answer to that - do your research:-).

Seriously though, I’m afraid too much magnesium can result in it building up in the body (same as vitamin D in that respect) and that can cause problems. Check it out.

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I have researched magnesium if you take to much it can cause loose stools if this happens reduce your intake or use magnesium oil on your skin now you tell us what harm you have researched

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From the WebMD site on Magnesium

“Magnesium is LIKELY SAFE for most people when taken by mouth appropriately or when the prescription-only, injectable product is used correctly. In some people, magnesium might cause stomach upset, nausea, vomiting, diarrhea, and other side effects.”

The same site states that large doses (admitted very large doses) might cause serious side effects.

However the site has Asthma on a list where the benefits of magnesium are “possible” and not “certain”. There have been, apparently, conflicting results on how effective it is. That site states that

” Giving magnesium intravenously (by IV) seems to help treat sudden asthma attacks. However, it might be more beneficial in children than in adults. Taking magnesium using an inhaler might improve breathing in people with asthma, especially when used with the drug salbutamol. But conflicting results exist. Taking magnesium by mouth does not seem to improve attacks in people with long-term asthma.”

If you want to check it out:

webmd.com > vitamins > magnesium.

Or google Magnesium, uses, side effects, dosage and you should find the site listed.

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magnesium is found in food it cannot be patented so no money to be made by pharmaceuticals but something that can be patented money to be made steroids help but have serous side effects we still take them because they help us through like you said it has helped me. just passing on what I have found at least you are now looking at magnesium result goodluck

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The thing it causes is many trips to the toilet , vitamin d should be taken with K2 Mk 7 as this is a precursor to vit d and helps it to the right place

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The trouble is the way they grow things and what they use to grow things they have stripped all the natural minerals out of the soil ,like magnesium so a lot of people are becoming deficient. I personally take magnesium supplements and vitamin d

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hello shellc

I also take magnesium citrate vit d and calcium thankyou

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Please do not berate people who are trying to care for their health by learning more about asthma and and manage their condition by best advice and help possible. Nor, please, trivialise what people are going through. Good for you if magnesium and fresh fruit and veg etc etc is helping you, but please don’t assume that many others on here aren’t also eating healthily etc. As regards asthma it is patently clear if you do follow the posts that we are all different and we all deserve to be treated with respect.

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I hope I all ways treat people with respect as I have asthma myself but to ask people to take control of there own health is being disrespectful then I apologise but I still think you should research any thing that might or could help with your disease

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I would think most asthmatics are doing this already. I am not as I am mild and rarely have any problems but for those that do.....

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you should research you never know when it could take a turn for the worst god forbid I will try and send you some information on damage caused by calcification. Of internal organs and symptoms of. and I am on you side I hate to hear of people being ill and I might know something that could help them

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Why meet trouble half way? I have enough health conditions to worry about without dealing with what ifs!

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good luck to you keepwell

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And what makes you think that we aren’t? Robert I’ve lived with my condition for over fifty years. At the moment it is controlled by my meds. I know my diet is good (I’m currently under the care of a consultant gastrogenterologist and have had any number of bloods tests to check my nutritional intake - even he has had to admit he can’t fault it), but I also know that if I come off those meds my asthma will quickly spiral out of control. I’m doing everything I can, but there is only so much I can do. And if I get a viral infection, then even what I am doing now may not be enough. That is going to be true for a lot of people on here.

You might want to bear in mind that we are talking about what is acknowledged as being a highly variable condition. What works for one is not necessarily going to work another. It’s great if magnesium is helping you, but please don’t assume that what applies to you applies to everyone else.

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I am very pleased your illness. Is under control as is mine

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yes we are all different thank god this is why some of us get asthma others get heart problems kidney stones which are caused by excess calcium

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Thank you for your apology! In fact many on here do research and do their best to learn more about asthma in general and about their own asthma, as we are all different.

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"toplofty - having a feeling of superiority that shows itself in an overbearing attitude"

merriam-webster.com/thesaur...

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thankyou for your input

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If you have too much magnesium (ie >2 magnesium sulphate bags in a month) it can cause your airways to relax so much that it looses its shape and collapses on itself. Mag bags are usually only used as a last line of defence for asthma as it does relax smooth muscle thus the airways open however there is the risk of low blood pressure, tachycardia, dizziness and bleeding (among other things) so you’re always on a cardiac monitor when given it.

Any times I’ve discussed supplements (of any type) with docs/a nutritionist friend etc it’s always suggested I take vit d, potassium and vit c if my asthmas bad (mainly to off set side effects of meds or help with illness). Magnesium supplements are usually shrugged off when I ask about them and even vit d is starting to be stopped as a suggestion. I’m also told to try and eat the vitamins not get tablets cause it’s healthier and more natural, plus it’s cheaper (otherwise you’ll end up with expensive urine 😅)

If it works for you then stay with it, and it’s always worth a try if you haven’t yet tried and some people have found it helps. However saying that it’s not something that will help everyone.

Vitamin d is also not a major pharmaceutical money spinner however for a few years severe asthmatics were put on it as there was a suggestion that it may help with asthma control. Now a couple years down the line it’s becoming apparent that it doesn’t do that much for most asthmatics so it’s coming off prescription and is being suggested as a supplement less and less. There is a lot of money to save for the NHS if there was a wonder vitamin/mineral which would help stop/control asthma and if/as/when it’s discovered it will be highly profitable to any producer cause all asthmatics would be put on it.

I think the difference in asthma types is as big as between type 1 and type 2 diabetes. Type 1 is usually seen as a fault of the body requires insulin and nothing can be done to to prevent an unstable diabetic from having hypos. Whereas type 2 is usually ‘blamed’ on the individual and their lifestyle as initially it can be controlled by diet/lifestyle etc, can occasionally be reversed etc. It’s the same with asthma, some severe asthmatics are unstable and no matter what they do are always 1 step away from an attack. Yes living a healthy lifestyle can help however it won’t take you off that cliff edge. Other more mild asthmatics do find that a healthy lifestyle can stop almost all symptoms however it still won’t stop them having attacks.

Most people on here (me included) are either looking for support or advice (or the silver lining of their condition). Personally I do as much as I can to help myself, but sometimes I just can’t and it’s at that point I seek further help. However I am now a severe, unstable, difficult-to-control atopic and eosinophilic asthmatic. I used to be mild EIA and when I was I was a national level gymnast who competed in friendly internationals. This did not stop my asthma issues nor did it prevent it from spiralling to where it is now (despite having a nutritionalist etc at the time). I have never smoked (nor did my family), alcohol is a trigger for me so I don’t drink, and I eat as healthily as I can (barring the odd take out and chocolate snack 😉). As I said some things work for some but not others as asthma is such a variable condition, just try not to tar everyone with the same brush.

I’m glad magnesium works for you and I hope others on here will find it just as helpful

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if you get your magnesium through food naturally none of these things will happen as regards magnesium sulphate ie Epsom salts you should only bath in it not ingest it if you don't want your airways to collapse

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Hi I know I was just explaining side effects of Hypermagnesemia, as many people are unaware that there is a ‘cap’ on how many mag bags you can have in a short amount of time. I usually get my mag from nuts, spinach or potato skins (yum ☺️). However these symptoms can come on through normal food if eaten to extreme excess or if you suffer from certain conditions (usually kidney related). Normally we pee out the excess (hence the expensive urine 😉) so don’t get too many issues with side effects.

For those interested here’s the info about hypermagnesemia ( medicalnewstoday.com/articl... ). Robert1957 has already posted a sight about hypomagnesemia.

On the other side here’s asthma.nets opinion and explanation about if/how magnesium works.

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nuts are good

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now that's what I call waffling lol

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Taking vit D was suggested to me by an Asthma U.K. nurse about a year ago or so. However, as I am rubbish at pillpopping, (unless really needed) I didn’t really get anywhere with it, so months later when I was having a blood test anyway for something that has nothing to do with asthma, I asked my vit D levels would be checked as well. It turned out I was not just low,but deficient, and I immediately was rung up and told to collect a prescription. Now one thing I think it has helped was that I was had started perhaps a year or two earlier to get very achey in my thighs when I went for walks, and I think that is now wholly gone. Apparently a lack of it can cause calcium to reduce in your bones, osteomalacia, and that gives aches, as I learned. So now I carefully take vit D, but I will ask for them to check my levels again at my annual review. None of this had anything to do with asthma, but we don’t have enough sun in this country for six months of the year to manufacture enough vit d, thus my descent into vit D deficiency. I also make sure I wave my limbs about in the sun a bit more in the summer, without getting to burn levels.

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I always have low levels (but no deficiency). My hosp finally decided that that was just my normal level cause my blood came back at basically the same level before and after being on the vit d tablets. Vit d does do a lot just not as much as previously thought 😅. It is low in most British people cause of our wonderful weather, so it’s worth getting checked if you have weird and wacky symptoms (muscle aches etc). I’m glad yours got caught and that your thoughts don’t ache as much ☺️. Happy sun waving ☺️

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Given that you were a gymnast you must have something of an advantage when it comes to your bones though. They must be so strong.

One of my sons is part of a long term research project looking at childhood development. One of the things that was checked in him was his bone density. When he was in his mid teens they were astonished at his level of muscle development and bone density. But he was at a school that did a lot of sport and, fortunately, his asthma was never badly triggered by exercise.

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Gymnastics definitely helped with the bone density! After about 2 years of high dose steroids (40 tail off to 0-10, 2 days back up to 40 and repeat), I had a DEXA and bones are apparently still super strong (tho probably not as good as they were 😅).

I also blame the gym for my high best PF (630) which initially caused me issues cause my 50% is about 70% my predicted (440) 🙄. The arguments I had in a&e when I’d be told it either wasn’t asthma, or I wasn’t that bad and could go home (despite wheeze and being lower than my 50%). Luckily a lot more docs now know to work with the actual not the predicted (plus I’m now classed as severe) so this is a fight I haven’t fought for a while (yay 🥳)

I’m glad you son is doing well and impressing the docs 😉

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His asthma is now mild and intermittent to the point of almost non existent. He still has inhalers though; he’s very aware he can still get attacks (he ended up in ER eighteen months ago after being triggered by dust when moving into a new apartment). He doesn’t exercise so much now, doesn’t have the time anymore.

It’s one of the reasons I keep up with the ballet (another good one for bone density) although in my case I also need it for strength - being hypermobile has its downside - and the aerobic element coming in short bursts makes it the ideal form of exercise for me.

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My vitamin D levels were found to be low a couple of years ago. In fact, they were reported as being so low that everyone was astonished when I said I had no symptoms - which I hadn’t. I was put on 20,000iu a day for fifteen days after which I was supposed to go on 800iu for 30 days. Five days into the first lot of vitamin D I started to get joint pains in my fingers; day six joint pains beginning in my knees. At that point I consulted my GP and came off them. We agreed that I should instead go on the 800 dose and have my Vit D levels checked at the end of the course. As it was in summer I spent fifteen odd minutes outside at lunchtime - half of that facing into the sun, half facing away (though always wearing a hat). I’m fair skinned, but that small amount of sun meant I never burned and scarcely even tanned. My GP, who had sounded a bit skeptical, was astonished to find that my Vit D levels were well into the normal range at the end of those 30 days. She even asked how I had done it.

I think, as EmmaF91 has suggested, that different people have different “normal” values, and it’s risky to generalise (that’s something that some medics could learn as well when it comes to Peak Flow readings). It’s true of lots of things: I’ve had nurses getting worried about my blood pressure which is naturally low. I’ve also had a consultant think I’m nuts when I expressed concern for a rather higher than normal blood pressure reading for no reason that I could think of. His comment was along the lines he had patients who would love to have a blood pressure like that. Maybe, but that didn’t take away the fact that it was high for me:-).

I remain unconvinced about the need for supplements. I have a 95 year old father, still able to get around (with the help of a walking stick) and still in full possession of his wits. He’s never taken a supplement in his life and never needed to. I’m pretty certain I can say the same of a number of other nonogenarians I know/have known, and even more octogenarians - and they are all living in the U.K. (or were) and have been (or were) for either the vast majority or all of their lives. But they all eat/ate what would be considered a good diet in moderation throughout their lives.

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I take Vit D for the same reason- I h@ve been deficient a coupe.of times and it made me achy and affected my mood (I think - low mood for no obvious reason plus the aches and read Vit D can affect mood). There is no way I get enough in winter ans may not do in summer at times if staying indoors with lungs/bathing in SPF50.

I tried magnesium spray before but did nothing for my asthma. Mag sulph in A and E does- though hadn't clocked it could actually cause tachycardia. That dr who said I didn't have asthma and she was giving it to lower HR was being even more useless than I thought at the time- but at least it got the result I needed, even if she didn't intend to (HR came down.due to asthma improving).

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I’ve often wondered about this Emma, having done gymnastics myself. How were you with the chalk?

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When I was a gymnast (and only mild) I was fine with the chalk... the pit gave me issues so I landed on a matted pit usually. Now (as a coach) the chalk is a trigger too but only when the kids play with it and create ‘clouds’. The kids I coach learn very quickly that this isn’t acceptable behaviour (I teach the little ones). Were you affected by the chalk?

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I don’t recall being affected by it, though to be honest I didn’t use it much. Gymnastics in the late sixties early seventies was a very long way from what it is now:-) I had hand guards (a very small pair - I have tiny hands, even as an adult I need child size gloves) and used those with only a small amount of chalk - but only on the A bars.

We didn’t have landing pits either. The most we had were crash mats:-). A lot has changed.

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Well put Emma i myself only get mag on iv in resus and have been told that its usually only once a month that i can get it. I have tried to supplement my diet with calcium and magnesium more because of high doses of pred but have not seen any great changes. I also read and try everything i can do manage my asthma as being self employed everyday in hospital costs me more than most. Yes alot of people post their woes on here like myself but i read with interest on everyones symptoms and what helps. What really is the point is that we all are different in our own bodies even most consultants and doctors i have seen will tell me the same unless we speak out and discuss our symptoms they can only guide us. Thank you for all your replies and comments Emma as i know you have helped myself.

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ty

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no are you make your point

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I read about all types of illnesses asthma,heart,joint pain ,skin disorders mostly illnesses that effects me my family and friends to see if there is any new information or treatments that will help.

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While I agree that asthmatics have to do more then rely on medication to control their asthma, It just isn't that simple. I would say asthma libed sith me for 50years...with most work colleagues not even being awsre I had it. Dont smoke, dont drink alcohol, eat healthily and 6mths before I took my first major atttack that landed me in hospital ran a 10km run.... Now I am lucky if I can walk much let alone the thought of running.

Yes many asthmatics smoke..... But not all of us.!!!

As for magnesium it isn't the wonder answer for us all either, as the hospital doctors have finally realized with me. After sevetal days of infusions, with no improvement and being rushed to ITU and saying good byes to family..... Well more of a rasp goodbye.

Yes sometimes it can be infuriating reading some peoples posts and i hear myself asking Why did they do that?, but no point stressing over it.

Sorry to rsnt, but really find heneralized statements as frustrating as non asthmatics givng advise on how i shoyld breathe and just out mind over matter

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good luck and I hope you keep well

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I don’t usually wade in on more ‘heated’ discussions but felt I needed to.

As with any other health condition, we are all different and will experience it differently but the common symptoms will be the same.

I’ve lived with asthma for 32 years now and believe you me, I have researched and tried to avoid (easier said than done) my triggers, I’ve found out more about my condition and what it does to my body, I’ve tried a whole host of things to help my asthma; diet, hypnotherapy (stress is one of my biggest triggers) acupuncture, you name it, I’ve tried it. I go to my consultant with a pre written list of questions and I push to get the treatment I need. I eat a healthy varied diet, yes I do indulge no and again, who doesn’t, I exercise, sing, dance and although I have to be sensible, I won’t let my asthma rule my life, I’m not defined by it. I’m also pretty sure I’m not alone in this and many, if not all of us on here do the same but sometimes there is only so much you do for yourself and by sharing advice on here, I’ve already learnt loads more. Yes, people do need to help themselves and I’m pretty sure we all do, but medical professionals are also there to help us because they have the expert knowledge and training and the onus shouldn’t always be on the patient to push for treatment as not everyone feels comfortable doing this or is able to do so.

Magnesium IV does help get me out of a severe attack and I have been tested for a magnesium and vitamin d deficiency and both tests came back fine. I was also told that I should be getting enough of both from my diet so no need for extra supplements, this however won’t be the case for everyone and I get that.

I don’t think you meant to offend anyone but maybe the post could’ve been worded slightly better to upset fewer people. The very fact that we’re on here, sharing advice, hints, tips and just generally trying to chivvy each other along should tell you that actually we want to know more. If I didn’t care, or more take responsibility for my own condition, I wouldn’t be on a forum where I can get advice from other asthmatics, does that make sense?

I think I will speak for most when I say that we are all trying our very best to manage our condition ourselves to the best of our ability. We all know the pressures out NHS is facing but asthma is a beast, sometimes it can just spiral out of control and you need medical intervention and when it’s your breathing, to me, that’s not the kind of thing you should be taking any kind of risk with! If I feel in any doubt that I can’t get myself out of an attack I will get help, I and I’m sure the paramedics would much prefer to treat a struggling but alive me than a me who left it too long and now needs CPR.

Asthma is a minefield, I’ve lived with it for a long time but I still learn more about it on a daily basis and I’m sure I will continue to do so. Mine can flare up without any seemingly logical explanation and this is made all the more frustrating by how much I do try and do to help myself.

We are all entitled to our own opinions, you have stated yours and now I’ve stated mine. I wish you well on your asthma journey.

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None of those apply to me. Sometimes, no matter how good a patient you are, it blows up beyond what the patient can manage on his or her own. I’ve been hospitalized 12 times this year, five times in ICU. And the year isn’t over. My personal statistics say that I’ll be there one more time before the end of the year.

All other possible explanations have been thoroughly explored and rejected by really good doctors.

Just a warning about magnesium. If it isn’t low, or you take more than you need, it can cause intestinal cramps, loose stools or diarrhea. Work with your doctor even with supplements.

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have a look at the Side effects of the meds you are taking frighting

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Who here do you imagine isn’t familiar with their meds?

I’ll tell you one of the possible side effects of not taking my meds: death. I’ve been in the hospital for asthma 11times this year, including five stays in intensive care.

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no one is telling you to stop taking your meds

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No, you just seem to be saying from one of your comments below that they do as much harm as good. For some individuals some will cause issues, but there are, thank goodness, alternatives that can be tried if that occurs. The consequences of not taking them can be catastrophic- and would be even for a well controlled asthmatic such as myself. I will also point out that some people have negative responses with some vitamins. I know of one person who has to be very, very careful with Vitamin D.

As far as the inhalers are concerned please note they are listed as “possible” side effects - and actually, despite the fact that I’ve been on inhalers for very nearly fifty years, thirty of those on steroid inhalers, I don’t seem to have had much in the way of them.

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that's good for you you are lucky .all drugs be it pharmaceutical vitamins or mineral or even foods can cause side effects to different people so (possible side effects) is a term that all things we ingest should be used.

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Well done robert1957 the most lively discussion on here for many a day! Like you I think it's good to explore your own options but after saying that not convinced by use of vitamin supplements but agree diet and lifestyle are important, for me it's exercise. A trigger is too much alcohol so I try to be sensible but I cannot fathom how an asthmatic could continue to smoke!

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hello noddy66

yes it appears I have annoyed a few people believe me it was not intended but In saying that asthmatic people are now aware of magnesium and how it could or might help them love or loathe it check it out you could be one of the lucky one's it helps. foods is the best way to get it this was not enough for me it might be for you good luck.

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our doctors nurses consultants all work very hard to give us the best treatment's available at the minute the pharmaceuticals are spending billions of dollars developing new drugs to treat our symptoms some work for some people some don't the key word is symptoms when they develop a drug for a symptom and it helps that person you are almost sure other symptoms will appear and then other drugs are needed for those symptoms and so it goes on it does not pay them to find cures I hope what I've said here doesn't upset anyone but helps them find what will make them fit and healthy to enjoy life the way they were ment to

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The only thing I would say about smoking is that it’s harder to kick than heroin. So I give a lot of slack to people who struggle to quit.

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Hi Robert,

Thank for the magnesium tip on the other post I have since starting taking magnesium supplement. With reference to the above post I have had asthma ll my life. For the last 15 years i have either been cycling or lifting weights. for around 8 years my diet was super clean and my asthma still flared up. I agree some people should take better care of them selves but for some people this isn't enough.

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hello dean yes you are right you can look after yourself and still be affected by asthma please research as much as you can about magnesium and it effects on you. if you can eat foods rich in magnesium it is the best way goodluck

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hello Dean its easy to checkout how much magnesium you are getting from your food.

write a list of all food eaten that day then check how much magnesium is in everything you have eaten when you add the magnesium in mgs it should be about 420 mgs ie 1 banana 🍌 = 27 mgs.

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hello

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