Hallo Everyone. To introduce myself: I'm an english woman living in Germany. I went to work here, met my husband and stayed and have now been here for 45 years.
I had Bronchitis badly as a child and my parents both strong smokers. Also one set of grandparents.
Since about two years, I have had this cough that I could not shake off. I think it started after a series of cold infections. My daughter is a doctor (Psychiatrist) and married to a doctor from our local hospital. She and her family lived next door and my son in law often came home with a bad cold. My little grandchild usually got it and passed it on to us. We are both in our 60s and probably my immune system not what it used to be.
I could live with it up till now and Asthma never crossed my mind but this year it got so bad that I again went to a doctor. The first one could not tell me why I was coughing as I was. My lungs ok but he did say that the bronchia is not working properly. Please excuse my English, but have been speaking German and French (French in the family) for such a long time on a daily basis.
To cut it short I went to see a specialist about three weeks ago after fits of coughing. You could say spasms. And this doctor diagnosed me with Asthma. I have never smoked but of course, smoked passively all my childhood and teenage years until I left home. And the mentioned infections.
Am trying to find the best inhaler for me. He prescribed something with steroids at first but I read that one in ten can get bone softening and as I had a bad accident as a young seventeen year old and a lot of problems with walking later in life, this is the last thing I want to risk. One of my friends, a british, retired male nurse living in Spain, said that I could possibly use a non-steroidal inhaler and my doctor agreed to this. The question now is whether to use one as necessary or to use one where you use regularly every day. I read about one of these inhalers that if you use the one every day some people get problems if they have to stop using for some reason. And then the situation is worse.
How do you know what is right for you? My doctor who first put me on steroid inhaler - I just think it is too much too soon. I can still do that if I get really bad.
Would appreciate any advice you can give me. Thank you and look forward to being here.
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Pardon me if this seems a little blunt, but why would would you consult a specialist asthma doctor, and then ignore his specific advice, and instead be influenced by an opinion from a psychiatrist, a comment from a retired nurse, and fear of an accident that happened 50 years ago?
If your house had a hole in the roof would you really ignore the advice of the tiler and instead take the word of the plumber and the retired electrician?
Let's not beat about the bush here. An asthma specialist has diagnosed that you have asthma. Asthma kills. In the UK around 1400 people die each year because they have asthma. That's equivalent to 20 Grenfell Towers. And those deaths are largely preventable.
I've had asthma for most of my almost 60 years on the planet, and if there's one thing I've learnt it's that medics who specialise in asthma know far more about it than do their non-specialist colleagues. My experience of the medical profession is littered with examples of well-intentioned but fundamentally wrong asthma advice.
I'll never forget the well-meaning paramedic (who should have known better) who said to me, mid-full-on asthma attack "OK, just breathe normally". If the ability to speak had not deserted me then I'd have immediately re-assured that paramedic that were I able to breathe "normally" then most most certainly would have been doing so all along.
Be re-assured. In general terms inhaled steroids are regarded as very safe. The dosage is very low, and the delivery method highly-targeted. And they are proven to work.
Hallo Tim. In my life (I am 68 years old) I have been involved with doctors many times. We have doctors in the family. I had a very bad accident at the age of seventeen and narrowly escaped death. But so much damage (and not to the brain although your reply seems to imply this - thanks all the same but a bit of a sharp answer and I have reasons for my actions) that I am suffering the aftermath now.
Had I blindly listened to every doctor I met since then I would not be here now as they would have x-rayed me to death by now. They do that here in Germany and people just go along with it, without giving it another thought.
My oldest daughter who was prescribed cortisone for her eye, which was going blind, would have had a problem with her bones and I was right to stop using this on a child, although urged to and told that it would be on me if I stopped. Instead, I took her to Moorfields eye hospital in London and the head of this hospital told me if it were his child, he would not have given her cortisone for an unlimited time either. I gave her oil of evening primrose and time and 98% of her vision returned.
Specialist - they might call themselves that but they make mistakes and you might be one of those who blindly follows but had we done this my husband might not be alive today. A specialist wanted to give him an operation four years ago (heart) that involved using Aspirin for life, although it was known that he is allergic to Aspirin. I went home and on the computer and found out for myself and mentioned it the next day. At that time my youngest daughter was travelling the world or she might have warned us. The outcome was that in the end he got the right operation.
My ex -son in law is a specialist for kidney disease and is such a weirdo that he whistles every time he comes home and has signed a death certificate. It brings him 300 Euro extra. Maybe you are the unrealistic one because it is known here that side effects cause massive death yearly. Alone using rheumatica/medication for rheumatism - also often recommended by "Specialists". It kills. And it is like Russian roulette to use it. This is not from me but was talked and publicised on tv and in the papers for months as many die yearly from the "side effects". I have had pain most of my life due to the injuries I sustained when seventeen years old and involved in a horrific accident, that left me in a coma and half dead, but I managed without this medication throughout my life. Instead I went swimming and did gardening, went cycling - Movement - it did more for me than any medication would have and I am still here. There are alternatives to a lot of things and without this kind of risk. But most doctors prescribe the quick fix of course.
Before you tell me Asthma is a different cup of tea - I am aware of this. My dad had Asthma through heavy smoking. I saw what it could do and I saw him die.
I never smoked all my life but probably did it through my smoking parents. Passively.
As an example - Doctors here were also behind hormone replacement automatically for women after menopause - I refused to take it after reading a lot about it in the London Medical journal. My daughters. And also on the internet. And I was proven right as two years later they no longer urged us to take this. Germany is often behind in things. It takes years before a new medication is allowed and often they are still doing the same old thing even when there is a new way or doctors in the States have warned against something - that it causes breast cancer. I know there are cases where women have to do this but not healthy normal women. I do listen to my instinct and common sense too. And I research a little before rushing into something. And do not panic. I mean I have had this for three years, although admittedly it has got worse the last months. So a few weeks more will not kill me. I did take something with cortisone for 7 months but did nothing to get rid of this cough. This was prescribed by a lung specialist when I was trying to find out why I am coughing. No diagnosis only this. At least I have a diagnosis now.
I am aware that most good medications do not work without some side effects and also that in some cases there is no choice. But I want to make sure what is the best for me in my own specific case. Not all Asthma is the same level is it? Maybe I am not as badly off yet, although I know it is a progressive disease but why start with a cannon if a bullet will do? Many doctors prescribe the full drone when not necessary. They think their patients want the quick fix. I remember talking to a doctor I had when this man came in asking for something. The door was open and I was witness to them talking outside. My doctor of then, came in flustered and annoyed and said - him again. I gave it to him although it will not do him good but if he wants it! He must have seen the look on my face and asked me - what do you think. I had been to see this doctor about 10 times over the past 5 years. I am no doctor and did not want to become involved but he insisted so I said, "Maybe not a good idea to give something that will not do a person good, just to get rid of him". I should have put it differently maybe but it was what I thought. I was told to find another doctor and when I asked - and what about my blood that I had just given in two vials, he replied - we will throw it away.
No I don't trust specialists blindly. Sometimes a head of the nursing unit in a well known hospital, who has done this for many years, has almost the same amount of knowledge. I am not saying in all but have you any idea how easy it is to become a doctor these days or to specialise? I have. I have watched it from the inside and they do not call it the killing season for nothing each year, when young doctors are let loose on the public. Some like my son in law come from a nursing background. Or cook or whatever. Medicine is open to all kinds of people and some of them not Einsteins either. They make mistakes, in case that was lost on you.
I know Asthma can kill and you are probably so passionate in your reply due to your own experiences. But maybe my level of it is not as bad as yours yet. I don't want to panic and take something that is irreversible. By that I mean that if it says often when telling you that one in ten can get soft bones - that is maybe something a not made public and people do not know, but the pharmaceutical firms producing this stuff know. And they don't write it in there for nothing. One in ten is a big risk and I don't think that soft bones is something you can change, once it has happened. If side effects are so that once you stop taking whatever you are taking, and it goes back to normality later - I am ok with anything like that. Like the pneumonia one in ten can get. Safe - how can you say steroid medication is safe when the firms who make it write about side effects. That is not safe. My husband takes a medication for his heart. He had three Bypass operation and has to take it all his life. Until he got the right one for him he tried 5 different types and reacted badly. Side effects can be death on this and he was lucky to have a doctor at that time who said - stop straight away. The one before said it will pass carry on taking. Had he done that !!! So much to specialists. They are human like us and they differ.
I haven't suffered with joint problems due to numerous breakages in my accident, all my life - and been careful and am still relatively fit at this age, despite some pain sometimes - to take some idiotic medication that could make my bones go soft. It is not a small thing after all.
Especially not if there is another way. I am not blindly taking what my nurse friend told me either, or my psychiatrist daughter. I am gathering information and then I will decide together with my specialist doctor.
You people - you look up all there is if you buy a new car but when it has to do with your own one and only body you have, you rely on others to decide. You do not know that person and if his decision is the right one, just because his title is Specialist. There are many specialists that make big mistakes, let me tell you. It is in the papers and on the news often. I have heard and seen it often and I know people it happened to, including people in my family. If that is the way you want to go then good luck but it isn't the way I want to go.
I came here to find out about medication and what options there are. There are many types of inhalers not just the one kind. Please - I appreciate your reply even though the tone could have been better. Why the aggression? Or maybe it just seems that way to me. I thought it was bad enough living here and that going on an english speaking forum would be better. Here there is the mentality of "do as you are told". I never have and it has served me well up till now. Please - no offense intended. Just an explanation.
"If there's one thing I've learnt it's that medics who specialise in asthma know far more about it than do their non-specialist colleagues. My experience of the medical profession is littered with examples of well-intentioned but fundamentally wrong asthma advice."
I agree with you partly on what you write above. Usually we do go to the specialist. The one I went to was one of four. Three of them did not even recognize Asthma as my problem. What about that for a laugh? I would not listen to my nurse friend either, who is intelligent enough to tell me about something like subutamol - taken by a well known cyclist. But added - find out first what is best for you. I am no specialist for Asthma. I am aware of this Tim. But one doctor prescribes this and another that inhaler, or are we all taking the same on here?? And I want the one that is best for me in my situation. I am not a silly woman that goes on forums either and takes their word for it point blank. I am trying to find out about my illness and what options I have. What is best for me.
Specialists have a habit of often prescribing that which they give to all, even if there are other options. Specialists here have "arrangments" with pharma companies. They often earn if they keep on prescribing just the one medication.
PS do not know where to correct anything you write on here or if that is possible. I wanted to shorten my reply to you Tim and take some of my irritation out of it but could not see how or where. Anyway - when you read my reply I want to add that I do appreciate you meant well. And of course it makes more sense to go to those who are supposed to be in the know. I suppose I am a bit of a burnt child (is that even an english expression - have been away too long) and careful. No offense to you intended and thanks again. Happy Holidays.
What a fantastic reply TimN. Please listen to him and as he said there is a very low dose of steroids in preventatives and if taken regularly could save your life. If you have any worries or fears please go back to your asthma specialist to discuss them. Good luck xxx
Thank you. I am doing just that or have done just that a few days ago and have a different inhaler now - new inhaler is called spiriva respi2. I am trying it and hopefully it will do the job. Dare I even ask if anyone on here is using this one? As a side effect - and I think people should consider these - it said that if someone with COPD stopped using this for whatever reason, COPD would worsen. It did not say that about Asthma though.
All this is new to me and I am trying to find out the best way to go. I have another appointment with my doctor end of January. Thank you for your support and good wishes. Nica
I take Spiriva, but not on its own. I also take Flutiform 250mcg and also Montekukast. I also have Fluticasone for my nose and fexofenadine for allergies. Have taken all this for years. They certainly keep my asthma mainly under control. It is worth the trade off in order to breathe. No side effects noticed yet, and infact, I had a repeat bone density scan recently after 3 yrs, and my bones had improved slightly. The scan was due to another problem, but it shows the inhalers aren't damaging my bones seeing as they have improved. Xx
Thank you S4rLou.... Why do you take more than one type of inhaler? Is Spiriva not enough for your Asthma now? Did you get Asthma after the age of 40 or have you had it since you were young?
The inhaler first prescribed to me where one out of ten people get pneumonia, softening of bones or even worse Asthma, among other things and that has steroids, is called Relvar Ellipta. Do all medications with steroids have these side effects mentioned about as Often? One in ten I mean? Is Flutiform like that?
Thank you S4rLou. I appreciate your reply and help.
I actually mainly wanted to find out if I should take something regularly or something like salbutamol which does not work 24 hours and take as needed. My Specialist doctor said that is my decision but not knowing much about this illness I don't know what is best.
I take Fostair 200 every morning and night. It is a preventative and it works for me. The salbutamol which has no steroid in I use as and when. I very rarely use this except if I have a chest infection which is not often. I was told that if you have to use the salbutamol more than six times a week then your asthma is not under control xx
Hallo Karjade, Thank you very much for this information about Fostair200. The person who was a head nurse in a mental hospital for 40 years, told me about salbutamol and that the well known cyclist is accused of using it too much and often so that it is almost a kind of doping. Also it lasts only 4 hours, if I am not mistaken and so a disturbed night. Although I am getting old and have to get up once nightly anyway but maybe through this more than once. So I am tending not to take it.
Am not taking this lightly believe me and realize it is an illness where control is needed. Has Fostair 200 got steroids in it? Are there people on here taking a non-steroid one which is also working for them do you know? I was thinking there is Asthma and bad Asthma and my stage I think is not the worst. I really do not want to reach that either to tell the truth and so this finding here and asking - I know I will have to start taking something soon.
At the moment I am having fits of coughing more times in the day than I used to have. The funny thing was that while I went home to England this year for a visit in September, I was in Norfolk living near the sea. And the weather changed by the hour. From warm to cold,from dry to wet. And yet undisturbed sleep and not even the sleep apnea I also have. Hardly any coughing. The sea air?
However I live 39 km from the north sea myself here in north Germany. But in an area that is or was a moor area. They say drained for building of houses but my house stands is detached and behind us a lot of fields and in the distance a farmhouse. Also a canal behind my house but not so near. I can see it from the balcony though and the back garden is open to wind and weather and we certainly have that. On the other side the river Weser which is very wide and also another river. It is a place surrounded by water and if it is sunny and dry in Bremen it does not mean it is like that here. We do not have good weather but there is always moisture in the air and a fierce wind. The house is very good, dry, modern with central heating and other kind and also floor heating if wanted. No carpets as I already did that because of my youngest daughter who has allergies and hay fever and one of my grandsons. We watch about dust - do it every day and also hoover mattresses and turn. We watch what we buy that nothing has weird glue or formaldehyde and furniture is a mixture of old and not so old. I think I do most of what I am supposed to do concerning the asthma and now need the right medication. Maybe the area we live is not right for us but have moved house so many times and want to wait and see before taking such a drastic step.
I knew nothing about asthma before. Never thought about that I could get it as I do not smoke at all. My parents put me off. But I read now that there is the type you get from childhood and inherited and also with allergies. And the type I have which you get from the age of 40 some time and is viral infections (had very many one after the other the year the coughing started) and stress. Also a lot of that. Which I now try avoid.
I can sleep on my back ok and on left side but turning to the right I get fits of coughing and a bit short of breath (the last not very much but enough to have to sit up). This made me thing if it could be my stomach and acid. Maybe that plays a small role too. I sleep on a few cushions to be higher and not flat.
Was it Tim who wrote me? Well I understand his annoyance to a point and also that he thought me stupid and was trying to put accross a point. But I am at the beginning of this and certainly do not want any upset from this forum just because I want to find out what is best for me. In the end of course I am aware I am not the doctor, but as said they make mistakes. I am aware also about dying. I have lived with a tumor in my spine for ten years. It is not cancer but if it grows (at the moment only slowly) or if I turn my head to drive out of the garage, it could snap and burst my spine and I would be dead from one moment to the next. Inoperable. When you have to manage your life with more things than asthma going on, you do not want a reply that will upset. I am not usually so sensitive but it was a bit harsh and at the moment finding out about having something new - well it isn't easy and you don't want anyone talking to you as if you are brain amputated or born yesterday. If you understand what I mean.
Hopefully, that will not happen as I read this is a forum where all are nice to each other and trying to help. I hope to be one of you and if anything comes my way concerning knowledge in the future, I would not hesitate to impart it either. Please excuse my English. I speak German on a daily basis and French when with French relatives but all in England are no longer so do not use it much, only on FB.. No spelling correction on here as a german keyboard.
PS forgot to say Karjade that the one I am wary of and first prescribed for me with steroids is called Relvar Ellipta and that is the one where one in ten often get pneumonia, softening of the bones or even their Asthma worsening. Among other things. Is it safe to say that ALL medications with steroids in are about the same and that the possibility of getting these side effects like bone softening all about one in ten people who take it? You see, if that is not the case, I want one where that is less a risk. Thanks for your trouble.
Thank you for your lovely reply. I live in Northampton in the UK originally from London. Since I moved here with all the lovely countryside and trees I have had allergic asthma! I am better in the winter than the summer as I am allergic to grass and tree pollen. With Fostair I am supposed to take two puffs in the morning and two in the evening but I only take one puff morning and night. If I have a chest infection I will increase it and have a course of prednisone which is a steroid for five days. Fostair has a very small amount of steroid in and I think all preventatives have tiny amounts which stop the inflammation in your lungs.
Have you had your acid checked as this can cause constant coughing. I have been diagnosed with a hiatus hernia and Barrett's Oesphagus which is caused by acid. I am on Lanzaprazole for life which reduces the acid in your stomach and prevents further damage to the Oesphagus. Bit scary at first but I am learning to live with it. I would suggest if you have acid to go to the doctors and perhaps have an endoscopy like I did to make sure everything is okay. As I have mild asthma the doctors just kept blaming the coughing and the breathlessness on this and all the time it was acid. The joys of getting old! I am about the same age as you but I do try and keep active. I love walking with my golden retriever who has recently been registered as a PAT (Pets As Therapy) dog and we visit a local Special needs school. She is brilliant and the kids love her. I have been tested for dog allergies and it was negative only grass and tree pollen. I do get sinus and mild hayfever but it is all to do with pollen.
I really hope you get this sorted and let me know how you get on.
So nice to meet you and glad you are a woman! Not that I have anything against men, but when strangers I think, for me, it is easier at first.
You seem a really nice and friendly person yourself and a coincidence we both come from London. But not only this. My father was major in the army and the last place he was posted was Bedford, which is where I lived for three years before I married and which is where I used to visit my family with my husband and children. So I know the Northampton area a bit.
I am from Westminster originally. Born there and grew up but at the age of about two my mother took me home to her polish parents, in Germany. England still on rations and bombed buildings all over the place. One day she saw a rat on my bed and decided it better if I were with them. I stayed three years and came back speaking only polish and German. That is how I started school. Then we had moved to a block of flats for army families in St. Johns Wood. Not far from Regents Park. I lived there until I was twelve and then we moved north to Eccles Manchester. After that to Sennelager in Germany, which is where I had my accident. Training to be a technical draughtswoman I stayed late one night. It was winter, dark and raining when I left work, after talking to the boss. I stood in a bus shelter all on my todd and the bus had just gone - 40 minutes to wait and freezing and lonely. My mum had just lost her father and had flown over to grans and due to be back that day and I knew she would worry.
As luck would have it one of the guitarists in our band drove by and offered to drive me home. Not a very long way but no helmet. He missed the turn off and veered out of the line of traffic without giving a sign and a car was overtaking.
Mutiple injuries - pelvis, one arm , one hip, knee and my jaw two places, a hole in my head. Woke up briefly to see legs of the crowd standing around me and then fell into a coma for five days. It was my first time on a motorbike too! Lucky I lived. And got through life well up till now, but suddenly things seem to be catching up on me.
Did you buy a house in Northampton and are tied to stay there? It is a pity to move somewhere with a lot of natural beauty and then have allergies to ruin it all. My youngest has bad hay fever and is also allergic to pollen and grass. Have you ever thought about moving into town? She lives in town now and it is better. Although if a person already has Asthma maybe that is not the answer either because of all the pollution from traffic.
I will ask my doctor about Fostair. If it is similar to what he already prescribed for me then I will maybe stick to that. I think it is good you take one puff instead of two each time. If it does the trick why not. By chest infection do you mean a cold or what causes this - all the coughing?
Had a test and my lungs are fine. Yet. I just read you write yours is a mild form of asthma too.
Before I would cough mainly when lying down but now, this year it is during the day a lot and especially in this damp weather. I noticed when I go out and from warmth into the cold air I get a fit of it.
Yes the hiatus hernia. I have had that for years now and the disposition to have it probably from my gran. I know about the fumes of acid that can trigger coughing and for a longer while I thought it was that. I take medication for it but also not regularly. As needed and there were years inbetween when I took none at all.. Because I do not have it all the time. Try and avoid things that can cause trouble, but mainly do not eat late at night. I take something called Omniprozol but i think german names of medication often different although probably the same substance.
We used to live in Bavaria which is where my husband stems from. His home town Würzburg. Much better climate and dry but cold winters. Would have been better for Asthma than where we are now. We moved north 20 years ago because he got a job offer he could not refuse. At the time I thought also nearer to mum and dad, six hours less travelling. I had a stomach ulcer due to stress in Würzburg and also the rich food. A lot of homesickness in those years and the people not the friendliest on the planet in the 70s because the english had bombed their town in retaliation for Coventry. Many nazis still alive then and a dead conservative town. Mostly catholic. My husband is catholic too but not overtly religious. Now when I visit I could live there without problems probably as most of the old dead, although Germany worries me as we now have a right wing party in parliament and also people are voicing racist things openly more.
After the ulcer - I was in my late 30s and noticed acid sometimes. Not regularly. I was then diagnosed - after having the endoscopy - with what you have too. I have had an edoscopy often, also up here to check that there is no change as we all know that can lead to cancer. It does not bother me that examination, even though not pleasent either.
I do not go to doctors much if I can help it and after seeing my mother and both grans swallow medication and tablets like bonbons, I am allergic to that too and try find a natural way if possible. Do not know what Asthma will bring me on that score though - do you see your doctor regularly because of this or only if you have infection or it is worse for some reason? Although medics in my family, I don't trust them especially if new to me as they do make a hell of a lot of mistakes and experienced some in our family and with friends.
Just a year ago I noticed my hearing was worse. Was stupid when young and a singer and guitar player in a band. We toured Europe and no one thought about noise and damage to hearing from all that loud music on stage. I can hear only 30 percent now and need a hearing aid. Still sing and sang on a karaoke platform until a year ago for 6 years, but was too time consuming so no more.
I went to a specialist (how I dislike that word!) because you have to for him to fill out a form that you need the hearing aid and to exam you before hand. He then proceeded to clean my ears. I had this done once but years ago after a cold infection that lasted longer and I know that you should really make wax in there softer and not go at it like a mad man. I was tired that day and not really thinking, not paying much attention and not on my guard. And he did it with such force that he caused tinnitus.
So much to specialists. Am still lucky as I know a person who has it in a bad way and mine got better after months and now only hear that birdlike chirping or like crickets sometimes or when there is stress. Stress is to blame for so much isn't it.
Yep - that happened to me too. They said acid stomach. And I said but I am taking the Omniprazol. They shrugged and gave up on me, until I found the doctor I am with now. We are privately insured as my husband worked for the State, so we do get good health care usually. Or as good as possible.
I was going to ask you your age. Welcome to the club. Yes - getting old is not for the faint hearted. But we all do it of course.
You have a dog? So that ok with Asthma? I thought before only cats not allowed but someone said dogs too. So maybe if that is not a problem I can get one. We will see. Labradors and Golden Retriever are my favorite dogs. Although I like most of them. So thanks for that info too. Will have a test done.
Despite not being fit we are still lucky arn't we Karen. I mean when you think we got to be this old and some don't.
Will keep in touch. Be glad to. Thanks again for writing.
You sound as if you have had a fantastic life. All that travelling and seeing and living in new places. The only places I have lived in is London and Northampton. Bedford is not far from us and I have been shopping in the town centre quite a few times.
I have two children a girl and boy and six grandchildren who both live locally and born and bred in Northampton. My son also suffers with mild asthma and one of my grandchildren also has mild asthma.
Are you on Facebook? Please send me a friend request. Karen Spring xx
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