Channel4 news (the only comprehensive news channel in my humble opinion) reported that over 75s with Covid 19 in retirement homes will not be admitted to hospitals and will be asked to sign’ ‘do-not revive’ forms. I couldn’t believe my ears.
Many people in this category may dementia or other condition that make them unable to understand this edict. God I hope I misheard this.
People with dementia would probably fall under the jurisdiction of The Court of Protection and would be unable to legally sign a DNR i do believe and only their appointed guardian could do so thankfully.
Relieved to read that,Ski
Been there,done it and paid the ridiculous fees they charge for their services,but a lifeline and a safeguard for those unable to act on their own behalf,however gaining the medical side of the guardianship is a minefield and still leaves a lot of power in the hands of physicians.
Still scary though , many may have no appointed guardians.
Unfortunately that is very much true and we can only hope that doctors are true to their ethics?
One GP in Rhondda Cynon Taff sent a similar letter to their patients with incurable conditions. Extremely upsetting and they have been made to apologise by the Health Board. Awful. On a similar note, when I was in hospital in January after the consultant, whom I didn’t know, came straight out with it after she had told me what I did and didn’t have. No chance to talk it over or think about. When I spoke to the chaplain later I told him that I thought there were better ways to deal with the subject. He agreed and was going to talk it over with his colleagues. Hope he did
Yes, I’m 83 and my first thought was ‘but for the grace of god’.
When my mother was in a care home none of us had P of A, but we had a meeting with a doctor and we all agreed with DNR. x
Let’s not forget the mental health issues that will evolve from this crisis. Take care hypercat
Yes beginning with me! x
Garibaldon.you are clearly sound of mind and i beg of you do not sign a DNR on initial admission to hospital,too many physicians in this day and age are happy to shunt you off into palliative care without even considering more intensive treatments,i have witnessed this on a personal level and it leaves me somewhat disturbed to say the least,.x
Yes ski, I can read your sound of mind and like me world wise, age bring experience. Good luck to you and don’t let your mogs enslave you.
In March 2018 I was bluelighted into hospital and while we were waiting on a trolley for admission someone came up and came right out with it just like that - "do you want to be resuscitated? " Rita and I looked at each other in total alarm - it was pretty horrific.
My God !
Yeah, the whole situation was pretty touch and go - Rita, my daughter and friends weren't sure Id make it home, so that kind of confirmed their fears. But here I am haha!
But that news item is really shocking garebaldon.
After a fall on hospital grounds that broke my hip I was operated on the next day. The surgeon said that I had pneumonia and it was a high risk operation in my condition and he was not prepared to do it unless I signed a do not resuscitate form which I did. I have two daughters who have power of attorney at my request who were contacted. That was over 3 years ago and have told my husband I would not want to be put a ventilator should I get the corona virus.
Oh dear! I hope it never comes to having to choose! However, I was sad to see my neighbour had gone down that route and she struggled with every last breath! I wanted to connect her to oxygen whilst her organs were shutting down
Wow - so glad you made it through Joyce. Im not sure I would want to go onto a ventilator myself. Reported developments with cpap masks sound ok, Id go for that if it was available. Last time I was in hospital I was on 55 L of oxygen and had no idea of what has now come down the road. We're in a whole new landscape now.
Take care 
Thank heavens you made it through Joyce, that must have been very frightening.
Im not sure If Id go on a ventilator myself. Last time i was in hospital i was on 55L oxygen - I thought that was a humungous amount but now we're in a whole new landscape with the virus. You take care and stay safe
Shocking!!!! I’m stunned!
I went to see a doctor at the walk in centre,I wasn't in long ,as when I told him I have COPD he replied well your near the end of your story
.
OMG that’s shocking! What’s wrong with these doctors who are being verbally brutal to patients.... what happened to compassion ! As I say that my mind goes to the thousands of Dr’s who are working flat out to help patients with Coronavirus and other illnesses and deserve our praise and recognition. It’s just a few that need to have a little kindness .
Best wishes to you Susan 😀
About 8 months ago I was telephoned at home and asked to make an appointment to see a dr in the practice... so I did. An appointment was made with a new dr who had joined the practice that I had never seen before. I walked in bright and breezy feeling fine and left shocked and stunned. The arrogant so and so put his hands behind his head and pushed himself away from his desk and casually said” You are at the end of your life. There is nothing we can do for you .” I stared at him stunned then he asked me to sign a DNR . I told him what he could do .. politely. He was insistent , went on and on at me but I absolutely refused. I intend to live at least another 10 years. He then said he was ringing reception to collect together info about end of life for me to take away . I didn’t go to reception. I was stunned, quite numb really. It was a couple of weeks before I shook off the numbness. I have severe COPD, type 2 diabetes, high BP, heart issues all under control . I don’t go near the surgery unless I’m called in for annual check ups. I have 6 monthly respiratory check ups at the hospital. Death 💀 not for me yet !! Sorry I’ve rambled on!
I’m 76 . .... forgot that bit lol
I would have diddled all over his desk,blamed my dementia.poked him in the left eye and wished him a good day. x
Me to, the arrogant bar steward
Yes he was so arrogant ... the whole attitude and posture. Grrrr 😖 lol
I've got all of that Cept for diabetes,
,asbestos on my lungs an a triple heart bypass ( otherwise I'm perfect). Ha ha I'd have uttered a few f..s at an walked out. You should have complained in writing
I should have but I didn’t. If he’s carried on with that attitude someone braver and bigger than me will have put him in his place hopefully. 🙏
You definitely should have!! That was totally unacceptable. What happened to the hippocratic oath or is that optional these days.
About six months ago I wrote to the Practice Manager commending my GP. She is a brilliant diagnostic and until recently I had immediate referrals to Consultants.
Then we had a disagreement when I politely declined Prolia due to the possible side effects.
At that point things started to go downhill.
A few weeks ago, I asked for a PTH scan - parathyroid- as this can be the cause of osteoporosis! She refused. One day she was not available so I spoke to another doctor on the team. Although we have a named doctor, they have recently grouped patients under a team of, I think, three doctors in the Practice.
This doctor agreed for me to have the blood tests needed. In fact, the resuts show a problem with one of the parathyroid glands.
At some stage my doctor phoned me and asked me about this request. She was quite unpleasant about it.
I wrote to her and told her how upset I was and addressed the letter just to her.
She read my letter and immediately phoned me! We discussed everything and she apologised to me and suggested that 'we start over' as she doesn't like ill feelings.
This just shows that sometimes we can find solutions if we wait a while and then deal with the situation.
This is particularly true right now when our doctors are under so much pressure!!
Omg Gladwyn, that's awful, and you weren't even ill.
Im up for another ten years too!!
What an awful experience. It must have been really upsetting.
It was quite shattering to be honest. It felt like a death sentence had been handed to me on a bright sunny day when I was feeling good. 😫
Well, I cannot believe that !! good for you ! would he do the same for his mother or father or grandparents I ask? Probably!!!!
Yes I think he probably has done! He was new to the practice so maybe trying to make a name for himself solving the bed blocker problem at source. I'll never know if I was randomly selected or if everyone of my age group was asked to sign the DNR register. In fairness had I been there at my own instigation because I was unwell then I could have accepted him casually asking if I wanted to go on the register but certainly not the way he did it! Grrr . 😀
,
Here in Scotland GPs decide if DNACPRs are required if No POA, I work in Care Home 44 beds, 42 DNACPRs in place, hospital not admitting if Virus is suspected, If we suspect Chest Infection antibiotics prescribed via phone consultation, not a great atmosphere, praying I don't get it due to my Copd, but someone's got to be there to care, especially sad when on Lock Down and No Family visits.
I think I must be living in a cocoon my surgery is superb.
I think you are garibaldon! Think yourself lucky!... I was given the “opportunity “ of signing “do not resuscitate “ papers in February 1919 at the chest clinic in King Edwards Hospital Windsor. In fact this “opportunity “ was extremely pressured and my insistence that I was not going to sign any such thing was treated as if I was an extremely awkward patient! I said at the time that I was going to go to a solicitor to get power of attorney for my children organised in case I was not able to stand up for myself if I became ill, and was told by the consultant that it would not make any difference what legal stuff I put in place that the medical profession can and would do whatever they considered to be the most suitable route! 😱😳😱. I have put all the power of attorneys in place since, but I’m now in the position that I have twice refused admission to hospital when my gp wanted to call an ambulance because of a chest infection, because I’m scared to agree to hospital admission. Fortunately both times antibiotics sorted infection out and I managed recovery at home alone, but it’s a very worrying situation to be in..
And of course I mean February 2019!
Nobody has the right to play god on who lives and who dies.nobody.
My mum has been asked for a DNR for years (they even mentioned ventilators before this virus arrived) so in these times not surprised the elderly especially with dementia are considered expendable from a macro point of view. But if it were their mother or 98 year old Prince Phillip or 93 queen, perhaps they wouldn't use the same guidelines?
Been there done it. Unfortunately if medically and mentally it is in their best interest + no relative's + no guardians. Nothing can be done.
Sad ,sad times we are living in.
Reading online this morning a surgery in Wales sent letters to it terminally ill patients thatthey would be required to sign a DNR form. Following the distress this caused it was followed up by a letter of apology.
I’ve been addicted to hospital many times. At the age of 79 for a triple heart bypass. The only form I signed was one of consent. The pre op and post support was commendable .
So, what the dickens has developed
maybe the legal bods are now dictating to the medical professionals to cover their arses.
What next,! A consent form for euthanasia no doubt, this should free up a few more beds.
Euthanasia is still illegal (no matter how much you may want it) - very hypocritical considering everyone's trying to get signed DNRs!
Er... everyone ? I don’t want it !
Each case to its own merit
Addicted = admitted
I am just speechless reading these comments. Horrified.
Reply for garibaldon - I don't want it either, but for the people who have no quality of life, don't want to carry on in those circumstances and can't afford Dignitas, Switzerland, I believe they should be given the choice if they want it (if two doctors agree).
I agree that assisted dying (strictly regulated) should be available to those who want that option. We sometimes have to make the difficult decision to euthanise our beloved, terminally-ill pets to save them from further suffering, yet aren't allowed to make that choice for ourselves because doctors have said it goes against their medical oath and seem to be of the opinion that our suffering is bearable?
Kind of ironic that with the current pandemic, some poor souls may be pressured into signing a DNR or told they won't necessarily receive the same life-saving treatments as someone doctors consider may stand a better chance of recovery. Given that many young people with no underlying health conditions have sadly lost their lives to Covid-19, I'm not sure how doctors will be able to make those life or death decisions.
garibaldon
Hi,
I had that news long before the current crisis, Believe me it came as something of a surprise then and is probably worse now.
IKeith
I always refer to my GP as Dr Death, for various hilarious reasons, but even he has never suggested I sign my life away. In fact he insists that patients should not take age or underlying conditions as a sign that nothing can be done for them. What a disgraceful thing to do garibaldon - I'd be putting in a complaint to the practice manager or higher.
You seem to have the same surgery as me . Dragonmum
No-one in my practice would ever treat a patient as that man treated you - I'd have been signing up with another practice very fast if they had. I still can't belive the arrogant so&so.
Tablet change to Ambulatory Care
LIVERPOOL CARE PATHWAY 
