HOSPITAL Acute Surgical Wards & Dementia Alzheimer Care

Well i was right to have concerns as dad had not had NO pain relief since he's operation NOR as he had anything to eat drink.

Nurses doctors on surgical wards don't know how to treat deal with dementia alzheimer patients on acute surgical wards.

Is quite damming really how they dont understand how dementia alzheimer effects patients and how more care watching supervision is required to aid recovery.

Well today i had to tell them my dad when he say's something re eating drinking and taking medicin when they refuse and suffering from dementia alzheimer you should not take refusal literally BUT keep trying as they forget AND will comply.

Well hospital ward had taken my dads refusal literally.

So guess i am going to have to get he's admiral nurse HE's CPN and social worker to explain that when dementia alzheimer patients refuse they dont mean it THE just need you to take your time and try instade of withdrawing food water or pain relief

Also if have eating swallowing issues they need to know its more dementia alzheimer disease that physical issues.

Needless to say i was not happy to hear dad screaming in agony and dehydrated and hungry.

[Watfordgirl]

That's awful - your last sentence is just terrible. I do feel for the poor man and for you - you must be at your wits end.

Do what you said and 'rally the troops' tomorrow and I do sincerely hope that his care improves.

Love Sue xxx

[Hidden in reply to Watfordgirl]

To be fair its surgical ward and doctors nurses are good BUT the dont have a clue on how to deal with dementia alzheimer patients in that setting.

I think must be training or policy issue.

[Watfordgirl in reply to Hidden]

Yes, I know but other patients will have similar problems because the elderly fall and break legs etc. If the staff don't have the right training there should at least be a specialist nurse they can call on for advice, for their sake as well as the patients. I 'm sure they would prefer to be giving good care! S x

[Hidden in reply to Watfordgirl]

I defo agree but all weekend its all have done is tell them.

I would not mind but was all on care plan i shown em from social services.

Clearly the need better training and thats why am doing post AS to assume just because your in hospital ya getting good care can be so wrong .

[Watfordgirl in reply to Hidden]

Unfortunately, yes. I do hope it gets better really soon. And I hope your dad is home soon.

Keep us posted, and try to find a small space to look after yourself. xxx

[Hidden in reply to Watfordgirl]

Hi cheers i know will get better given my intervention and just hope my so public post improves it for those with out voice or relative to look out for em

[Carnival567 in reply to Hidden]

I have met many patients with dementia when I have been in hospital and know the care varies but surely an orthopaedic ward where they must have many elderly patients should know better! I do hope the troops you rally do something otherwise it sounds like another Stafford. Good luck in your fight xx

[onamission]

I'm sorry I didn't know your dad had Alzheimer's a very cruel disease and I feel for you I do hope your Dad is home soon

[Hidden in reply to onamission]

Yer he as lost all short term memory BUT happens thats what you use daily.

Is sad tragic but dont mean he should be mistreated or exploited because he don't know AM just glad am there for him.

[onamission]

life is very cruel and no his needs should be taken care of

[Hidden in reply to onamission]

We was able to give him water food pain relief mainly becouse we had time and did not take he's refusal lithely just helped and supervised AND thats what i told doctors nurses we do at home BUT we cant as he is at hospital.

Not like doctors listen AFTER all the swagger in like gods and leave just as quick.

[onamission in reply to Hidden]

I remember being on wards { can't mention which one } but we had men and women with Alzheimer's and the problem we had was not enough staff. We had 34 beds in 4 bays and 3 night staff on, we had 2 wards dealing with say orthopaedic so when it come to needing extra hands we called staff off the other ward we did this mainly when the ward was on take we used to take it in turn. We would also work on a 7 day turn around on elective surgery and someone who has memory problems tend not to improve as quickly.

[Hidden in reply to onamission]

Is bad whats happing and i clearly blame management government.

Staff do try best and is as frustrating for them am sure as is me.

All helps to make you feel good about leval care help we can expect when needy.

[Nottobad in reply to Hidden]

The poor nurses in most hospitals have to much to deal with I feel sorry for the nurses. You do know that any of your family can stay with your dad during the day to see he gets his medication and food . We did that for my mum who was blind and if we hadn't of helped she would have been left in bed all day.

[Hidden in reply to Nottobad]

You are right of course providing do have time fit enough.

But that makes it easy for gov to exploite others esp those who have know one.

Luckily my dad as me and my mum AnD when he's home he is well looked after SO its only fair when you go in hospital you should be well looked after to

[Nottobad in reply to Hidden]

In an ideal world that would be true. As we don't live in one. Helping out were we can is much better. I am sorry for the way your dad has been treated. But the nurses on wards today have a lot to put up with.

[Hidden in reply to Nottobad]

That is so true but there job is knowing or should be looking after those with complex needs such as dementia alzheimer patients or dont they mater as the bit more work

[onamission in reply to Hidden]

When we had our new hospital built we had to close all our cottage hospitals these were full of older people taking up beds because they had no support at home.

When all the cottage hospital's closed all the older people were found beds in nursing homes, then these were all sold and became private the fees went up and the level of care dropped.

The care home up the road was closed down the owner had employed foreign carer's and nurses who could not speak English this must of been terrible for the residents most had hearing problems it seems the older you get the the less you seem to win

[Hidden in reply to onamission]

Social worker told me those on own dont fair as well as my dad.

Luckly have social worker that is very good and caring

[sassy59]

Oh JAS how terrible but l am not surprised at all because inspite of dementia friends and the Government telling us about progress being made nothing's really changed. Sadly hospital staff don't have the time to devote to dementia patients. Cut backs and staff shortages have put paid to that.

Its an intolerable situation and thank goodness your dad has you, ill as you are.

Good wishes to you and your dad. He should be kept hydrated and nourished as that is his basic human right. Xxxxxxx

[Hidden in reply to sassy59]

Hi sassy am afraid you are defo right and seems that way THINK its more rush rush than care.

Twice emergency button as been on chair my dad cant access it.

Yet last time my dad was in hospital he had to use emergency button given he was choking .

So had to tell them

About when passing of if he's eating can you look make sure button is on bed.

Be NO third time as i tied it in a not on bed hand rails

[Tee1008]

I wish I could conjure up an excuse for the dreadful care your dad has received on the ward so far...but I can't. I understand that his medical care has been good, but his nursing care sounds very poor. Surely they must have had a dementia patient through surgery before? How very distressing for you all.

I hope that you and his 'team' can insure he gets the compassionate care that he (and everyone) should.

Wishing him and you all the best, Daz xxx

[Hidden in reply to Tee1008]

Hi Tee am 100% sure dad will be ok NOW well hope will be BUT am talking to socal worker nurses tomoz so am sure they will straighten things out back up what am saying after all its only whats writen in he's care plan.

[Tee1008 in reply to Hidden]

Let's hope so. Poor man. xxx

[Hidden in reply to Tee1008]

Is tragic and worries about why is so lost cant remmber.

He gets up to go toilet then by time is up is forgot what he was going to do

We have told him cant you forget to forget or worry AND just be happy.

AS thats why we are here so you dont have to worry remmber out.

Have told him he's not mising much really LIKE who wants to remmber to pay rent ctax tv licance.

Said i spend half my days trying to forget BUT the is one thing that is unique to my farther HE did say when i no longer need my lungs you can have em.

Like i would want or take em but shows love runs deeper than any short term memory.

[Tee1008 in reply to Hidden]

😘

[Billiejean_2]

The lack of trained dementia staff In general hospitals is appalling. I had a somewhat similar issue with my mother when she had a spell in hospital a few monthS before she died. You just have to be there yourself ( or other family members) for as much of the day as possible, to make sure your dad eats. Horrible time for you and for him, I feel really sorry for you.

[Hidden in reply to Billiejean_2]

Is what it is really and am not guna let anyone ruin is happness.

Is bad enough what is dementia alzheimer is doing with out adding to stuff.

You are right do have to live it experiance it WE only got help in last 3 months of seven years he as had it.

[Ergendl]

Continuing prayers for your dad and yourself, JeffAjaxSmith. What an awful time you're both having.

[Hidden in reply to Ergendl]

We have laughted more me dad mum in last few months since geting help than we did for last seven years of no help.

[redted]

They say they dont have time to feed patients so the food is put in front of them,then taken away later,eaten or not,my nieces took it in turns to travel a 30 mile round trip twice a day to be there at meal times to make sure their Mum got fed.terrible situation and should never happen.

[clematis5932 in reply to redted]

My mom in hospital 3 times in the six months before she died. 2 wards good I dreadful. Meals were put in front of her which she at times couldn't reach, at times didn't want it. or couldn't lift arms both heavily bandaged. However the chart was always ticked to say she had eaten most of it. Family then took it in turns to be there at meal times to help. We were encouraged to be there with here to help to wash her etc. I have very mixed views, as I have seen brilliant care by nurses but also have witnessed many uncaring nurses who really were not suited to the job. My mom was 92 and died in hospital although we had promised her we would care for her at home the last week she was so ill that was not possible. I only allowed her to be readmitted on the understanding she was not sent to the very uncaring ward. They in fact did send her to another one where the care was good. My sympathy goes to people who do not have family to stand up for them. I agree that most nurses work hard but that should not be an excuse for bad care.

[redted in reply to clematis5932]

It should never be allowed to happen time to bring back the Matron and for everything to be dealt with in house.

[Kas100]

Oh JAS, your poor Dad.

From my own experience of my Dad being very ill in hospital, we had to constantly check on all aspects of his care to make sure things were happening as they should.

Try and spend as much time as you can with him and be there at mealtimes to assist him with his meals if you have the time.

My dad struggled to eat because the trolley was too high for him to reach - no one had the sense to lower it for him until I realised it was adjustable.

Try and insist on specialist care because of his Alzheimer's

Best wishes

[teenieleek]

I have read all these replies with an increasing sense of frustration and despair at where we are now. None of this is at all acceptable. Daz, you should not have to be there to make sure your dad eats or drinks but it seems you must. We shouldn't have to be "on the case" to ensure good care for anyone. Sorry, I'm not saying anything useful here but I am angry on your behalf.

[Hidden]

im rally sorry for u and ur dad Geoff I hope the hospital pulls their socks up sharpist u need the patience of a saint to deal with the nhs

[Linda8p]

Oh I am so sorry to hear about your dad. it's so annoying and frustrating that a hospital can't get it right. makes it all the more scary for your dad. I have found its the same with disabled people. they don't have a clue how to nurse someone with a disability. I had to stay there to wash, change and feed the young lady I looked after. I do hope your dad has a speedy recovery. good luck.

[jimmy1c]

Hi Jeff

The quicker your dad gets home to his own environment the better for his mental health. Can u get to speak to an admiral nurse within the hospital and also ensure the hospital have a discharge meeting to ensure supports will be available

Jimmy1c

[clematis5932 in reply to jimmy1c]

Second time mom was admitted we were determined that we would not allow her to be discharged until a care package was in place. After two weeks and a few meetings discussing what mom would need after discharge it was very hard to pin anybody down as to what exactly was going to happen on discharge. I was at her bedside when the doctor together with the consultant and ward sister told us there were a lot more tests to be done before mom would come home. At eight o'clock the next morning we were phoned to say she was being discharged that day, I went to hospital and refused to take her home, a doctor was called and I was told that it had been agreed that the tests were going to be done as an outpatient, that carers would be there day and night and she would recover a lot quicker if she came home. Plus they had talked to mom and she wanted to come home. Yes we had carers three times a day a different person each visit anything up to 2 hours late each visit, the first day none at all. After four days the community nurses who came every day and were brilliant refused to treat her at home and called A&E told them she should never have been discharged then dialled for an ambulance. Mom died a week later. This was a hospital that does have matrons.

[Tee1008 in reply to clematis5932]

I am so very sorry you had this awful experience with your mother, clematis. Sadly the same as my poor mother. The same delays over her 'care' package...and her being moved from ward to ward. I had just got home from visiting when they eventually phoned to say the care was in place...I asked if any of them had actually seen her. They did and immediately put her on palliative care. She died less than 48 hours later, too fragile to be moved to the wonderful hospice. Her final ward was dirty, overcrowded and to top it all her watch and small amount of money was stolen.

I had almost forgotten the anger.

Hugs to you. xxx

[clematis5932 in reply to Tee1008]

Feeling the tears as I read your reply, its been six months now and I am still angry. Not all my anger at them, some of it directed at myself for not being more assertive. We did have some wonderful care by the home community nursing team nothing was to much trouble and I did not realise just how much influence they have with there patients. They arranged social services, physiotherapist's, washing and toiletry aids and also used to phone myself and sister to keep us in the daily loop. I do not know what the answer is but I am sure that just by throwing more money at it will not work. All these different departments in hospitals do not communicate with each other.

[Tee1008 in reply to clematis5932]

Six months is so very recent and must feel very raw for you...and such a poignant time of year too. I hope you will not be alone over Christmas.

You are absolutely right about the departments not talking to each other...they would each talk to me, but not listen to me or each other.

It is four years for me now and my anger has mostly turned to feeling 'perhaps I should have...'

Please try not to feel angry with yourself. We are supposedly guided by the 'experts' when we are distressed ourselves and trying to do the best thing for our loved ones...I try and take some small comfort that my mother was mostly asleep for her last days and unaware of her surroundings.

My deepest sympathy to you. xxx