Anyone else experienced this? there is research showing statins reduce PAF burden.Used to have episode every 3-6 months, very upsetting! Also take iron, b12 and magnesium supplements. Afib free for a year now. Tempting fate of course....🫣.also enjoying a couple of pints now and then which is nice.
Statins and Paroxysmal afib stopped? - Atrial Fibrillati...
Statins and Paroxysmal afib stopped?
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DJPH23
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That's good to hear, and not surprising because Statins do more than just lower cholesterol. They also reduce inflammation. I can't speak for everyone, but given my family's propensity for coronary artery disease, statins have been a lifesaver.
Jim
in reply to mjames1
Isn’t the only benefit of Statins the anti inflammatory effect? Isn’t cholesterol just along for the ride?
mjames1 in reply to
Jim987: Isn’t the only benefit of Statins the anti inflammatory effect? Isn’t cholesterol just along for the ride?
Both the cholesterol-lowering and anti-inflammatory effects of statins are important in reducing cardiovascular risk and overall heart health. I would assume both help reduce the risk of atrial fibrillation, but yes, the anti-inflammatory properties are probably more important here.
Jim
If cholesterol lowering is so important then how come the predecessor to statins-fibrates- were dumped? They lowered cholesterol very efficiently but had no effect on lowering cardiovasclar mortality.
First of all, Fibrates have not been "dumped" and are still effective in certain situations with or without statins.
As to statins reducing cardiac mortality with heart attacks and strokes -- you really must scour the study data for detailed evidence/explanation, but I found this q&a from UCLA Health, helps simplify.
In summary, statins and fibrates work by different mechanisms. Statins have greater benefit than fibrates in decreasing heart attacks and strokes. Fibrates, though, may be appropriate for people with elevated triglyceride levels.
You should be able to Google the User expert for the full copy, by Robert Ashley MD. Or Google the title "Ask the Doctors--which are better for cholesterol, statins or fib rates.
Jim
Triglyceride levels can be reduced by lowering intake of sugar and simple carbohydrates. But too many people would rather pop a pill than modify their diet especially in countries like America and the UK where intake of UPFs has now got to over 50% of diet for large swathes of the population. Unsurprisingly the medical profession in your country ( which has a nefast influence on the rest of the world )along with Pharma have every incentive not to do anthing about this as it would hurt their pockets.
I'm all for the natural reduction of triglycerides through diet and exercise. Or cholesterol for that matter.
But some of us are genetically cursed with cholesterol and related lipoproteins and many simply have multiple coronary risk factors that suggest more intervention.
Here, normal dietary and exercise interventions may not be enough, and most are not motivated or able to make lifestyle changes that might work such as extremely strict regimens like the Caldwell Esselstyn, vegan, very low-fat diet. And even with that diet statins are sometimes needed to achieve LDL goals.
If someone is so motivated, definitely go diet and lifestyle first. But keep yourself, honest by monitoring your lipids and factoring in your cardiac risk factors.
And also remember that statins show an anti-inflammatory benefit in addition to cholesterol lowering. Again, this may benefit some people more than others. It's not a simple subject or a simple decision.
Jim
Multiple coronary risk factors are usually the result of poor lifestyle choices . The so called diseases of civilisation are a result of deviation from traditional diets to eating the SAD (appropriately named) which has proliferated around the world along with the adoption of sedentary lifestyles , unhealthy drinking habits , avoiding or not having access to sunlight and fresh air and now poor sleep due to light pollution and addiction to electronic devices. All of which people are encouraged to pursue by advertising. They are alongside this encouraged to believe that all this unhealthy living can be rectified by popping pills - especially in countries that have direct to consumer advertising of drugs.
Extreme diets like vegan or very low fat are not necessary. I am sure you have heard of the French paradox? A fancy name given by those dishonest scientists like Keys (who cherry picked his data) to try and explain why a nation that had the most animal fat in it's diet and stuffed themselves with fois gras had one of the lowest rates of heart disease. Cholesterol lowering for good health is a myth - a long enduring one but then there's lots of dosh riding on it . A large epidemiological study done in Scandinavia some years ago showed that in older people those with higher cholesterol lived longer and got less disease of any kind - including coronary vascular disease. This was particularly true for women. As for inflammation so what if statins have an anti inflammatory effect? So do lots of foodstuffs which do not come with nasty side effects . So does sunshine which is free and which has been demonised by the medical profession. Walking about in green spaces. Sadly not much profit in that though. So eat blueberries, red cabbage and beetroot and sunbathe regularly ( without sunscreen and without burning ) whilst relaxing to birdsong .
Thanks for that info on Statins. I’ve been put on them and the pharmacist insists they are ok for me to take even though I am 80 and the info inside the pack and a woman I spoke to at the manufacturers, told me they are unsuitable for over 70s!!
As I’ve written here before, I have been AF free fir over 18 months now and the last episode was around the time I must have been infected with covid with no other symptoms!
I spoke to at the manufacturers, told me they are unsuitable for over 70s!!
I am over 70 and have been prescribed statins statins primarily to help prevent cardiovascular disease. The bonus is that's some studies. Suggest it will also help with the Afib.
Jim
Perhaps there are different makes that are ok - I haven’t had any episodes for a while and don’t think have any extra side effects that I knew friends did which is why I used to take red yeast capsules previously when I was told my cholesterol was up though they seem to have disappeared now!
a woman I spoke to at the manufacturers, told me they are unsuitable for over 70s!!
That's news to me. I had my heart attack at 70 and was put straight onto statins.
It might just be the make I have as presumably there are different makes as there are with most drugs. Actually, the one I have now says “ Talk to your doctor, nurse or pharmacist before taking Lipitor” with a number of things following including “being older than 70” which I am at 80!
So I asked the pharmacist and he said it would be fine to take them and I’m still here!
There is a difference between use of statins for primary and secondary prevention. If you have had a cardiovascular event that falls under secondary prevention. Primary prevention is being prescribed a statin because your cholesterol is above whatever magic number is currently deemed to be relevant or because you have "normal" cholesterol but your score on some other metric such as QRisk is deemed to warrant a statin. Even so meta analysis has shown that taking a statin as primary prevention might give you a life extension of 3.5 days on average. It is slightly more for secondary prevention- about 5 days. And this is only an average so you might be one of the unlucky who life is not extended at all. Meanwhile your quality of life might be severely diminished by some of the not inconsiderable side effects .Worth it ?
They are not suitable for elderly women at all. Large scale epidemiological studies conducted in Scandinavia showed that it was women with higher cholesterol who lived the longest and got sick the least - including with cardiovascular disease.
Wow! That’s interesting. Do you have a link to that research that I could read and pass on to my surgery? I don’t seem to have any increased problems since taking it but it would be good to know more. I didn’t have any problems with the red yeast rice capsules that I used to take whenever a blood test showed my cholesterol was up, until the next test when the results would always be fine. They no longer seem to be available so I’m taking the statins for the time being but your comment has made me wonder whether I should continue.
No I don't have a link. The study was done some time ago but possibly in the last decade. If you have got to the age of 80 with your presumably unsatisfactory ( to doctors ) level of cholesterol why are you trying to lower it? We need our cholesterol more as we age. It is protective against infections and cancers. The heart diseaese / high cholesterol hypothesis is simply that - a hypothesis. It has not been proved and there is lots of evidence that it is faulty - indeed has been faulty since Ancel Key's cherry picking 7 countries study data. Statins do have an anti inflammatory effect but there are lots of other substances which do too - many contained within foods. As to whether you should continue perhaps you should read some of the articles written by doctors including cardiologists who are statin sceptics. Malcolm Kendrick's blog/ books would be a good place to start.
Thank you lots. I’ll try to find Malcolm Kendrick and see what he has to say about it. Do you know what foods do have anti inflammatory effects? Hopefully there are some I like to eat already!
And I’ve just noticed I have a copy of the Great Cholesterol Con so it must be time to get round to reading it!!But I think I have read it already - the name of the friend who passed it on to me is still inside. Thanks again for reminding me of it.
Blueberries and purple coloured fruits / veg. CDreamer would know more about this but you could put in a Google search for anti inflammatory substances found in foods.
We are having the blueberries we grew now but guess they will run out eventually. Thanks again. Old age must be getting to me re forgetting that book! I see there is a feather book mark in it on page 95 so it’s time to continue with it now! Thanks so much for reminding me about it.
We have had a bumper crop of blueberries this year and will finish the fresh ones today. I have frozen some for the winter. They are delicious .
My husband has frozen the rest of ours too. I can’t help wondering exactly what this “inflammation” actually means. I know when things sometimes get inflamed when you have an injury outside but otherwise I don’t understand at all.
I would be interested to know if there is a reliable test for the level of inflammation.
A reliable test for the level of inflammation is the (hs-CRP) test. The abbreviation "hs" stands for high sensitivity. It is more sensitive than the regular CRP test which stands for C-reactive protein and is used to assess the risk of cardiovascular disease. It is sometimes referred to as the Cardiac CRP test.
For general levels of inflammation such as checking for autumn immune disease. The regular CRP test is fine.
Another excellent test for cardiovascular disease is the Lp(a) which measures hereditary disposition toward cardiovascular disease.
Jim
Thank you Jim that is on my list to do. My inclination if it tests high is to find out the cause if not too difficult.
There can be many causes of inflammation, but I had a significant reduction in hs-CRP by going on an anti-inflammatory diet, namely the very low fat diet Pritikin Diet. However, I also increased my statins during that time, so hard to say, which helped, maybe a combination.
In case you missed my edit on the last post, you might also test for. Lp(a) which is pronounced "LP little a". It tests for the hereditary disposition toward cardiovascular disease. While there are no readily available drugs to treat it, there are drugs and trial, which should be coming out soon. Also a high LP (a) can act as an early warning system which may warrant doubling down on cardiac risk, factor preventionz
Jim
Wow that's interesting to hear. I will be watching to see what replies you get. Lovely to hear that you've been AF free for a year, long may that continue.
Jean
It’s a year and a half now and as I’ve written - the last one must have come the time I was infected with covid with no other symptoms and was ended with an extra pip of Flecainide.
I was aware that statins reduce afib burden and reduce inflammation, and I assume my afib burden would be higher without the statin. That is wonderful that you are having such great result! Which statin are you taking? I switched from 10 mg Simvastatin to 1 mg Pitavastatin earlier this year and my hsCRP has reacted nicely.
in reply to Desertflowerchild
Of course ! CRP must be the modern version of the old ESR. Great. Another thing to irritate my GP with.
I’ve taken a statin for 30 years, currently Atorvastatin 80 mgs. Never had a moment’s bother. Awful lot of guff spoken on line about statins. Good evidence of significant reduction in stroke and heart attack after taking for 10 years.
Not to take one when advised is crazy in my opinion. A bit like the anti Vacc thing.
I also think many people don’t realise that statins are not beneficial because they reduce cholesterol, which they do, it’s because they are anti inflammatory, targeting the inner surface of the blood vessels,
That’s a thought, they are probably useful for my mild peripheral vascular disease.
Must book an appointment with the GP to ask what the latest theories are …..
mjames1 in reply to
Jim987: CRP must be the modern version of the old ESR. Great. Another thing to irritate my GP with.
My CRP went from high cardiac risk to low risk in a little under a month after an increase in statins and switching to very a low-fat diet, anti-inflammatory diet. My guess is that they both contributed significantly.
But if you really want to "irritate your GP" ask for your Lp(a) to be tested, as it's an important independent risk factor for cardiovascular disease. They may tell you we don't test for it because there's no way to treat high Lp(a), but in fact, just knowing you have a high Lp(a) can be motivation enough to double down on other risk factors. Plus new drugs to lower it are already in trial and might be available soon.
Jim
My LP(a) level was the main reason I decided to switch from simvastatin to pitavastatin. Simvastatin had almost doubled my LP(a) level from it's level before statins. With pitavastatin at 1mg (which is half the normal low dose), my LP(a) level is back to where it was before simvastatin, my LDL-C and hsCRP are both significantly lower than when on simvastatin. The other benefit was that simvastatin made me feel hungry all the time. Pitavastatin doesn't affect me that way and I have lost the weight I gained while on simvastatin. The downside is that I have to pay out of pocket for pitavastatin .
in reply to mjames1
Jim, there’s nothing like starting the day with a jolly good laugh. Thank you!
Well I will certainly find a way to test my Lp(A), which again I had not heard of, because I have a suspicion there is a genetic component to my cardiovascular disease.
I wonder if I might take issue with you about saturated fats, which if unprocessed are I think, something our bodies are designed to handle. A senior London teaching hospital Cardiologist 20 years ago told me that Ancel Keys’s findings were now considered statistically flawed and that I could eat natural saturated fats freely though he strongly advised statins, in my case at a high dose.
Do you find the evidence base around natural highly saturated fats being anti inflammatory to be convincing?
I remember a senior professor once telling me that 95 % of all so called peer reviewed published trials in esteemed journals were statistically flawed and though possibly interesting should be ignored until there was a greater consensus.
Being an average Joe, I still share his scepticism.
mjames1 in reply to
Do you find the evidence base around natural highly saturated fats being anti inflammatory to be convincing?
The evidence that natural, highly saturated fats are anti-inflammatory is mixed, which unfortunately is true with a lot of diet research.
I gravitated to a low-fat diet based on some research and significant improvements in both my CRP and lipids. Perhaps I could've achieved this with another diet, but there were just so many of them these days 
Jim
in reply to mjames1
Thanks Jim, of course I meant to say that saturated fats are still considered in some quarters to be PRO inflammatory.
Im on atorvastatin 10mg, cholesterol is 4.1 and HbA1c 37
pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/223...
Results: Twenty studies with 23,577 patients were included in the analysis. Seven studies investigated the use of statins in patients with AF, 11 studies investigated the primary prevention of statins in patients without AF, and two studies investigated mixed populations of patients. The incidence or recurrence of AF occurred in 1543 patients. Overall, statin therapy was significantly associated with a decreased risk of AF compared with control (odds ratio 0.49, 95% confidence interval 0.37-0.65; P < 0.00001). A beneficial effect was found in the atorvastatin subgroup and the simvastatin subgroup, but not in the pravastatin subgroup or the rosuvastatin subgroup. The benefit of statin therapy appeared to be more pronounced in secondary prevention (odds ratio 0.34, 95% confidence interval 0.18-0.64; P < 0.0008) than in primary prevention (odds ratio 0.54, 95% confidence interval 0.40-0.74; P < 0.0001).
Conclusions: Statin therapy was significantly associated with a decreased risk of incidence or recurrence of AF. Heterogeneity was explained by differences in statin types, patient populations and surgery types. The benefit of statin therapy seemed more pronounced in secondary than in primary prevention.
© 2012 The Authors. British Journal of Clinical Pharmacology © 2012 The British Pharmacological Society
On the 1mg of pitavastatin, my total cholesterol has dropped to 3.5, LDL to 1.5, and we have the same hbA1C, but unlike you, my afib burden is about 3% (3% sounds quite small, but feels quite significant). Your 0% is much better and I hope it continues for a very long time!
Mine are 20mg Atorvastatin - Lipitor
Thanks I had no idea that statins impact AF. Do you have a link for the evidence base please?
DJPH23 in reply to
Hi
pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/231...
Summary: The use of statins was significantly associated with a decreased risk of atrial fibrillation in patients with sinus rhythm. The highest benefit was seen for the prevention of postoperative atrial fibrillation and in secondary prevention of atrial fibrillation, with a heterogeneity that deserves further clarification.
I have seen something from the BMJ Group about Statins helping with afib but the main reason my doctor wants me to take them is to further protect from strokes and clots. I believe Statins help with keeping plaque in the arteries more stable. I haven't decided if I should take them yet. I'm 71 and in persistent afib. I have low cholesterol so don't need Statins for that.
Thank you for this post. I started taking statins yesterday after having them prescribed 6 months ago. I was told by GP they were for high cholesterol, nothing about benefits for AF. So I wanted to try lowering cholesterol naturally before commencing statins - to no effect. Having read the posts here I’m very glad I’ve decided to take them!
Hi
But be aware they can cause the road to diabetites.
Taking Thyroxin for Ca Thyroidectomy I can't take more than 20 Avorastatin.
My Cholesterol is 4.6 so I don't bother. Everyone needs cholesterol. Subtract the goods from bad and then you get a total. My h/Specialist says he would like me at 4.
cheri JOY. 75. (NZ)
Thank you Joy. I shall keep an eye on blood sugar levels which are generally quite low as I eat a largely plant based diet with minimal high processed food. I read somewhere that women need more cholesterol, but I think mine was 8 which sounds kind of high.
Hi
Hope you are taking the Gold Top SOLGAR Sublingual Nugget 1000ug daily until you reach say 500. Older folks need more.
I have read that Statins cab reduce inflammation and I wonder whther that is what helpig you.
But look out Statins can make you Prediabetis. What dose. Do you have a raised Cholesterol?
Good that something has helped but be careful on your potassium and magnesium levels for toxicity.
Cheri JOY. 75. (NZ)
I was prescribed statins - but I was also at risk of type 2 diabetes (despite being thin as a rake & eating all the right stuff). Unfortunately statins do increase HbA1c readings so I spent ages googling the best one to take. I found Pravastatin had been researched in a trial in Scotland & in some cases had been shown to reduce HbA1c levels so I asked my GP if I could have them. They’ve reduced my cholesterol after a month or two, but unfortunately my HbA1c level has gone up……. ☹️
You might want to research pitavastatin. After researching, I switched to it for different reasons but have been very happy with it. As I recall, there is some evidence that it may be beneficial for hbA1c.
Thanks! Will do…..
Possible caveat?
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articl...
Long-term statin therapy is associated with severe coronary artery calcification
Hi, it is only for smokers!! But it is annoying that different clinical reviews give different results, allowing us to fall victim to confirmation bias!!
So many highly informed research based and scientific responses. Where have you guys been all this time 👨🔬
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