Since I stopped the anticoagulants I began to exercise. I did it slowly walking for 15 minutes and so on until I started to do an hour and that is when I notice my joints were beginning to ache and they got worse and worse and also I got so stiff after sitting. This has all taken place within the last six months or so and so now all I do is 15 minutes of exercise two or three times a day. I have to say every single joint is killing me and I now take Tramadol. Has anyone experienced this after coming of antigoagulants and if so what do you do for stiffness and pain in the joints.
I know I am no spring chicken but on a few weeks before I walked for three hours with any problem or stiffness and before that I walked for 12 miles. Catching a bus and then walking back to the resort where I live.
Of course I am no spring chicken but I want to stay as fit as possible.
Any suggestions please or experience of this.
Written by
Surreychica_1
To view profiles and participate in discussions please or .
Post-exercise tiredness can be cumulative. If it's knees, legs and hips that are aching, has your gait changed or your shoes / boots become worn? Have you tried glucosamine, cucurmin, and ensuring that you've had sufficient protein and carbohydrate to repair the microtears in your muscles? If you are no longer taking anticoagulants, presumably your cardiovascular system is 100%.
Thanks for that reply. I will try some of those recommendations. I do take glucosamine. Yes my lovely walking shoe have gone west. Peter Storm. I wonder if I have had sufficient carbohydrate and protein as I am a vegetarian but I am trying to eat more protein by eating Tufo and beans.
Back in the day when Reebok made running shoes (as opposed to trainers) in Bolton. I would get a 1,000 miles out of each pair of Reebok Aztecs, when I was running up to 50 miles/week. My knees didn't thank me for it. Our weekly walking group stopped in February last year due to COVID, so that will be a bit testing when that restarts. I use a indoor rowing machine but outdoors, and some weeks I can row 10km each day for five days without a problem. That tiredness builds up so I do 5km every other day or sometimes I miss two days, as my leg and back muscles are tired. My breakfast is kefir, two Weetabix with semi-skimmed milk, unsweetened yogurt, blueberries and, a small bowl of mixed nuts and prunes, followed by a tangerine and a few black grapes (I'm, a flexatarian). I've started taking cucurmin recently and, before a 10km row I have a small amount of creatine mixed with whey isolate protein.
That is very helpful. Thanks for that. The breakfast sounds really delicious. I am making oat cakes at the moment for breakfast with banana's and Greek yogurt with strawberry's.
I forgot to mention that we have a tablespoon of linseed on the Weetabix. I pour milk on them so they don't absorb fluid from the gut.
Bircher muesli makes a lovely breakfast once British strawberries are available. Put organic rolled oats in a bowl with good yoghurt, grated apple, and leave overnight. Put in breakfast bowls and top with some halved or sliced strawberries, and some blueberries. You can also add a few sunflower and pumpkin seeds if you like some crunch. If you put Bircher muesli in a search engine, you see a variety of ideas for making it. You may find that soaking it overnight is easier on the gut.
That sounds absolutely delicious. I will try that. I have copied all of your suggestions and advice over onto a document and am going to print it off so that I can refer to it. Best advice I have had on the problem of my joints so thank you very much for taking the trouble to give me all that information. Very much appreciated. It was making me feel very low and now I see some hope 👍👌
As Easter Monday is forecast to be really cold, it reminded me that home made pea soup is a good source of protein. for you My wife makes it with frozen peas. When it's served, I put crutons in it, plus a sprinkling of pumpkin and sunflower seeds. A bowl of that with crusty wholemeal bread spread with good Cornish butter is so good.
Being a flexatarian my wife is presently boiling a free range gammon joint, and the water will be used in a stock that will go in home made tomato soup. I'm lucky
I do use pumpkin seeds and sunflowers seeds in my salads. Pee soups sounds delicious. You are lucky indeed to have a wife who can cook you lovely meals. Thanks for that. 😋
The Bircher Brenner breakfast was what my mom used to say we should eat but she never made it not once lol!! I can't eat wheetabix cos its full of sugar and it makes me tired after eating it but I'm gonna make my mom a Bircher Brenner breakfast right now at 1 am for tomorrow.
Weetabix has 4.2g of sugar per 100g occuring from the carbohydyrate. The fat and protein in the the milk (and in our case the kifir and yogurt) reduces the GI as the food takes longer to digest.
Don't know where you're from but here in Europe wheetabix has added sugar. The only cereal that dozens thave sugar in it is shredded wheat... All the rest have sugar added. I'd love to try a wheetabix without sugar cos I used to like them as a kid. But I can't eat sugar for breakfast it just makes me crash.
I'm from the UK and I took the information from the packet in our larder. There isn't added sugar, the sugar comes from the carbohydrates. If you check the nutritional information for Shredded Wheat, you will likewise see that it has sugars from carbohydrates, in fact a higher percentage than Weetabix.
It's a little while since I've had porridge and that was always in the winter. I used to use Jordan's organic rolled oats with milk and water (plus a pinch of sea salt) and, I think that I stirred it occasionally for about 5 minutes. It used to be a pain washing up afterwards due to the gluten. Rolled organic oats are great for you and, I would comment that these are complex carbs.
I agree. I use a plastic bowl in the microwave. It cleans up nice. I put it in the dishwasher! lol. It is the gluten is it that makes it sticky!! Didn't know that. I make oat cakes as well. I mix the oats with egg and banana and fry it, it satisfies my urge for bread!!
Its also how you make it....if you heat the oats in the pan for a bit and add hot water instead of cold straight from the kettle it doesn't become sticky at all. Can't handle sticky porridge!! If you use cold water all the starches come out ...so no its not the gluten that makes it sticky its the starches...just like cornflour or any flour gets sticky ...or like if you put pasta into cold water it becomes sticky...or rice...the cold water let's the starch leech out into the water as if it was a cornflour and water mix and then it thickens like you would thicken a white sauce.... But if you heat it first and use hot water it cooks the outside fast and seals the starches in. ...gluten isn't heat thickens sauces even when using white flour it is the starches that make it sticky ... A high gluten content in wheat flour makes a less thick white sauce than a starchy white flour... Gluten is a protein so it is more like egg ...as it cooks it hardens... And it only forms stickiness when kneeded for long enough to train the proteins into strands ..there is some small amount of gluten in oats but not enough to form those sticky strands and they don't make things gloopy. Its just the starches leeching into the cold water. Happens with all starchy flours.
Oh didn't have to go to the shop there's a website which shows you ..and yes unfortunately it does have added sugars. You must be having the sugar free oatabix? Here's a link...and it is a UK site weetabix.co.uk/our-products...
in reply to
If you scroll down you can see in the ingredients list...sugar... So it is added sugar. Sorry to be the bearer of bad news but I knew it had sugar cos I can literally feel the effect of sugar if I eat even small amounts in the mornings. I made the Bircher Brenner meusly you posted last night and we had it this morning. It was very nice..I think I shouldn't have put the hemp prptien on top though as it has a very strong taste when its soaked....might leave it till the last minute...and I got some apples and strawberries to try again tonight...it felt very soothing on the tummy.
Linseed is good for the microbiome and the bowel, plus I think that it contains vitamin E. It has soluble and non-soluble fibre; recommended by a friend with IBS. I believe that it can pick up fluid from the intestine, which is why I give breakfast a chance to soak.
Gluten is sticky. It's what makes strong flour "strong". Back in the day I baked bread from my own mix of buckwheat, rye and wholeground. Get the water wrong and the dough would stick to everything, especially my hands. Jamie Oliver I am not.
Well you certainly know your food. Very interesting what you say. I have never thought of linseed oil for humans. Used to give it to horses after a hard days work with bran. Used to cook it for them!
We use the seed form of linseed from Waitrose not the oil. We used to have organic rapeseed oil from Sainsbury's for cooking, but farmers don't grow much rapeseed since the ban on nicitinoids.
If you put a tablespoon of linseed in a cup of water & soak it overnight , it comes out slippery & is very beneficial for the gut . I think I got that idea from Healing with whole foods by Dr Balch ( ? Initials etc) many years ago , before T’internet was widespread !
Its very high in a mega three but it is a bit laxative as well ..the oil is anyway... The seeds ground up are nicer than the oil I think. You can get lots of nice mixes these days with apple etc. It doesn't absorb as much water as Psyllium's or chia seeds but you can see how much water something absorbs by just putting a tea spoon of the thing into a glass of water and leave it overnight... Psillium husk absorbs a lot of water.
Not linseed. Hemp protien... Entirely differnt thing. And different from shelled hemp seeds ..its actually the husk they grind up and sell as protien powder. I wouldn't buy it myself without the important seed inside it but my mom bought some years ago she buys all these powders and potions and then never uses them. But they taste OK when they're dry just kinda bitter and gritty...wasn't good ...I made it without last night though and had a bit this morning..it was very clumped together I think I'd just prefere to have fresh oats than soaked ones they soak up pretty fast anyway. I soaked some pinhead oats as well but god knows when my mom purached those!! Lol! She does have the Bircher Brenner book so that was a nice find!!
You're misreading the figures. The sugar is part of the carbohydrate make up. It needs to show the breakdown of simple to complex carbohydrates and the associated glycemic index.
No I'm not misreading the figures. Scroll past the nutrient breakdown to " ingredients" you will see sugar is listed as an ingredient. This means that they added wheat and then they added sugar...the overall sugars indicate the total sugars including those inherent in the wheat but the ingredient list very clearly tells you that sugar is an ingredient. Sorry its not me that's misreading it but yourself I'm afraid. If you aren't convinced by the info I sent you phone the company they might explain it better. But its very plain to see that it has added sugar. Wishful thinking might be obfuscating it for you but garauntee you 100% wheetabix has added sugar. Unless as I say you're eating the oatabix sugar free version which advertises no added sugar. You will notice wheatabix does not say " no added sugar" ...unlike shredded wheats which does. Which means it has added sugar. That and it being written as an ingredient on the side of the box plain to see. Lol! Anyway sorry to burst the bubble!
Just bought a packet of wheetabix today. It looks like irish wheetabix is a bit different ...100gm has got 4.28grams sugar.. and a serving of two buicuits has got 1.6 grams. Also has malted barley which i didnt see on the uk one. Very bloody sweet though isnt it. Makes cement on the plates as well!!! How do i get it off the bowls and spoon when my kids dont rinse them!! Anyway just thought it was interesting that theyre different! Did you ever look at your wheetabix and realise it has sugar added or still dont believe the ingredients list? I never heard back from you after i sent the link for you.
Rowing - how does it affect you? When I worked for a Life Assurance company , towers were heavily rated. I’m assuming because it puts a strain on the heart, of course you’re not racing
At 74, my time for life assurance is passed. As to how it affects me, in the next two weeks I will pass 2 million metres (2,000km or 1,242 miles) on the rowing machine, so time to ask Concept 2 if I can have a new Million Metre Club tee shirt.
Wow that's a lot!! Christ if I did that in a year I'd feel good! Lol! I can't wait till the house is finished and I can do fun excersise instead of work excersise all the time. I'd love to go rowing in a kayak in a real river! I think we should all treat ourselves when lockdown is over to some exquisite trips in nature! That will surely help a lot!!
That's my lifetime figure, but I aim to do 500km per year minimum between April and May. I use the rowing machine outdoors so that was limited by the rain that we had earlier. I've also had I think six trips to hospital, plus I had a month of flu then cold symptoms after the COVID vaccination. My second vaccination is due this month so I need to get a move on. It's great to no longer be clinically extremely vulnerable, so I add in a 4km walk most days.
Jesus yes!! When I was working doing heavy lifting and eating " healthy" I was in bits...my body builder friend said to force myself to eat protein...I did...I ate eggs for bfast chicken for lunch...I usually only eat meat occasionally...and within three days I was feeling better. I was lifting furniture around in summer so was pretty full on. I somehow thought...oh I will get stronger as time goes on..and I just got weaker...never occurred to me to think of protein cos I believe we need very little generally.worth a try anyway!!
One of my Spin class trainers a few years ago had been in the 400 metre hurdles Olympic squad back in the day. He used to say that to improve you needed to rest. My heart rate monitor watch evaluates my training sessions is currently showing "over reaching". That was my story in running and gym days; felt good, trained too much, then injury or burn-out. Hard gym sessions during the week, then on Saturdays a full on Spin class then rush to an abbs class in another gym. No wonder I've got AF! The kicker is that all that exercise plus years of running and cycling before that, didn't stop me having a stroke. The Conultant Neurologist said my weights, kettlebells, and those heavy rubber tubes (can't remember the name) had to go. So it's the Concept 2 rowing machine, and this year I'll ease back into resistance bands and suspension straps too.
Muscle tears take time but whilst they need rest, they also need some careful stretching to avoid adhesions caused by scaring. For external wounds my body responds well to vitamin E and vitamin C. Muscle tears in a limb are a problem as isolating a shoulder isn't helpful to normal life. I've used ultrasound in the past.
I see what you mean. I tore it putting up a heavy cage for three kittens from a feral mother. I needed to tame them and so was in a hurry to get the cage up and it is very heavy but I did it on my own, I really needed another person to help me. Anyway at least the kittens have gone to their forever homes and as you say it is hard to rest the shoulder I need to use it every single day. I will start to use Vit E and C.
Can I ask where you used the ultrasound. Did you doctor recommend that and did you go to the hospital or clinic. I had not thought of vitamins to help a tear and protein to help with damage to joints. Thanks for all that it has been a great help and I am glad I posted on here and to have you reply with so many helpful suggestions.
I bought an ultrasound device that I think had an operational depth of 20mm. I've always been careful if the muscle has a bleed. Applying heat to a muscle with a bleed can cause calcification, that I believe requires surgery to remove it. If there is a possible bleed I use a cool pack.
As well as protein for muscles, I take small amounts of glucosamine, chondroitin, and collagen (not vegetarin friendly) for my cartilage that is well worn.
I did see some products with collagen in it. I might try that also and see how that works as well. You posts are very helpful to me so thank you for posting.
I took college when I ripped my rotator cuff muscle ..and vit c zinc etc as well...but hard to say if it helped... It didnt get better for ages then started after I took it..but could be a coincidence. Sure its worth a try.
in reply to
And actually a few table spoons of that colegen powder gives a lot of protein!
"Since I stopped the anticoagulants I began to exercise. I did it slowly walking for 15 minutes and so on until I started to do an hour and that is when I notice my joints were beginning to ache and they got worse and worse and also I got so stiff after sitting"
As far as I'm aware stopping anticoagulants won't have that effect (I'm not a medic).
And
"Has anyone experienced this after coming of antigoagulants"
No - not from a personal point of view.
And
"Of course I am no spring chicken but I want to stay as fit as possible"
100% I understand that - none of us are getting any younger ! Would it be worth doing your exercise for 15 minutes a day and building up gradually ? Maybe do 15 minutes a day for a few weeks then do 20 minutes for a few weeks etc.
Let your body adjust to the extra exercise and work it from there. That way you'll know what your limit is and the best amount of walking to do.
I did start slowly. 15 mins and then more and more and then when I did an hour that is when my joints began to ache, but some of that was up hill so I started to walk on the flat. At one time I thought I could hardly make it back.
I am started again to just do a little bit of exercise as you have said and see how I go but that doesnt really explain the stiffness.
I meant that whilst I was on the anticoagulants. I felt like death warmed up. I could hardly put one foot in front of the other. Oh the relief on the first day I didn't have to take them. It felt so good and then I started to exercise, just a little, and that is when I began to feel the pain and stiffness in my joints which has slowly got worse over time.
As I’m not yet on anticoagulants, I’m told when I’m 65, next year. I’m not happy to be put on one. Do they cause a lot of problems? I know they can cause bleeding and stomach issues.
I’m concerned it could cause me stomach problems as my stomach can be sensitive.
I don't take anticoagulants but that's how my legs have been recently I have had aflutter and noticed my blood was really thick in my wrists...didn't move well...and my legs were always aching and tired after a ahort time. I now take cayenne to help blood flow and magnesium to help relax muscles..stiffness gone etc... Sometimes I get inflammation if I eat sugar or don't drink enough good things... That's very painful. But if I ovoid Tue foods that agrevate it for a few days there's a huge difference. But if I forget to take my dietary needs in I feel it quickly enough too. If I skip decent meals etc. Hope you feel better soon ..I love my arthritis pains cos to me they're like a little alarm telling me to get back on track with the lifestyle choices I know and science knows are going to help me.
So magnesium helps muscles relax!! I was taking magnesium but it made my ectopic beats worse and so I stopped taking it. However I looked into everything I was taking including juices so that I drank a lot and found that Robinson's "summer fruits" cordial had sweeteners in so I stopped drinking it and my ectopic beats have reduced dramatically. So I will try magnesium again. Thanks for that.
No no.... I have a magnesium deficiency. You may not!!!
in reply to
The electrolyts potassium magnesium sodium calcium all work together in balance. If you don'tet enough potassium or magnesium your muscles can cramp...if you have too much potassium or calcium your muscles can cramp or spasm... Leg and body muscles now... Heart is a muscle and does use calciumagnesium etc as well but signals misfiring in your heart aren't nessisarily a deficiency. ...calcium is fortified into almost everything these days and the soils are depleted of magnesium...so its more likely that a person is deficient in magnesium but not nessisarily. You need a blood test to show a deficiency and even then you need special blood tests to show cellular deficiency which is different to blood deficiency. My mom had CKD and during that time she had very high potassium which caused her cramping ...I have high potassium but relatively low magnesium so I can't take calcium ..the only time I did it gave me what felt like a seizure my entire body bent backwards in a spasm and cramped ...it was scary. But you may not need magnesium...especially if it made your symptoms worse. You have to listen to your own body and not just copy what I did...because it took me a long time to figure it out and find what worked for me... Iron deficiency can also caused heart issues. Digestive issues etc. so don't assume the cause of your issues are the same as someone else. If magnesium didn't help and made things worse don't take it!!! I tried taking b vitamins and they made me feel dreadful ...and the calcium too... So ya have to listen to the body... Everyone is different! Its what worked for ME. Not what works for everyone. Its worth trying if you think it might be something you don't get enough of. I use an app called chronometer to measure my levels and I also use the ratio for class to mag of 1:1 because a lot of supplements use the ration which is the bare minimum of magnesium to calcium ...which is 1:2 of mag to cal. That has somehow been taken as the standard instead of the minimum and the guy who did the research on itwas pretty pissed his results were misconstrued... Especially with the focus on calcium for older people for bones which ignores a lot of research into vitamin d k etc... And a lot of illness involve hyper calcification of tissues etc... So I know from my app I get enough calcium from milk green veg etc but I don't get a lot of magnesium....nuts seeds etc...and veg but much less than was in veg 20 years ago. So that's how I have tried to work out what I need. But if you take something and it makes things worse I'd say stop taking it is the right thing to do. Magnesium and a lot of other supplements only help those who have a deficiency. Adding extra magnesium to someone who doesn't have a deficiency doesnt gave extra benefits. If you have muscle cramps you could try using it externally as a spray but don't spray near your heart if it has worsened your heart symptoms. And consider getting tested for any other deficiencies. I would hate to think someone would copy me and cause themselves damage!!!
What you say makes sense. However I was under the impression that as you age you do not produce enough magnesium. The thing is that it was the sweetener in the Robinson's cordial drink which was causing the problems. Who would have thought! I stopped taking one tablet at at time to see if it had any affect on my heart and in some cases when I stopped the ectopic beats were much less, so I stopped taking those tablets. However not that I have stopped taking Robinson's cordial with the sweetener in it I can once more take those tablets I stopped taking as I had no idea that a cordial drink could cause these ectopic beats.
So I might try to re-take the magnesium and see if that helps. I have no idea why I have suddenly developed this awful stiffness and pains in my joints, but obviously I will try a few things and suggestions. Unless you try you cannot know. I mean I was gobsmacked about Robinson's causing the ectopic beats. I never even gave it a thought until it was the last thing that I hadnt stopped drinking. I was horrified when I read what goes in it!!
I was wondering about starting the magnesium again anyway before your post.
But thanks for going through all the trouble of posting. Very thoughtful of you.
No worries. I don't think your body Eger produces magnesium.its an element so it can be made from something else it has to be consumed. My mom never let me have sugar free drinks as a kid ...and to me they taste like metal not sweet at all..I hate the taste...so I've never drank enough of it to affect me. But there are so many chemicals in things. My mom studied nutrition years ago and had this book of e numbers ...and what they were. And some of them were pretty toxic sounding stuff.
Maybe you're just like me and quite sensitive to things. I did an elimination diet before and that was eye opening. I am Irish so grew up on potatoes but after giving them up when I did eat them I'd feel it the next day....but I'd never have known they were doing things to me because I would have always had some sort of potato in me every day. I found cabbage juice really helped...which sounds weird and it really is disgusting. But of all the things I tried it was pretty amazing and worked fast too. You have to leave the juice sit for enzymes to form and it starts to smell horrid but I just gagged it back holding my nose. Lol! Anything is worth trying once lol!
Good luck with the magnesium anyway I hope it helps! 🤞
You are right there about the chemicals that are in just about everything. You really do have to be careful what you eat or drink. There are chemicals now in just about everything.
They made me feel very ill. My cardiologist changed them but I still didnt feel good. I was so happy the day I stopped taking them. They didnt make my joints hurt, but I felt weak and could hardly put one foot in front of the other, so of course when I stopped taking them I started to try to get fit, but alas all I have is aching joints and stiffness.
Just a thought but have you tried deep breathing? Before excersise. Before my afib and when I was flaring with arthritis my muscles used to get so tight and stay hard as if they were flexed all the time ..I used to do yoga to try to stretch and they would just go back to their tight stage ...I started doing deep breathing excersises and my muscles startd to unwind. I'd also take hot and cold foot and arm baths just wizz over them with cold after a hot shower and that helped a lot too. I wouldnt say its not still an issue ..today my legs were like rocks. And I should take some of my own advice and do some deep breathing and self care. Or I won't be able to work tomorrow and I have a skip to fill... Like hard labour ahead of me. But here I am restoring an old sewing machine instead lol! Its a lot of work to " take care of yourself" isn't it!
Hello gonnamakeit. I think I will have to try and start something like that. Yoga or stretch or even tie chi. Thanks for your ideas. Loads of advice on here for me to try. So appreciate everyone's replies.
Content on HealthUnlocked does not replace the relationship between you and doctors or other healthcare professionals nor the advice you receive from them.
Never delay seeking advice or dialling emergency services because of something that you have read on HealthUnlocked.
Apixaban and joint pain...
joint stiffness.
Aching heart for a week now.
Joint Pain on Edoxaban?
Muscle aches
