GERD (Acid reflux) and PPI LINK with AF

[4optimistic]

I would be most interested to hear from anyone with GERD, especially acid reflux and taking PPI's.

Having just been diagnosed with AF, I have understandably been reading this fantastic site with intense interest. There does seem to be a link between gastric problems and PPIs and AF. (This is also acknowledged by a well known gastroenterologist). I have been taking PPIs for years and for over a year have been on the highest dose of Pantoporazole 80mg per day plus Ranatidine plus Gaviscon last thing at night.

I would really appreciate advice from people who have this 'double whammy'. What type of problems am I likely to face and what I can do about it?

(PS: I cant get to seem my gastroenterologist till July)

[BobD Volunteer]

I think I indicated recently that long term use of PPIs is not a great idea. My understanding is that the lower sphincter in the stomach needs an acid environment before it opens and allows the contents down into the gut. Take away that acid and all that happens is that the stomach fills and spills back into the oesphagus. Therefor what is supposed to help reflux actually adds to it. How you get out of your viscous circle after this length of time may be difficult

Yes the vagus nerve being affected by your digestive problems will likely be one trigger for your AF.

I only found this out by accident many years ago but have since resisted the use of PPIs for more than a couple of weeks.

[4optimistic in reply to BobD]

Thanks Bob. Its a worry. As you say, its difficult to break the vicious circle.

[Warriors]

I must say that I suffer from GERD and sometimes it kicks off my AF. I have found a quick large gulp of Gaviscon will usually reverse it to sinus rhythm very quickly.

[4optimistic in reply to Warriors]

Will try Gaviscon thank you. But are you on PPIs as well?

[Gwersey]

I decided to take a break from PPIs (been on them nearly 2 years) but my heart hasn't been helped by the break. Ectopics every bit as bad as when I took them. So I'm not sure about the link, although I'm certain about the link between heart and gastrointestinal issues.

[4optimistic in reply to Gwersey]

Thanks for reply: Its difficult to break the PPIs as I am on such a large dose.

[meadfoot]

I have acute and chronic acid reflux and silent reflux too according to very recent tests. I will no longer take any ppi after eight years taking them. I was talked into trying them again end of last year and Have stopped as I have had af episodes more frequently since taking them again. Currently having a huge amount of gastro tests and I am without doubt I am certain in my case that my heart is adversely affected by stomach issues and vagus nerve distruption. Ranitidine I am trying again on as low a dose as I can a mange with, also found constant use of gaviscon has caused ectopics although I fail to see why.

I really wonder what alternative my gastro will come up with to relief gastric issues without causing cardiac arrhythmia exacerbation.

[4optimistic in reply to meadfoot]

Now that seems to be the big question! Whats the alternative? May I ask what gastric tests have you had?

[meadfoot in reply to 4optimistic]

I have had endoscopy, 24 Hour ph reflux test, oesophageal motility test, gastric emptying scans, bile acid malabsorption scans, h pylori test and awaiting results of several of the tests. Fundoplication op has been suggested but I need outcome of the gastric emptying and BAM tests before they can assess my suitability. To be honest the Fundoplication is not something I want as it compromises swallowing ability and I am concerned how having my stomach wrapped would impact on my arrhythmias esp with Oesophagus being so close to atrium.

[jeanjeannie50]

I was in a similar situation many years ago and it was discovered after a test that I had the bacteria H Pylori. Two very heavy doses of antibiotics alongside a PPI didn't cure it although I tried that treatment twice (made me feel ill each time too). Eventually my sister in the States sent me a natural cure empty capsules into which I put oregano and garlic oil. This worked and when it reared it's head again years later she told me about Mastic Gum which again cleared it up.

Magnesium tablets make my stomach sore, so I have to use it in my bath and in a spray form. I also have to take my Warfarin mid breakfast in order for that not to affect my stomach. Eating almonds and red apples can help prevent the acid build up. If acid reflux ever threatens now I cut out all fat and vinegar from my diet and the cure is instant.

Jean

[4optimistic in reply to jeanjeannie50]

Thank you.

[Frances123 in reply to jeanjeannie50]

Hi Jean. Have read with interest about your remedies. Can you tell me the ratio of oregano and garlic oil you used please. I’ve also looked up mastic gum and got rather overwhelmed. There’s chewing gum, capsules, granules, chunks etc. What did you use and how much/often. I will try anything once as my acid is awful. I’ve cut the PPIs down to 1 a day (which I think is why it’s bad at the moment) and doing it slowly. I want to do all I can to get off them completely.

Many thanks Jean.

Frances xxx

[jeanjeannie50 in reply to Frances123]

Hi Frances, my sister sent me the garlic oil and oregano from the U.S. I really can't remember much about it now. I think it all came in a liquid form and I had a dropper to fill the capsules. She's over here in the U.K. next week and I'll see if she remembers.

I would recommend trying the mastic gum capsules, along with red apples, almonds and if bothering you in the night get up and eat a banana. Avoid all fat and vinegar. It will help if you raise the head of your bed a little too. I put a pile of books under the legs of mine.

I don't blame you for being desperate to get rid of the soreness, I was too. Thank goodness that's all in my past.

Those PPI's are pure poison, the side effects are enough to put anyone off.

Let me know if you have any more queries.

Jean

[Frances123 in reply to jeanjeannie50]

Thanks Jean. I knew about the red apple and that certainly helps. Believe it or not but so does an orange for me. It doesn’t bother me of a night thankfully but if I wake in the night for any reason then I have a banana if I can’t get back to sleep. Fat isn’t a problem either as I go to weight watchers and I have a healthy diet. My acid is more than likely medication induced. I’m now being referred to a rheumatologist in the hopes I can have one by a 3 monthly infusion (bypassing the stomach) instead of a weekly tablet, the side effect of which is acid reflux. Doesn’t exactly help seeing I have acid anyway.

I had not heard of mastic or the garlic and oregano so I’m very interested. Back to amazon for the mastic capsules.

Many thanks Jean and fingers crossed your sister can remember.

Love Frances xxx

[Hidden]

I don’t know what GERD is or PPI’s.... but I had a Sleeve Gastrectomy in 2012. All very successful until 2 years ago when I started being sick after meals... even after the smallest amounts. Then I actually started making myself sick before it actually happened. Diagnosed with a hernia into the chest area and went on the waiting list for repair and revision surgery. Last September I was diagnosed with AF. I did tell the doctor and my cardiologist about my sickness but they said nothing about it. My AF was permanent. I had a cardioversion in January this year and if I had not read on this site about the connections between digestive disorders and AF I’d be none the wiser. I have forced myself since the CV to not be sick and am eating very little. Still in NSR so that’s good. Even better that my surgery for a hernia repair and Gastric Bypass is next week.

So .... not in a nutshell but yes I have been convinced that there is a link. Very hard lesson to learn mind you!

[Buffafly]

Try eating pineapple, not tinned, the real thing. It is good for many things but particularly for digestion.

I went off PPIs because I was prescribed one after my ablation, developed diarrhoea and told to stop immediately (they allow bad bugs to flourish) but too late, I went on to develop a bowel abscess and perforation. It may all have been coincidence but I don't think so, I'm paranoid about them now.....