Anyone Gotten Expert Advice on Melatonin?

[jazj]

There's studies showing evidence Melatonin has anti PCa properties. But evidence seems limited/inconsistent, especially regarding dosage. I know it's been talked about it here multiple times. Sans regurgitating the studies, I'm wondering if anyone in recent years has brought this up with any leading Oncologist and what they had to say about it? Or if anyone taking it has a high level of confidence it has made a difference?

[KocoPr]

i was taking hi doses for a short time but it stopped working when i needed to fall asleep.

I just ordered 3mg liquid fast acting just to put me to sleep.

So the more i used it the less it worked for sleep aid. As far as fighting cancer goes who knows if it works.

I would study the long term side effects and mechanisms of action as i think if i remember right it can cause a lot of oxidation.

My two cents

[wat380bjw in reply to KocoPr]

I have heard if it stops working, stop taking it for a few weeks. When you restart it will work again.

[KocoPr in reply to wat380bjw]

Yes that does work

[Niso]

I'm taking high dose melatonin for few years now 360-420 mg a day. 60 mg ×3/4 during the day and 180 mg 2 hours before bed time.

Never met an oncologist that was interested or knowledgeable about melatonin.

[Tinkudi in reply to Niso]

How did you decide on those doses

[Niso in reply to Tinkudi]

youtu.be/Roh4lQXneQg?si=Ok-...(Not working as expected?)

[carguy in reply to Niso]

Very interesting. Thanks for sending!

[Rolphs in reply to Niso]

I take melatonin and think everyone who has PCa should also if they can. Unfortunately, Dr. Shallenberger from this video has a questionable record and actually lost his medical license in California faculty.uml.edu/sgallagher/.... He then moved to Nevada where he gets mixed reviews. I really want to trust this guy but I can't overlook his shady history.

[Niso in reply to Rolphs]

U can find a lot of information on pubmed, here is onepmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articl...

[jazj in reply to Niso]

Ya I know. There's very limited evidence involving human clinical trials. That's why I'm asking for anecdotal reports of people actually trying it or that discussed it with their Oncologist.

I've yet to see any anecdotal reports that anyone was confidence that taking melatonin had a very significant effect on slowing cancer progression. Most seem to be taking it for other reasons and crossing their fingers it makes a difference with disease progression.

[dhccpa in reply to Niso]

Any results in your prostate cancer?

[Niso in reply to dhccpa]

Well can't say for sure, I was stable for few years.

[KocoPr in reply to Niso]

And you never will

[michaelpenny111]

I don't know of any scientific evidence of Melatonin. I have been taking it for years at moderate doses. I do feel strongly that sleep is the best medicine--best for the immune system and overall health. I never had trouble falling asleep. I had trouble staying asleep. So I take melatonin (3 - 6 mg) and trazodone (15 mg) when I wake up at 2 or 3 and I usually fall back asleep.

Quite honestly I felt like--if prostate cancer is going to take me--I want to feel as good as possible until it does. And that means feeling rested and renewed when I wake up. That's why I supplement with melatonin and trazodone. It certainly will not hasten my death--and if it helps me feel more fully alive while I'm here--why not?

[MrG68 in reply to michaelpenny111]

Maybe you could consider restricting the amount of blue light you get. Blue light tricks your brain into thinking that its noon and disrupts your circadian rhythm.

This frequency of light is emitted from things like electronic screens, led bulbs and artifical light in general. Windows allow blue light to pass and block out the other frequencies. So outdoors is better than indoors.

You can also buy blue light blocking glasses, and use blue light removal software on p.c.s.

[jazj in reply to michaelpenny111]

All the studies I believe involving prostate cancer are in vitro or in vivo (mice). I don't think there are any human clinical studies. The only one I could find involves a very small cohort of patients with various other cancers. Based on this study, it may have benefit but is no silver bullet. Anything that may potentially slow progression is worth considering I think.

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/891...

[KocoPr in reply to jazj]

You can go broke with all the supplements that supposedly slows progression in vitro and mice, and tax your liver and kidneys to process all of them. I would limit the amount to the top 5 or 6 and monitor your liver enzymes.

[Shellhale]

Yes! Husband takes 180 mg daily for over a year now. I will link a good video with references. youtu.be/Roh4lQXneQg?si=FJI...(Not working as expected?)

[carguy in reply to Shellhale]

Great talk. Thanks for sharing.

[Shellhale]

It's true that there is not alot of evidence on dosages. But from all my research I find 180 mg to be the most used dosage. There is 6 mechanisms of actions. It also helps resensitize resistance to the androgen receptor. It can also be used like a aromatase inhibitor to block estrogen.

[jazj in reply to Shellhale]

But where are the clinical studies with a few hundred patients to prove it actually has a significant beneficial effect on disease progression?

[Shellhale in reply to jazj]

There are several studies.

oncotarget.com/article/2775....

[jazj in reply to Shellhale]

I now recall seeing that (it's what prompted my interest a ways back). The problem is, (a) it's only one study, (b) the dosage is only 3mg so why are people taking 20-180 mg as 3mg works like an antioxidant 20+ works as a pro-oxidant, (c) it's just 5-year follow-up, in many studies involving systematic therapies there's short term benefit 1-5 years but longer term studies show no benefit in overall survival, and (d) this appears only effective in people in high-risk groups (which would apply to a lot of people here of course but not all.)

I think the bottom line is for me is 3mg is safe and not counter-productive no matter what your risk group. 20+ mg, I'd be concerned about having good data that it's far better than 3mg due to the risk of side effects.

[jazj in reply to Shellhale]

Evidence for 20mg (not Prostate Cancer specific though)

pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articl...

Scientific background that antioxidants can be counterproductive for cancer patients.

mdpi.com/2072-6694/15/11/3037

"toxic levels of ROS lead physiological cell death and cell tumor suppression, while lower ROS levels are associated with carcinogenesis and cancer progression. On the contrary, a high level of NRF2 promotes cell survival related to cancer progression activating an adaptive antioxidant response"

I've brought this subject up before. The big unanswered question is at what point in a cancer patients timeline do you stop taking any supplements that is an antioxidant that activated NRF2? In other words, when do you go from 3mg melatonin to 20+?

[Lizzo30]

If you are on ADT you aren't producing testosterone Some of mens testosterone is converted to estrogen

So ADT = no testosterone and no estrogen

Melotonin is an estrogen antagonist

Are you on ADT ? The point I'm trying to make is if you are on ADT you won't benefit from depleting what small amount of estrogen you have by taking melotonin - rather you want to add estrogen for bone health

My husband isnt on ADT and has 3 mg of melatonin every night

I find Melatonin is great for covid gastro problems - but I have arthritis so have to have estrogenic agents to counter any melatonin I take

Sorry if I haven't explained this very well - melatonin has some great benefits - it's good for your eyes and makes you feel relaxed and sleepy

[Shellhale in reply to Lizzo30]

Alot of men on ADT use estradiol patches. It would be a good thing to get a hormone panel test or a Dutch test prior to melatonin if on ADT. This would be a good discussion to bring up to integrative oncologist or MD.

[Lizzo30 in reply to Shellhale]

I don't think many or even any men in UK get estrodial patches

[jazj in reply to Shellhale]

Yes, I read a very low dose estradiol patch can help minimize ADT side effects while not adding major side effects in itself as long as you keep the dose pretty low.

[j-o-h-n]

Melatonin:

It's a three act play about a guy who meets a woman at a bar. Mel at on in.

Good Luck, Good Health and Good Humor.

j-o-h-n

[Don_1213 in reply to j-o-h-n]

Bada-bing! (Cymbal/brush fading away..)

[j-o-h-n in reply to Don_1213]

And a slight tap with a rute on the snare drum....signaling the standing audience to end cheering and applause.....

Good Luck, Good Health and Good Humor.

j-o-h-n

[carguy]

I take 30mg before bed and it helps me sleep.

[stealthrider]

Google Scholar search comes up with quite a few tech papers on the subject of melatonin and prostate cancer. I work with a naturopathic oncologist in addition to my regular medical team. Her target for me was 20mg before bed. I developed premature atrial contractions after about 6 months. I stopped the melatonin and the PACs stopped. Went back on at 10mg and they started again so I stopped completely for now. You can also find papers which link melatonin use to PVCs. Seems it has that effect on a small percentage of people who take it.

I am 17 months in on Eligard now.

[Seasid]

It looks that every medication has some side effects or at least on some people or a combination of medication. You/ we are conducting clinical trials on ourselves all the time.