Fairly standard advice. Does anyone have any exceptions?

I recall at Mayo they told me to eat whatever I wanted. And exercise was a non-issue. Seemed strange then and seems even more questionable now. Whether or not these simple lifestyle changes make sense for APC, they have proven heart and obesity benefits.

[dhccpa]

I get regular app messages from Mayo that seems to be veering more and more to a whole food plant based diet. I know Mayo JAX now has an integrative physician, Adam Perlman (quoted in a recent NYT article about the validity of a frog toxin used by beautiful people). I saw Dr. Perlman a year ago and he all but advocated WFPB diet as well.

However, Mayo still serves plates of donuts in oncology waiting room, and their cafeteria still offers 90% SAD-diet options.

[tom67inMA]

IMHO, it depends on your diagnosis and prognosis. Diet and exercise takes years to have a meaningful impact on cancer survival. If you're not going to survive more than 5 years it's largely a moot point. In a similar fashior, I've read that survival for advanced lung cancer isn't affected by smoking. Patients don't live long enough to see a statistically significant difference.

That said, there's quality of life improvements to be had from diet and exercise, and animal studies show chemo is more effective if you exercise during treatment.

It's also my personal observation that you want to be living a healthy lifestyle before you're diagnosed with cancer. It will reduce the chance of getting cancer, and if you do get it you will likely live a longer and better life with cancer. The people here who have run races after diagnosis (myself included) were running races before diagnosis. I've lost my fitness due to multiple chemos in 2020, and it's very difficult to build it back again though I am trying to do just that while still on chemo.

[noahware in reply to tom67inMA]

It might, in fact, be true that certain diets DO NOT take years to have a meaningful impact on cancer survival, and have a life-extending impact in mere months. The trouble is, we have no good way knowing what exactly these diets are!

If you happen to be a lab rat or a lab mouse, there is probably a proven diet for you. For men with PC, it's still guesswork and intuition.

[tom67inMA in reply to noahware]

I'll believe it when I see the study confirming it. My anecdotal experience is that pepperoni and sausage decrease my cancer, and broccoli increases it. Which is to say, I eat better when I'm not on chemotherapy.

[noahware in reply to tom67inMA]

I don't expect we are going to see any such studies, anytime soon, if ever. There simply isn't enough funding to support them to the needed degree.

So we are going to continue to either trust or distrust anecdotal n=1 experiments. And the trouble with those is, even if something appears to "work" for you, your cancer is not the same as my cancer.

Hey, but we've had a good run: in our lifetimes there has been evidence that both red wine AND dark chocolate might actually be GOOD for us! But uh-oh... only "in moderation." Why do they always throw those two words in, and ruin everything?

[tom67inMA in reply to noahware]

There is some research going on, and I believe UCSF is seeing some evidence to back up their dietary advice. Your point about not all cancers being different is dead on, and means that there's very little advice we can give that apply to all patients.

My concern when people bring up diet is that we shouldn't be causing people to stress excessively over what they eat. It's counterproductive.

[noahware in reply to tom67inMA]

Even more so if it turns out you had your stress-inducing diet entirely backwards! (What if it turned out that more kale and broccoli caused a progression and more sausage and pepperoni might have brought remission?)

[Hidden in reply to noahware]

I've tried Keto 3 times (1-2 week sessions). Each time my PSA dropped. I just did it a 4th time. I'm waiting for the lab results.

[noahware in reply to Hidden]

My own experience was a PSA drop (from 20 to 13, in 3 months, prior to any medical treatment) but I can't attribute it only to the keto aspect. I did a severe calorie restriction as well, and lost nearly 40 pounds.

I am trying protein restriction right now, but next labs will not tell the full story, because I also just failed and discontinued bicalutamide. So either a rise or a fall in PSA would have been possible without any change in diet at all.

[Hidden in reply to noahware]

I don't want to jump the gun. I kept my calories almost the same during Keto. And I didn't do any new therapies. Still, could have been coincidence.

So I'm trying again. Whatever happens I'll try again.

[Magnus1964]

No one ever said healthy eating and exercise would cure cancer. But being the healthiest you sure can't hurt. It can lead to a better mindset, etc.

[Gemlin_]

And a good diet and exercise can give hope that the disease develops more slowly. In the late stages of the disease, loss of appetite and weight loss are common. Then it is most important that you eat things that you enjoy, even if it is ice cream with jam!

[j-o-h-n]

My favorite exercise is chewing............

Good Luck, Good Health and Good Humor.

j-o-h-n Wednesday 02/24/2021 6:53 PM EST

[SPEEDYX in reply to j-o-h-n]

Chewing the fat no doubt!!!

[j-o-h-n in reply to SPEEDYX]

J-a-c-k Sprat could eat no fat...........

Good Luck, Good Health and Good Humor.

j-o-h-n Wednesday 02/24/2021 7:19 PM EST

[SPEEDYX in reply to j-o-h-n]

Right your 1st wife ate the fat ...correct

[j-o-h-n in reply to SPEEDYX]

Bingo!!!

Good Luck, Good Health and Good Humor.

j-o-h-n Wednesday 02/24/2021 8:13 PM EST

[tallguy2]

Exercise can help your quality of life, no doubt about it. Walking, even at home up and down stairs is better than nothing.

[Hidden in reply to tallguy2]

The more broken up the exercise, the better. Gets the blood moving. I workout most days and break up my workouts into 2 small pieces. I might do 3.

[bluesnjazz]

That advice given by so many in the medical profession is malpractice IMHO. Eating anything you want and not exercising WILL shorten your life. The evidence is overwhelming that proteins from red meat and dairy are highly correlated with the "sex" cancers. If you doubt this, I refer you to a book called "The China Study" by Thomas Campbell & T. Colin Campbell (and do your own research via medical journals on the Net). It's the largest study ever done on the connection.

Then there's this: the highest rates of sex cancers in the world are in countries where they eat lots of red meat and dairy and large portions of sugary sweets. Conversely, the lowest rates are in SE Asia; and what are the predominant diets there? Heavy in grains, vegetables, and seafood, and sweets are eaten in much smaller quantities and are generally not so sweet.

Then there's India, where they eat no beef and most eat a predominantly vegetarian diet and the average annual cancer rate for PCa in India ranged 5.0-9.1 per 100,000/year, whereas the comparative rate in the United States were 110.4 for whites and 180.9 for blacks (from the Indian Journal of Urology). The rates in the U.S. are more than 20 times greater!

I can also tell you from personal experience, having been fighting this demon for over 16 years and tumor-free (after getting rid of one that showed up in a lymph gland 5 years ago), that diet and exercise are important. Living in Japan, it seems easier to eat more healthily than in most Western countries anyway, but when I first discovered cancer cells down there in 2005, I immediately started massive research on standard and alternative treatments, the effects of diet and exercise, etc., and refused any kind of treatment until I tried the latter. I did that for over a year, keeping my PSA at or below 5-6, after which I opted for brachy. Discovered micro-metastasis in summer 2014 and again delved deeply into my own research and began an even more restrictive diet, not starting ADT till the tumor showed up 1 1/2 years later. After an initial 6 months of both Lupron and Casodex, I took a break from it all for a year and have since done only short-term treatments yet am keeping my PSA under control. During this time, every time I went to the doctor at the biggest university hospital on the island of Kyushu, he urged me to keep going with ADT regardless of my PSA count, and I always refused until I felt uncomfortable with the number.

During the past year, I've had only a 1-month Lupron injection last March, and a 1-month degarelix injection last October, yet my PSA was only 2.4 in December, then 0.9 last week.

As for exercise, I've lifted weights and been a jogger and hiker all my life, and despite turning 73 in a couple months still lift weights 1-2 times weekly (1 - 1 1/2 hour each time), run 3-4 times a week, and hike about once a month. So when doctors tell me that I can eat anything I want and that exercise doesn't matter (which a few have) I'm finished with them.

[Boywonder56]

all the talk about diet and excercise around here make tired and hungry...what ya say we take a day off.....see you all in a week...going to the ranch....green chili stew and some stacked red enchiladas with a fkn egg on top...and dont forget yhe chopped onions....bw

[j-o-h-n in reply to Boywonder56]

Now ya talking............

Good Luck, Good Health and Good Humor.

j-o-h-n Saturday 02/27/2021 11:19 PM EST