Natural forms of vitamin E and metabo... - Advanced Prostate...

Advanced Prostate Cancer

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Natural forms of vitamin E and metabolites-regulation of cancer cell death and underlying mechanisms.

pjoshea13 profile image

New paper below [1].

I suppose that many stopped taking vitamin E following publication of the SELECT [Selenium and Vitamin E Cancer Prevention Trial] study - a study that I regard as an expensive fiasco. If someone who stopped had been taking alpha tocopherol, then stopping was probably a good thing.

"gamma-tocopherol (γ-tocopherol) is the most common form found in the North American diet" - not alpha tocopherol, which tends to be dominant in the blood. [2]

What is not generally understood is the competition for transport among the 8 isoforms of vitamin E. Supplementation with one will tend to drive down levels of the others.

Gamma tocopherol is the most active of the tocopherols against PCa, & gamma tocotrienol appears to be even more active.

I take DeltaGold which has only delta & gamma tocotrienols. (The former has cardiovascular benefits, which might be significant for PCa patients who tend to have greater CVD risk.)

From the new paper [1]:

"The disappointing results from large clinical studies of α-tocopherol (αT), the major form of vitamin E in tissues, for prevention of chronic diseases including cancer have cast doubt on not only αT but also other forms of vitamin E regarding their role in preventing carcinogenesis. However, basic research has shown that specific forms of vitamin E such as γ-tocopherol (γT), δ-tocopherol (δT), γ-tocotrienol (γTE) and δ-tocotrienol (δTE) can inhibit the growth and induce death of many types of cancer cells, and are capable of suppressing cancer development in preclinical cancer models. For these activities, these vitamin E forms are much stronger than αT. Further, recent research revealed novel anti-inflammatory and anticancer effects of vitamin E metabolites including 13'-carboxychromanols. This review focuses on anti-proliferation and induction of death in cancer cells by vitamin E forms and metabolites, and discuss mechanisms underlying these anticancer activities. The existing in vitro and in vivo evidence indicates that γT, δT, tocotrienols and 13'-carboxychromanols have anti-cancer activities via modulating key signaling or mediators that regulate cell death and tumor progression, such as eicosanoids, NF-κB, STAT3, PI3K, and sphingolipid metabolism. These results provide useful scientific rationales and mechanistic understanding for further translation of basic discoveries to the clinic with respect to potential use of these vitamin E forms and metabolites for cancer prevention and therapy."

-Patrick

[1] ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/305...

[2] en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vitam...

14 Replies

Kudos's--for Patrick--I was already on the Gamma/Delta--daily. Others should pay attention to this post by Patrick.

Nalakrats

Patrick, Pl tell us in simple terms what we should be taking in terms of Vitamin E, on which Nalaktrats seems to concur. Some indication of best sources and dosages will be very welcome.

I would never tell anyone what to take, but here is what I take & why.

Vitamin E sources deliver different permutations of the 8 variations - never all 8 - & in different ratios.

In the U.S., a well-nourished person will have a significant amount of alpha tocopherol in the blood. I don't want to add to that & risk seeing levels of the other 7 falling.

Annatto is the only cource that contains only tocotrienols. I worried about the gamma only being 10%, but reasoned that the delta (90%) was worthwhile. The only product from annatto is DeltaGold.

8-9 years ago, the only brand I could find was the A.C.Grace one:

swansonvitamins.com/a-c-gra...

But I now buy:

swansonvitamins.com/swanson...

& there might be other brands that repackage DeltaGold.

Don't buy anything that has tocopherols added, e.g. such as a "full spectrum" product.

A good diet will take care of the other variants.

IMO.

Patrick

I get the message. Thank you very much.

jaglad profile image
jaglad in reply to pjoshea13

I am a little confused by the information given. Are you saying some types of Vitamin E are good for you and others are not, or is it that they are not as good as thought ?

pjoshea13 profile image
pjoshea13 in reply to jaglad

I am saying that when you increase one, you lower the others. They are in competition for transport.

Alpha tocoperol is good, but a supplement will lower gamma tocopherol & gamma tocotrienol, which are better.

-Patrick

Patrick,

what can you tell me about this please?

vitamin E analog α-tocopheryl succinate (α-TOS) was found to synergistically cooperate with vitamin K3 (VK3) plus ascorbic acid (AA) in the induction of cancer cell-selective apoptosis via a caspase-independent pathway. Here we investigated the molecular mechanism(s) underlying cell death induced in prostate cancer cells by α-TOS, VK3 and AA, and the potential use of targeted drug combination in the treatment of prostate cancer.

Alpha-Tocopheryl Succinate Inhibits Autophagic Survival of Prostate Cancer Cells Induced by Vitamin K3 and Ascorbate to Trigger Cell Death

journals.plos.org/plosone/a...

journals.plos.org/plosone/a...

George

pjoshea13 profile image
pjoshea13 in reply to George71

George,

Vitamin K3 is not really a vitamin. It is sometimes given to livestock. It used to be in ProsStay, which I thought might be illegal, since it is a prescription drug (I believe). ProsStay now uses K2, but that is a deviation from the original Apatone research.

There were already α-tocopheryl succinate (α-TOS) PCa papers when I was diagnosed 14 years ago. I used it for a while - until I discovered that oral α-TOS does not remain intact in the stomach. From the link:

"In order to assess the anti-cancer effect of the three drugs, Balb-c nude mice with PC3 xenografts were orally treated with sub-toxic doses of VK3 (3 mg/kg), AA (400 mg/kg), and with α-TOS (15 mg/kg) delivered intraperitoneally ..."

-Patrick

George71 profile image
George71 in reply to pjoshea13

Thanks Patrick,

So does combination Vk2 VC and VE supplements possibly work in the manner described in the paper?

George

pjoshea13 profile image
pjoshea13 in reply to George71

George,

I can't say if it work or not, but you can't really do it at home. It has to be K3 (not K2) - which you can't buy at iHerb, etc - & VE succinate - which would have to be injected.

-Patrick

George71 profile image
George71 in reply to pjoshea13

Thanks,

I have another question I would like your opinion on.

I'm nearly 3 years post surgery. Gleason 8 - 4 of 10 lymph nodes microscopic -- I've had a F18 and a PSMA scan (August 2018)

My psa is 0.6 but I have been taking Avadart for 7 months - other than that only supplements. Do you think I should continue taking Avadart or stop?

I've had 2 Dr.s say it is ok to continue and 2 say to stop. I started taking it because of what I read from Snuffy Meyers. I don't qualify for any trials -- only Salvage RT. It seems like a long shot with many possible side effects that could be permanent.

George

George,

The basic case for taking Avodart is:

- while on ADT, DHT levels are elevated. This is how Dr. Myers was using it. OR:

- while on ADT, PCa may start to make DHT even though T is castrate. This can't be measured via a blood test. In this instance, Avodart is shutting off one of the causes of CRPC. Seems prudent to use Avodart prophylactically. OR:

- while on active surveilance, one simply wants to reduce DHT. It is ADT-lite, without the morbidity of castration.

The FDA has never approved Dutasteride for the treatment of PCa, & doctors seem to think that castrate T = castrate DHT, which isn't always true. For active surveilance, T is not measured, but I think that DHT should be. (Dr. Myers himself was an over-producer.) But in any case, I think it's valid to used Avodart & I personally would continue it.

You have "had 2 Dr.s say it is ok to continue and 2 say to stop". Without knowing their reasons, I can't comment.

-Patrick

Myriammole profile image
Myriammole in reply to pjoshea13

For AS, what level of DHT would be ok before taking avodart?

pjoshea13 profile image
pjoshea13 in reply to Myriammole

I would look at the reference range for the lab. A minority of men produce much higher amounts.

Of course, circulating DHT doesn't necessarily correlate with DHT levels in PCa cells, but I don't think that should be a concern while on AS.

-Patrick

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