Just seen a "leaked" document in today's Guardian. theguardian.com/society/202....
I know we aren't allowed to make political comments so I shall confine my thoughts to "words fail me".
NHS Planning To Recruit Volunteers: Just seen a... - Thyroid UK
NHS Planning To Recruit Volunteers
Written by
Sparklingsunshine
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40 Replies
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Sinking ship 😕
Yes why bother training doctors, nurses, paramedics, all those years at Med school or Uni wasted, when we can get Joe public to do it for free. DIY NHS care what could possibly go wrong?
The lawyers will do well out of it, perhaps all the fleeing NHS staff will go into medical litigation
Seriously (and I don't think I'm being political) there are hundreds of patients being kept in hospital who have no need to be there but can't go home as no aftercare available for them. Surely it would make sense to free up NHS nurses to do the jobs they were trained for and employ volunteers as carers (maybe even using covid built hospitals that were never used) - just a thought!
A better idea would be if there are jobs to do and people to do them, and wait for it its a novel idea, why not pay them? There are 130,000 vacancies in the NHS at the moment for a variety of reasons, from doctors to cleaners. Covid, Brexit, ageing workforce retiring, staff burnout or leaving to go elsewhere. Rather than relying on well meaning volunteers, why not pay people to do these incredibly valuable jobs.
And who exactly do the government think is going to do it. During Covid we had lots of people on furlough so people used to being at work who were laid off, so were willing, able and motivated.
That's no longer the case. I can't see many retired people being physically able to do things like make beds and care for sick people. And as for driving ambulances don't you need special training, a licence and insurance for that? I know some people like to hearken back to the second world war for some reason, but the days of civilians driving ambulances are well and truly over.
Isn't it more about conditions really and being treated better, 12 hour shifts are inhumane, no proper breaks, no staff facilities........... I find hospitals traumatic just to visit for a check-up let alone as a work environment with real illness and trauma and the often terrible behaviour of the public to deal with, day in day out 😳
It's such a shame that we obviously have a lot of skilled, fully trained, caring staff who are sick of being taken for granted and have left as it was assumed that they will just keep on caring regardless of how little we support them 😕
Nurses are leaving NHS and working g for the guild or other private bodies as they can get three times more money for one shift yet this money all comes out of the NHS budget I don't see the sense in this.
Yes, good point, some are playing this ridiculous system to their advantage, they say it is financially better.... BUT they miss the mental support of being part of a regular team which is demoralising and turns a vocation into a job, which just can't be good for anyone?
maybe they should stop paying Guild And Agencies so much or stop it and nurses would go back to doing bank in there own hospitals you can’t work in the hospital you are employed at as agency or Guild but you can work in any other NHS hospital I worked for the NHSFor 45years the old hospital I worked in was demolished went to a new unit it was up 20yrs then demolished went to work in another new uni it was up 20 yrs then demolished the amount of money that has been wasted in the NHS is a disgrace I think it’s all part of the plan for NHS to go private I live in Scotland and NHS is here is run by our own government.
I think we are all reading from the same page Sparklingsunshine - sadly the NHS is broken and we are all feeling or seeing the effects. Unfortunately more and more money is being thrown at it but I don't believe it's going to the right quarters and it's awful that so many hospital staff are quitting because of burnout and not getting a decent wage to live on. Yes we were the envy of the world years ago but things have changed immensely in that we have far more people living in the UK now and have a far bigger ageing population and what worked once doesn't anymore but it still isn't being addressed. I'm going to leave it there for fear I will get political and feel the heavy hand of admin on me!
That’s not entirely true. In Scotland we have community first responders who are trained to treat patients until the ambulance crew turns up, which in rural areas can take a long time. In some areas, mainly smaller islands, the first responders are also trained to drive the ambulance, usually to the local ferry and then onwards to the hospital. This need came about because of wait times and there is no reason why more community first responder teams can not be trained in urban areas as well.
Bring back Cottage Hospitals where patients in the past were able to leave hospital to recover from surgery before going home. They also acted as A&E on a more local basis - taking the strain from Hospitals and GP SurgeriesThe millions being spent on hotels currently could be well spent on better patient support ...
I have a derelict Victorian hospital ex workhouse near where I live which used to be a geriatric hospital until 30 years ago. Its massive and was used as a rehab hospital, getting elderly people ready to go home after being in hospital. Its now mouldering away. If only the powers that be hadn't closed it in an effort to save resources.
I could think of other uses currently needed 🤔
I agree. I’ve had friends in hospital recently who can’t go home as have stairs & no bed downstairs & no one at home to help. It’s a very sensible plan.
I’ve been thinking the same thing. Why don’t they use the Nightingale hospitals which they managed to create very quickly, no expense spared, for convalescence?
For the same reason the Nightingales weren't used, not enough staff. I remember watching the BBC news when they were building the London Nightingale too much fan fare. Even then the reporter was pointing out that staffing levels in the capital were perilously low. So we had these white elephant buildings full of beds and eqiupment no no one to staff them. You really couldnt make it up. There are curently nearly 50,000 nursing vacancies in the UK.
Indeed. My thought process (but didn’t write it) was that as they are fit to go home volunteers could be safely used in this scenario …
I just think it ridiculous that we're even considering using volunteers to cover basic healthcare requirements. In 2022 in a first world country. Its obscene.
Easier to replace with bots than qualified personnel ....
I have a cunning plan 🦊
So cunning… (ok not the Black Adder routine)
My plan would be our amazing wonderful admins support the NHS by running an online endo practice with the power to test, prescribe and dispense and thereby improve the health of thousands by resolving complex multi symptom /multi organ conditions. It would be awesome 🦋
Brilliant!!! That's what we like solutions and transformation 👏
I don't just Like - I absolutely LOVE it! Sadly I think our dear Admin would be overun in no time at all when word got around😁
Regenallotment
Reminds me of a story I read at some point about a Dutch doctor who decided to open a Vitamin B12 Clinic somewhere in the Netherlands. He thought that it would only get enough patients for half a day a week.
When reading about this clinic it turned out that at the time of writing it was quickly open two days a week and had many months of a backlog.
I think a thyroid clinic could easily open seven days a week (like this forum) and have a two year backlog within days, although it would depend on who the staff were and what guidelines they were adhering to.
Regenallotment - Oh how I wish Humanbean - somewhere you could really tell the truth about how you are feeling physically and mentally and be listened to with empathy instead of scorn and derision. Perhaps we should elect Diogenes as Director, with all the Admin as consultants but then I should miss speaking to so many others on this forum who have helped me in so many ways. One of the greatest things I've found is that I now never feel isolated as there are so many others going through stuff.
A well oiled machine but let's not be greedy 
and expand the service worldwide.
Thinking about your plan.... it is very like the Menopause Clinic uprising which has improved life for an enormous number of people, so why not something similar for us.... it would save the country a fortune and enable a lot of us to get back to work or at least useful members of society!
👏 I’m in! I’ll volunteer 🙋🏽♀️
Me too... as long as it isn't based in a hospital! 😬
Definitely agree on this point x
It’s really hard not to get political.
Especially when you see this:
news.sky.com/story/strep-a-...
A pharmaceutical industry leader told Sky News the price of antibiotic Amoxicillin has risen from 80p to £18 following "volatile spikes in demand for drugs".
And then this:
news.sky.com/story/local-ph...
Prediction a third of local pharmacies could shut down within the next 12 months.
Heaven help us all. 
As we've known for so many years, there are serious fundamental NHS flaws which are not being properly addressed - and sadly, I doubt they ever will. There's insufficient space here for my views on them all but a key one has been illustrated by Jazzw - drugs!We are so reliant on those chemicals when we shouldn't be. It's driven by big pharma which sees the NHS as a massive gravy train 💰.
insert UK Nutritional Therapists etc to work alongside those that have stayed. This provides an option (root cause disease prevention and treatment) that we've never had in the NHS that has focused entirely on symptoms. It would reduce the need for drugs enormously.
I could go on but...sorry if it's too political.
I do agree with people's replies below about the NHS needing to improve wages and conditions for its workers because they deserve it , vacancies could be filled and care would improve.But there are elements of the volunteer services work in the NHS which wouldn't be covered because of the numbers required and costs that could help both patients and staff , and improve certain things that are under strain , which are worth increasing.
Volunteer drivers is a big one. The volunteer driver service picks up and drops off patients for appointments, and does home deliveries of drugs and medical supplies. It's expansion would allow more ambulance drivers and paramedics to spend more time on emergency call outs doing what we really need them to do , get urgent patients to hospital quicker rather than having to taxi people about.
Volunteers are also used by various specialist departments to help with paperwork , and benefit forms , again , not really part of the NHS remit but they are brought in to speed up the process of people being able to leave hospital because of the limits of the social work service , or to help people realise what help is out there for them in hard times . Even more independent volunteer advocates are needed as the amount of mental health , disability conditions and older patients increase to help people understand what is going on in appointments .
Volunteers on wards were always used to help feed and hydrate vulnerable patients in the past , the service dwindled over time because of change and bureaucracy but expanding this again improves conditions for both nurses , orderlies and patients. As , even if we have all NHS vacancies filled, paid staff do not have the time to spend an hour feeding or giving water to a patient with Dementia or Alzheimer's or a very frail older patient, and many patients do not have relatives , or live close enough to them for their families to come and do this for them.
As a carer in my youth I know having volunteers to help with people whom really need constant one to one care not only made the physical part of my job easier , but it also made the work environment less stressful, as you didn't feel constantly guilty about not being able to spend as much time with patients as they needed , for both basic care needs and particularly company and human contact.
Continuing the successful community based volunteer programmes for vaccinations of all sorts during winter seems like a good idea too , as it would get the vulnerable their jabs quicker , and with more convenience, as well as freeing up more nursing hours to reduce the waiting lists for GP surgery care and tests.
I know a lot of volunteers for the NHS , well trained , training updated during the Pandemic , many were retired NHS staff or had changed jobs for stress or health reasons , including things like thyroid problems, and did not feel able to take on a paid post , even part time , but gained huge benefits to their Mental Health and feeling of life satisfaction by being able to volunteer their skills in a way they could manage.
Some even felt like it was bringing back their confidence to return to paid work and saw it as a form of rehabilitation in itself. Nobody is taking jobs away or trying to replace trained paid staff , they are just fulfilling roles that were not always performed by the NHS anyway or the NHS could not expand as much as we require even at full staff capacity.
It would be good to expand it into Social Care too as it could reduce strain on hospitals and their staff and free up beds .
As modern life often doesn't allow for families to look after their elderly relatives , and even if you could recruit enough 24/7 home carers to help I doubt most of us would be willing , or able , to pay the tax rises that would be required to pay for it.
Just look at the basic rate of tax in Countries that do have better social care services we pay a lot less in comparison.
Oh , and I am a Socialist with no party agenda , so I'm not talking politically here , just thinking it through objectively based on what I've seen over the years and my experience so I hope my view does not anger anyone.
Current employment law has a lot to answer for -once retired I offered to help on voluntary basis at my local Doctors surgery as I could see what a pickle they were in
In the end there were so many hoops to go through both legal and administrative I just walked away -it also applies to Charities
-get rid of the ridiculous bureaucracy
And many of us would be happy to help
The last time volunteers were used in such a way was probably World War 2. It's time to wake up, we are at war. Stay healthy, dress warm and get yourself used to slightly lower temperatures at home - it's good for your immune system.
Lets get all the disclaimers out of the way first. I am not saying this is happening all over the NHS. Only one example- but it makes one question 🤔
I am doubtful it would be a situation that would exist in the private sector simply because it would not be financially viable.
I’ve worked in both public and private sectors and was always kept busy in the private sector.
I was sent to temp at a hospital in an office admin position. I reported to the office manager the first day to get directed to desk and work required.
Office manager had drafted in a temp, but had NOT A CLUE what the person who had left did! She said she would let me know by the end of the week- she had taken over the office manager position over year earlier.
So I made myself useful doing other people’s work, who themselves were far from strained and who seemed to work between their breaks rather than have a break during work (if you get my drift). I was scraping around bored silly looking for stuff to do. I didn’t suit the office culture at all 😱
So on the Friday I went to the office manager again to see if she had worked out what it was I should be doing the following week. She didn’t know.
Tax payers had paid for me to be there - I did none of the work I was supposed to be there for and had shared the work load of a very ‘relaxed ‘ office.
I called the temping agency and asked to be moved because they could put anyone in there - it was just a bum on seat to give the impression the position was covered. That position was running for weeks! In truth the office staff could have easily absorbed any work they were so little occupied. I literally could not believe my eyes.
Unbelievable.
In all the two years of temping - and I did a lot, I never came across such a disorganised, unproductive environment.
For so many the NHS us a sacred cow. It cannot be criticised.
There are undoubtedly structural changes that need to occur. The front line doctors and nurses are being worked to death and have been for decades.
In the administration, to have people working without even a job description and a manager to allow this to happen for OVER A YEAR points to some serious issues.
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