Thyroid UK
88,905 members103,445 posts

DAAYAN VS WEETMAN DEBATE: “Thyroid patients should be offered T3 when they don’t respond to Levothyroxine” ... A MUST WATCH!

I’m not even going to shed my opinion on this. But I would LOVE to hear yours.

Watch the debate here:

AND IF YOU FEEL LIKE IT AFTERWARDS PLEASE SIGN AND SHARE THE PETITION:

change.org/p/itt-campaign-g...

16 Replies
oldestnewest

Dayan is the one Endo who knows what he is doing and talking about thats is definite

My grandaughter sees him

3 likes
Reply

I wish to a degree that I was in Cardiff where he's based. I'd love to speak to this man about my own story.

Reply

So request a referral it will take 6 months but grandaughter travels 2 hours to see him ...he is solely NHS

Reply

I'm in Scotland. It's a long way to go and a different arm of the NHS. I doubt my NHS Scotland doc would refer me to him. xx

Reply

Pamela

You could write to him and see what reply you get. Worth a try...

Reply

Ah yes thats tricky

Reply

Okay, I'm just puzzled why no-one's coming in here, so leave it to the still learning newcomer..! 😉

I'm going to try not to rant (and I did say 'try'). From 20% on Dayan's side and 80% on Weetman's side at the start ~ this turns out to be a 'draw' (that'd be 50%/50%) ~ so is there a glimmer of hope somewhere, even for the wrong reasons..???

However, for all the dreadfully exhausting/ awkward patients, who Dayan sees, one thing he said is right, people WILL self-medicate on T3 ~ does he (Dayan), who want's 'control' of T3 back in the endo's hands, think that those who spend a fortune buying T3, are actually doing so because of a 'placebo' effect? That those begging to stay on it, begging to have their prescriptions renewed because it makes them feel well, are lying through their teeth! Is he joking..??? (Didn't seem as though he'd that sort of sense of humour!)

Dayan shows 'where' the T3 is used in multiple organs, particularly the brain, having already described how use of T4 alone, actually depresses production of T3 (and his 'not sure what it does'! Really, and I mean Really..???!), and then he quickly passes that over regarding the rest of the organs of the body which use T3, as though they're of no account ~ (And, hell's teeth! The full functions of the brain aren't even FULLY understood yet, BUT if it wants T3, it's going to get it! He seemed, at least, to grasp that!).

And, what IS this all consuming passion of both of them with TSH? Ranges, Ranges, Ranges ... I'm sick because of damn ranges, and my mother nearly died because of them.

Weetman is a pillock in his argument about circadian rhythms and not a tablet yet made to match the timings? My understanding is T3 isn't as long lasting in effect as T4 is ~ and I'm a novice at this ~ so take T3 in a suitable small dosage to suit the timings of the dual 'rhythms' if that's what he wants..? It's not rocket science.

IF, and I mean IF that's what he wants so that he can trial/prescribe T3, someone. please, for goodness sake give him a "pill cutter" and a 20mcg of T3..! "They don't make a pill the right size" is supposed to be a valid argument for keeping people ill?

Interesting how 'husky' Weetman's voice is, and his stance, and the way he's trying to swallow a lump in his throat that won't go away ~ Oh yes! that is VERY interesting to me! 😉

Personally, I'd rather not see either of them, given a choice (which I will never have), although Dayan is certainly more compassionate, but for his own specific reasons...

My very personal opinion of Weetman is, he's a an arrogant psychopath ~ with the lovely, beautiful 'studies' ... that he'a played a part in. Gimme strength. It's his way, or the highway ... and my personal choice, faced with someone like him, would always be 'the highway'.

Okay ~ rant over ... (I tried, I really tried but failed ...)

7 likes
Reply

It started out as a 25% vote for that very quickly became 80% and then to simply ask if anyone changed their mind at the end I thought was ridiculous - especially after a statistically sound argument from Daayan. Weetman's argument was all opionion and words - no numbers and no facts. Agree with everything you said. It's ridiculous. Thanks for watching it even though I know it was a hard watch.

Reply

Depressing to watch. The Q & A session was interesting. The mechanics of dosing seemed to be a big hang up. I was surprised that the increase of T3 prescription by GPS in parts of Europe 2015 was seen as a reason not to follow suit. Endos would apparently lose control of prescribing! There seemed no curiosity about why this was happening and whether the European patients were better and happier.

Ridiculous that the vote was taken before the presentations, makes them pointless surely?

It seems that it's a lot to do with control by endos and cost cutting. Extremely patronising towards patients, very dismissive of "healthism" and info on the internet. Talking people out of wanting T3 seems the authorised approach. Dismissive and seemingly without medical curiosity. At least there was mention of doing harm by neglect but it appeared to raise a laugh. They're so sure of themselves!

4 likes
Reply

Sorry I depressed you. I just felt it was one that thyroid patients should see. Weetman is a danger to us in my personal opinion. I couldn't agree more with what you said x

1 like
Reply

I watched up to the 3.5 minute mark and I'm taking a breather already, because I'm fuming...

So much ignorance in such a short space of time. Firstly, the set of three portraits from the 19th C of a woman with myxoedema, with the blase remark that such signs are "never seen" now in the consulting room. I could have been looking at my own face as it appeared ten years ago. Several forum members have posted photos of themselves over the past year or two with similar myxoedema features. My GP didn't recognise the puffiness and coarseness for what it was, just told me to lose weight.

Secondly, the arrant, arrogant, ignorant, negligent nonsense about NDT being "completely unregulated"! Do they really not understand that the US FDA requires DT manufacturers to produce products to US Pharmacopeia standards? I mean, really? Have they really never seen the very detailed USP PiL which comes with every brand of American NDT?

I'm not sure I can cope with any more, especially after reading LadyBarb's comments on the remainder of the video.

Give me strength.

3 likes
Reply

Hi Hillwoman ❤️️ ~ strangely enough, I had virtually identical feelings, around the same time! The set of three portraits of the 19th C woman, hit me right where it hurts!

I too could have been looking at the same woman as being myself, as I am 'now'! The gp has seen me over 17 years 'changing' more and more dramatically ~ and has ignored these changes. I can't bear to look in the mirror now. I totally refuse to have my photograph taken ~ so I can assure anyone who'd care to listen, that such signs ARE seen in now in the Consulting Room! I 'am' that face, and I'm most certainly not alone!

I believe the statements being made re NDT were to actively discourage people from privately acquiring / using NDT, in the same way that the discussion headed re the private acquirement of T3 and its use.

(The endo's want these 'god-like' medications, back in their self appointed god-like hands. After all, they're the 'experts' ~ NOT..!!! 😡)

But hey ~ why would the 'god-doc' actually look me in the face anyway ~ when she's pouring over blood test results which she doesn't have a clue how to interpret, and most are 'within range' anyway!

I'd encourage you to watch the rest of the video ~ as I'm sure you'd pick up on a lot more than I did! 😊

Just for your delight ~ which I didn't state in full earlier ~ was that the 'outcome' was known only by The Chairman (not the contenders, I don't think?) before the start of the Debate, as has been already stated by Bertwills .

However, by a show of hands, pre the start of the Debate, Dayan was on approx 20% and Weetman on 80% ~ Weetman being, at that time, apparently a 'clear winner'.

What tickled me pink was that the result was actually a "draw" ~ and I'd visions of Weetman wondering who exactly the 30% were, who'd lied about their opinion and vote, directly in front of him. ROFL..!!! Not quite the 'leader in his field' that he though he was ... 😄.

The 'jab' that Dayan got in towards the end, about the one notable time that Weetman had prescribed T3, didn't miss the mark either!

Go on, from one Hillwoman to another, grit your teeth and watch it. ❤️️ I feel so alone when I rant..! 😄😉😘 ROFL ...

1 like
Reply

(((LadyBarb))) You're not alone, and there is hope that you'll recognise your own face in the mirror again one day if you can take your health care into your own hands. :-) :-) I didn't like being photographed either; it's a matter of self-identity and dignity. I still get a lot of fluid build-up - not sure whether there's some mucin there too - so my face and body still don't look 'right' at times. Nowadays, the passing years are having an influence, but that's a natural process and one adjusts to it.

Thanks for the summary of the rest of the vid. What I need is a better night's sleep, then I'll settle down with a stiff drink and plough through the rest. :-D xx

1 like
Reply

I hope you find the strength to watch it. It's an eye opener to how ignorant some of these people are. Despite a great statistically sound argument from Daayan they much preferred to settle for the opinions and mocking of patients from Weetman. The man needs to be stripped of any credibility if it was up to patients to decide. x

2 likes
Reply

Thanks (((Hillwoman ❤️️))) ~ I've no 'choice' but take my health into my own hands ~ and do it I will. I'll have no support from the gp. It's been a struggle to 'maintain my brain', but so far I think I've done reasonably well. Some days I'm totally brain dead though ~ and have to be very careful. This will not continue ~ it can't!

In the meantime, I've been getting my Vitamins and Folate up, to give myself as good a chance as possible, for my 'gift' to myself which should arrive mid November. I've been given a lot of excellent reading material, and will follow it to the letter ~ and, of course, get more Private blood tests done, to monitor how I'm doing.

I know how to eat properly and gluten-free isn't a challenge ~ I've just got a few new recommended /suggested vitamins to get, and they'll be as 'pure' as I can buy.

Thankfully, there are no 'heart' problems on either side of the family, just great longevity in the female line, and the next "X" number of years just can't be like the past 29 years.

But my poor face, and my dreadful skin and omg, my hair, or considerable lack of it..! 😭

Thing is, all of the family 'age' well ~ and now I feel like a 'monster' and have isolated myself from them, and good friends, 'successfully' (?!) for in excess of 8 years. We speak on the phone, but I won't let them visit. My cousin's going 'nuts' about it. I just couldn't bear to see the look on her face.

I don't want 'pity' ~ I just want to get 'better', like so very many other people on here! 😊

Wishing you a good night's sleep when your turn comes! 😊 I've been awake since around 2 this morning, so with any luck I'll be asleep before you are!

Tomorrow, gird your loins, get that (very!) stiff drink ~ and do watch the Vid? LOL.

I'd love to know your opinion of it ~ you've got considerably more knowledge than I have! ❤️️

From "the woman on the hill" to "Hillwoman", Blessed Be, with Love, Barbara xx

1 like
Reply

How very lacking in understanding. What are the risks of T3 treatment if patient has no functioning gland? Also they do not seem to realise there are preparations available i.e. NDT!!!

Reply