To all who are having problems with atos, remember this is not social security reform it is blatent persecution of the sick and disabled
the esa form is not fit for purpose apart from allowing them to make ill people work. Heres where to get help benefits and work .co.uk
Go there for all your help with ESA.DLA . PIP claims
its time the government realised that we pay doctors and consultants huge amounts and they take years to train to do their job. Yet they allow untrained staff to do "medical examinations" the ability to pick up an empty cardboard box is a funny medical
if the doctors and consultants are wrong then why are they trained for up to a decade, and payed such huge amounts of money to treat people that according to atos are fit to work.
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lonewarrior
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I'm currently looking for work - GP has not signed me off with hypothyroidism, referred me to an endo and I also don't have help with ESA or PIP, just JSA.
The reason being I don't look sick despite me feeling so awful with my illness and I'm worried I won't be eligible because I'm young and look otherwise fit and healthy.
If I were to go to my GP tomorrow and ask to be signed off they might look at me weird.
I gave up the unequal struggle of trying to work as an employee years ago. I got fed up with people sacking me for being off sick and as there was officially "nothing the matter" with me I wasn't able to get signed off. I went self-employed about 20 years ago. Firstly running a secretarial service from home and then offering IT services, which is what I still do. When you are self-employed people are nice to you because they need you. If you are ill, they wait or at least express their concern. No bullying, no pressure, no office politics.
Rosetrees, I left my job due to how poorly I felt but at the time the company was going through redundancies as well so I saw it as me resigning and taking the money.
Although there were no real physical signs that I looked ill I came into work with terrible puffy eyes. I just figured it was fatigue or poor sleep. I was signed off for 2 weeks for an operation that was urgently needed as it affected my mobility and the day I come back to work I get hauled into some meeting room with my boss telling me I exceeded the trigger points for sick leave and was going on a disciplinary. It wasn't even a formal meeting - no note-taker, just me and her.
I thought to myself when I had all this hypo going on: if I have any more time off that would be it for me. I wouldn't be allowed to have time off for appointments or blood tests, especially since we thyroid patients have to have them in the mornings. If our appointment time went over what was allowed we had to stay behind or work through our lunch to make up for it. Terrible.
but there are others who have service level agreements with major disability recruitment consortiums who are employing disabled people in menial jobs.
they are being placed in any job regardless of their ability and are doomed to fail because the firms that place them get a government bonus to achieve targetts.
A4e comes to mind but there are more.
they are being placed into jobs they cannot do to achive target's.
Totally agree. My own experince with ATOS was I was summoned before them 10 days after I had knee sugery, knee and leg in cast, 2 crutches, 1 trainer on, and the Consultants order to not bear weight on it for 3 weeks and a return. The man I saw, I refuse to say Dr, was alledged Knee expert. In I came, with letters from post op, consent form and op date for major abdominal surgery going ahead in a 6 weeks time.
He gave me 3 points on the form, said I had a slight limp due to wearing high heels and I was overweight and just lazy and I could go to work no problem. Nothing about the surgery, I was undergoing a major op and suddenly I now was wearing high heels???????
No suprise ATOS said I was fit for work and I appealed. Went to Tribunal and won as the Dr who was sitting with the Judge helped me in to the ATOS building and gave me help getting into the lift and through the doors and picked up my letters when I dropped them. This Dr wasnt working at ATOS was supporting a friend who was to be assessed.
Tribunal overturned the ruling gave me the points I should have and added the Dr was in grievous error and that ATOS should use properly qualified Drs and people should see more than1 if their medical needs are complex. Seems the scathing report of the Tribunal and its recommendatins fell on deaf ears and now ATOS is worse, its a bunch of non medcial people going through the forms and giving points if they are on the their list.
The list for points scoring is flawed, example :
Cancer is on the list but breast cancer is not, so if you write breast cancer you dont get points. Kidney failure and dialysis paitents are another non point scoring. As is brain damage with paralysis and speech disorders as a young man who suffered a horrific accident that left him with the mind of a 5 year old, not able to walk, talk, move, inconitent, and had 24hr nursing attendants. ATOS gave him 0 points and said he could work fully and was capable.
Nobody is getting assessed properly the Gov engineered it like that and the DWP know it and cant do anything about it. Its push push push and lie lie to get people out toa job knowing its temporary, and worse means you cant claim benefit straight away. As for their calculation on wages, they calculate Gross wage only. They do not take off tax and national insurance. Its a con the amount they say you are better off, you arent unless they take off Ni and tax and they wont.
this politically motivated scheme , and PRIVATE COMPANY ---a.t.o.s. --, that is paid for by some of its own directors [ m.p.'s ] that sit on its board as non-exec s , is designed to manipulate the unemployment and unfit for work figures with total disregard to the facts -----atos actually get a bonus payment for everyone they deem as fit for work ====so the onus is on them to 'tick the right boxes for their own purpose '==== I myself was 'interviewed ' by a registered physiotherapist ---but never physically examined -- and this pleb decided that I would be fit for full time employment within 18 mths -----my own gp challenged this on the facts and factual medical evidence and the decision was overturned via phone within 3 days .....in my opinion not only is atos not fit for purpose but also neither are ANY OF THE MINISTERS THAT ARE CHAMPIONING THESE MEASURES -----and the one at the top of my list is I.D.S. followed closely by his co-horts ......just remember there will be a time when they will want YOU --------remember what has been happening as well as the broken promises-----and that time is coming closer and closer .....alan
they allow you 18 months on Esa then you are made to claim jobseekers, unless you get into the support group.
yes it is all political.
but the worst is they were paid 2BILLION pounds last year and paid not 1 penny tax
thats a national disgrace
we give more in foreign aid than it costs for thevsick and disabled and I'm sorry but to me charity should begin at home
the biggest growth industry in 21st century Britain is food banks
but MP's shieldd by westminster now nothing of poverty, 2 houses , expense accounts, and such as the likes of ian duncan smith earning 1528 a week AFTER tax
The banks caused the problem not us that are ill, disabled, or old
totally agree with you .....and yes I was ' moved ' to the support group within 3 days of my gp stating to them that he would be the first medical witness when it went to court [ my gp is absolutely brilliant ] .....and all this was done via e.mail and mainly on the telephone AND NOT AT A TRIBUNAL OR ASSESMENT MEETING .....it proves that it can be done .....power to proper and correct JUSTICE !!!!!!! alan xx
I think at last the doctors are realising that people who are not medically qualified are repealling their diagnosis and making them redundant as doctors.
Doctors are trained , indeed highly trained , to diagnose, they should be the ones to ssy if a person is fit to work , not an unqualified atos assessor. Last I heard atos had only 17 qualified doctors on the books, god knows where the 2Billon has gone, but I suspect a few members of the tory party do.
yes the doctors are realising --- my gp [ who also happens to sit on and advise the local pct ] has informed me that the general feeling from our local gp's is that they are being undermined and being used as pawns in this entire matter --------THERE WILL BE A BACKLASH ===== and I await with trepidation and joy when these plebs ' in the house ' get the karma returned to them ....the first being ids [ I certainly wont lose any sleep when it comes .......alan xx
I thought ATOS had lost the contract, and wernt doing them anymore. I'm sure I read that somewhere in the last few days.
And yes, i also had a terrible time with them on ESA, I was in the work group for a year then moved into the support, never had to go to the job centre after the initial first visit, I should have appealed in the first place but I wasn't well enough. Didnt need to do anything to get shifted to support group, just re-filled the forms and they shifted me, no medical or anything, I was really relieved they wernt going to put me through the same hell they had done the year before.
Dont get it now, as I have a working partner now, still get my DLA, only low rate, again it should have been appealed but I just cant cope with it, so I take what I'm given and am grateful for it.
As far as I am aware its the PIP assessment that they have been stopped from.
50,000 disabled people are in fear of their jobs as a result of DLA changing to PIP.
the last time disabled people were persecuted in this way was 1936 onwards in Germany.
the government are changing the public order act to include firms and companies, tgis means that you can be arrested under section 5 for saying anything about atos.
3 disabled people were aressted in their homes for online presentation of the 2000 people that atos have deemed fit for work who have sadly died.
one was srrested by the police at 12 at night, and she is wheelchair dependant.
the tories have erased all their broken promises from their website.
we have now less freedom and transparency than Russia.
this government controls 95% of the media.
the freedom of speech we once enjoyed wil be significantly eroded by the time they are kicked out.
The actual article appears to have gone, there is only the headline and brief synopsis left, but I'm sure I read it as ATIOS' contract had expired 3 months ago and they were pulling out of medicals. It defo didnt state it was PIP only, infact I believe that PIP has been postponed indefinately
If this reply was to me, Im not entitled to contributions based as I have not paid any NI for many years as I was home bringing up children. i an entitled to income based only and as my partner earns (when he's in work) the minimum amount it means I am not entitled to ESA and he has to keep me. There are not not paying me, I am just no longer entitled to anything
ATOS are now delaying decisions because the tories are bringing in new rules to stop people getting payments while they are waiting for appeals. I filled in an assessment form (or rather my best friend who is an OT did!!) that had to be in a month and a half ago and I have heard nothing. My friend assures me that if there is enough information on the form I will not be called in for a physical assessment, I still worry that my benefits will be removed arbitrarily as they can actually do what they want and you have no recourse!!
when you submit your forms sdnd every piece of information you can in with them, hospital appointments, the inserts from your meds with the side effects ect.
Quite clearly the government thinks that persecution of the ill is backed by the public, but now sons, and daughters, are seeing the effects this policy is taking on their parents, and vica versa, the public are realising its not reform, but blatent, disability hate and exclusion, along with persecution of tge most vulnerable in society.
While we are made to concentrate on benefits, we forget the banks, the tax avoidance, and the expenses scandle of MP's.
if companies paid tax as they should 120 Billoon pounds would go into the exchequer. Almost wiping out the deficit in one year.
Divide and conquer seems to be the policy, and every piece of legislation has been ill thiught out and rushed through parliament by a team of millionaire public schoolboys. Entrusting their leader to resume Thatchers policies from decades ago because they can think of nothing new.
when everybody believes the blatent misleading propaganda they forget that when social security is destroyed the National Health Service will be next.
i could not agree any more whatsoever with you whatsoever , .... I have been advocating for many years that ---no matter whosoever is in political power THEY are only interested in THEIR OWN SELF INTERESTS ----- AND NOT THE PEOPLE WHO PUT THEM THERE ---- I have always believed and advocated that what is promised in the manifesto prior to election should be sacrosanct and NOT to be adjusted .....remember what we were told before the last election ==== and what has happened since ===why not be able to challenge this in law ......it is , in my opinion , happening and has happened for centuries , unfortunately we have to put up with what we have at the moment ....... but by chipping away at the edges we may make a tiny bit of progress....but it needs people to put themselves out and push push push .....sorry about the rant but I do feel really strong on this issue ......LoL alan xx
Cameron and his wife are both millionaires, yet he claimed DLA.
seems its ok for millionaires but not us.they are the political elite, and sadly now Labour have entered the bubblevof westminster with them.
they now get the expense accounts and 2 homes ect ect, they have become the very thing they were created against. Cameron and co are in power because they are rich not because they are capable.
he got his first job in PR because the firm recieved a phone call from Buckingham Palace
continuing my rant ,.... it is not only Cameron but started with blair ...A LABOUR PM THAT WAS ALREDY A MULTI-MILLIONAIR and WHO MARRIED INTO A VASTLY WEALTHY FAMILY how could someone from these roots be representing anyone that has to , on many occasions , ' copper up to get a bottle of milk -- on several occasions -- ] ROSE TINTED SPECTACLES COMES TO MIND ....... I have an mp that has and still continues to manipulate for POLITICAL REASONS ----- I would love to have 1% of the [liquid funds] in their account ====forget the lottery my great great grandkids would be set up......and my current mp is supposed to be LABOUR ......total and utter poppycock .....told you I was ranting [ some things do rankle my shackles ] ......alan xx
I`m reminded of a documentary I saw recently about the beginning of the welfare state, & how it would put an end to want, hunger poverty, etc, & how we would be cared for from cradle to grave. They called it a brave new world. Talk about broken promises!
There once was a brave new world, then capitalism took over once again, andThatcher destroyed that brave new world, selt off our nationalised assests, for nothing, and comitted us to a country of greed and deception.
now we return to being here to service the rich elite, an elite tthat wants nothing to do with the sick and disabled, which is why Duncan Smith intends to destroy the welfare state, and remove compassion from society.
Soon we will have the same kind of society that we had in dickens time. Iv`e read some of his novels, & seen films like Oliver Twist, & thought, how awful! I`m glad that I live today with the welfare state! Now we`ll get to find out just how back things can be. I can just see them reopening the workhouses in the near future to punish people for the sin of being poor.
I failed my assessment (0 points), appealed and 11 months later, won my appeal. The doctor saw I had Hashi's and read my prescription and said "you are taking T4, so we will not count the Hashis because that is fine". I did not argue, just showed my claw like hands, they had seen me shuffle in (nerve damage in my feet), bash into the chair, fail to pick up the plastic cup of water they offered me, knocked the box of tissues on the floor (normal for me!) etc and gave me 22 points with recommendation not to bother me again for 2 years. "They" bothered me 12 months later...
I am 61, worked all my life. They are offering to send me on CV writing courses (I have two degrees). There is no public transport round here, nearest bus is 2 miles away, but I am expected to be able to get anywhere at a moments notice.
The raise in benefit is 1% BELOW inflation (which in itself is a fiddled figure, we all know how the bills have risen!) and then they go and vote themselves an 11% raise!
They now have been told to look up your illness on Google since the GPs withdrew their support. You could not make it up!
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