Lightbulb moment

[LittleJane]

So PMR is triggered by inflammation at cellular level, yes? After I had Covid at the start of the year it took me 6 months to recover. The doctor has started mentioning Long Covid. The symptoms were muscle and joint pain and fatigue. When I was diagnosed with PMR the symptoms were the same. Could the PMR inflammation be left over from the Covid infection?

[PMRpro Ambassador]

It could - but it could also have been the Covid infection that sent the immune system haywire and became PMR. It is said there are increased case numbers since Covid. Any infection can be the final straw that tips the immune system over the edge, it isn't specific to Covid or Covid vaccine - all sorts of both can do it. PMR isn't the disease, it is the name given to a set of symptoms that are caused by an underlying condition and there are several, including being an early presentation of some forms of inflammatory arthritis and even a couple of cancers. In PMR the inflammation is refreshed every morning with the shedding of cytokines that attack the body inappropriately and that is ongoing.

Of course, Long Covid is fashionable at present. Hope he doesn't think he's found something no-one else has noticed!!!!

[Sillydogsmum]

This is one enormous rabbit hole. There simply isnt enough knowledge , at the moment, about the links between and causes of the various autoimmune diseases . Covid stoked up my PMR as has the semi autoimmune Rosacea. PS thought you were off on hols....brain off turn??🫣

[LittleJane in reply to Sillydogsmum]

We are on hols, in this country. On the way to IOW, at daughter's for tonight, I just wanted to run the Covid idea past you

[Sillydogsmum]

🌹🍹🏝️ Bonnes vacances!

[Polygolfer]

Any event that has the potential of sending the immune system into overdrive could potentially tip the scales and trigger PMR… so COVID, possible, mRNA vaccine possible, lung infection possible… the trouble is how to pin point the exact cause or combination of causes… no one has figured that one out yet!

[LittleJane in reply to Polygolfer]

I don't really need to know, PMR has moved in uninvited and I must accommodate it.

[Polygolfer]

well… your post seemed to ask the question??!!

[Gimme]

I'm not sure I understand the question. Are you wondering that you might not have PMR at all, but similar symptoms caused by long covid instead?

[DorsetLady PMRGCAuk volunteer in reply to Gimme]

Imagine LittleJane is thinking aloud.. she's new to forum and trying to get her head around the whole PMR 'thing'... not sure answer is required.. maybe just a like 😊

[LittleJane in reply to DorsetLady]

Thank you Dorset Lady x

[nuigini]

I had covid very early on in 2021 and struggled with what I thought was long covid for some time. Suddenly the penny dropped and I realized it could be a flare of PMR. Sure enough I treated it as a flare and got back on track with only PMR.

[PRL1957]

Hi, LittleJane,

Your musings raise some interesting questions. Your PMR appears to have been triggered by covid; mine appeared to be triggered by the (Pfizer) RNA vaccine. And it seems that both types of triggers have been widely reported.

So, was there a common mechanism that activated our immune systems and send them into overdrive, involving viral RNA - your type delivered by the virus itself, my type delivered by the vaccine? But, then, there are other examples of PMR triggers involving protein-based vaccines (i.e. non-RNA) or cases where no 'biochemical' trigger could be identified.

As far as I know, researchers have also looked at whether long covid might have an autoimmune component. E.g see this article in Nature:

nature.com/articles/d41586-...

It would be nice if long covid could be cured (i.e. its symptoms could be suppressed) by a course of prednisolone, but it seems long covid can have many forms, affecting different parts of the body and with different symptoms.

[PMRpro Ambassador in reply to PRL1957]

"It would be nice if long covid could be cured (i.e. its symptoms could be suppressed) by a course of prednisolone, but it seems long covid can have many forms, affecting different parts of the body and with different symptoms."

Just like autoimmune disease in general - always caused by something upsetting the immune system and it becoming deranged. What you are diagnosed with depends on which bit of the body is attacked. In fact - is it only called Long Covid because it is identified that it started after having Covid? With most autimmune conditions there is no identifiable link to a specific cause.

But pred isn't a cure - it is a management strategy. A cure means the mechanism is identified and and the disturbance rectified and they haven't managed that for anything yet.

[LittleJane]

Thank you for your thoughts PRL1957(the year I was born 🙂)My nature is to want to understand the whys and wherefores of everything. I'm not very good at just accepting, I want the answers but sometimes there aren't any. PMR and a host of other autoimmune conditions are in my maternal family going back to first cousins who married and had children (my mother and her siblings being from this line) It could have been triggered by anything but I suspect stress, be it physical (Covid) or mental (PTSD/anxiety). More importantly how I deal with it is my main concern now.

[AtopicGuy]

PMR is an autoimmune disease and a form of inflammatory vasculitis. The immune system mistakenly targets the lining of blood vessels (and/or the adjacent tissue) as if there were a threat.

Nobody knows why the immune system goes wrong in this way. However, it is such a complicated system, it would be amazing if it never failed. The risk factors include ageing, being female, already having another autoimmune condition, and smoking.

No pathogen (virus, bacterium, fungus or parasite) has yet been associated with PMR. There is no known trigger. The immune system is constantly being challenged, and is constantly involved in routine maintenance. It can go wrong at any time, and eventually correct itself in many cases.

Long-covid is not unique. Many infectious illnesses can cause chronic (long-lasting) fatigue and pain/aches: glandular fever (EBV, mononucleosis or mono) and flu (influenza) are examples. They have to be ruled out before a diagnosis of PMR can be made.