Out of date vials of B12 how strong are they?

[jointpain]

I have been SI B12 for nearly 5 years and got so much stronger considering how terrible and weak I was. I bought extra when Brexit was becoming a reality half knowing I could still be using it once the use by date had finished. I had been fine using the out of date B12 (04/2022) until I suspect a couple of months ago when I began feeling a fair bit weaker, more noticeable to me when out cycling. Then four weeks ago I believe I fell from my bike unconscious and fractured my skull, broke three ribs, grade 4/5 spleen damage and a puncture to my left lung, broke my right hand. While in hospital for three weeks I wasn't able to SI B12 for the first two weeks but did after and since I've been home. I know I have some degree of brain injury from the accident but I also think the B12 is not as potent as it once was. Does anyone have any hard evidence that B12 vials really deteriorate after the use by date, or is it just a marketing game. Thank you for any information.

[Nackapan]

Im sorry to hear of your Injuries.Views differ on the effect of using b12 out of date.

I would definitely use in date b12 for your recovery.

Hope you get some relief soon. 😌

[wedgewood]

Really sorry to hear of your injuries , I wish you a speedy recovery.

I’ve been self -injecting for 9 years , and I’ve never used an out of date ampoule . I have heard of members using out of date ampoules, but not as out of date as yours . I really think that the ampoules start to lose their potency , not immediately after the expiry date , but fairly soon . I have no hard evidence , just what I’ve read on this forum for over 9 years .

[jointpain in reply to wedgewood]

Thank you both for your replies. My GP sent a district nurse round for bloods which were done yesterday so the results may be known on Monday. As B12 serum is going to be tested it may be interesting as the last time that was tested I was over 2000 whatevers so if it is any less it would add to the evidence that the vials were deteriorating over time. As I lost a fair bit of blood from my injuries and didn't have any transfusions he thinks I may be anemic which the restless legs seem to confirm.

[wedgewood in reply to jointpain]

Also stress , be it physical or mental can deplete B12 . And you have had both . Plus the less than perfect ampoules .

[Nackapan in reply to jointpain]

Do let us know how you get on

[SouthSounder]

On the expiration issue, I posted this about 4 months ago: healthunlocked.com/pasoc/po... Scroll up a bit to see the full comment w/link to the article it mentions.

Basically a study looked at 100 drugs & found that 90% of them were fully potent 15 years after their expiration date, though that may vary by drug, and perhaps liquid forms are a bit more vulnerable (perhaps). I've been using some single dose ampules which expired 2/2022, they seem fine, based on my symptoms. I store the B12 in the door of my frig, so they're about 39 degrees F, and in total darkness virtually all the time. I did just get a new script, and will likely now alternate old/new, injecting once a week.

Obviously, the $$$ grubbing business weasels who sell pharmaceuticals would prefer you throw them out and fork-over for "new ones". Sorry, but I'm pretty cynical when it comes to "capitalism".

[deniseinmilden in reply to SouthSounder]

Really appreciate your notes on the study, thank you. I totally agree. I've used up ampoules that are long out of date and have been subjected to fluctuating heat (terrible for wine!) due to being in my car, etc, and haven't noticed any difference. So much so that I've become much more blasé over the years as a consequence.

If I am choosing to store them for longer than their date (which I have done since Brexit) I try to keep them temperature stable and cool.

I always protect them as much as possible from light (in boxes in a dark cupboard).

I'm pretty sensitive to the effects of things so am sure I'd know pronto if there was a problem.

[deniseinmilden]

Terribly sorry to hear of your dreadful accident and wish you a speedy, and as complete as possible, recovery.

[pitney]

I wish you a swift recovery👍

[clivealive Forum Support]

Ouch! jointpain That sounds really awful and I hope you have a complete recovery.

Here's me worrying about the one ampoule I have left to use which "expired" in January 2023.....

I wish you well

[deniseinmilden in reply to clivealive]

I respect your judgement over mine, but I haven't found any deterioration in ampoules that have been stored in the dark but are a year beyond their date.

Being me (sciencey minded) I've done my own trials on myself with in-date and out-of-date ampoules and found no difference.

I did this specifically so I could keep as great a number of ampoules in stock as possible at any one time, to give me a decent buffer time to sort out new supplies, if ever we can't get them by post as we do now.

Hope you're still doing OK and love hearing from you. All the best!

[tomdickharry]

I had similar issues, though not as drastic as yours. My supply expired last July but I had to keep on using them as I could not get fresh supplies. I was falling a lot, injuring my face and shoulder. Pharmasana told me they were good for at least a year but would be less effective as time passed. I got over that by injecting more frequently. Now have supply from Amazon.de with long date.

[mcg-woo]

Hello, I am sorry about what happened to you and wish you a speedy recovery. While I have never used expired b12 vials since a pharmacist told me not to— I have used multi-use vials after 28 days when they are supposed to be discarded and unrefrigerated once opened as well.

I didn’t know better and I couldn’t figure out why I suffered such a setback in my recovery until a pharmacist questioned how long I was using the vials when she noticed I was going months without filling my Rx.

There is no doubt than even unexpired opened vials deteriorate over time. Don’t take the chance, it’s not worth it. Now, I wrap my vials in foil, refrigerate open and unopened and toss the opened vial after 28 days. I do everything in my power to protect the integrity of the vials so they are as potent as possible. I feel like I can tell a difference in the potency of the first injection out of the multi-use vial and wish single use vials of hydroxocobalamin were available in the US.

Using expired b12 could certainly result in you not receiving the proper dosage due to deterioration as you now likely suspect given your setback. I know it’s sickening to discard the expired b12, but taking a chance with your health isn’t worth the risk of not receiving the b12 you need to recover and remain in remission.

Best of luck in your recovery!

[jointpain]

Thank you all for your kind words 😁 I finally got to speak with a locum GP today, the GP that ordered the blood tests, didn't order a B12 serum after saying he would, so I'll not know if the vials were deteriorating! The rest of the tests were "fine" and I am going to get an MRI on my head and spine to check that the cervical spinal stenosis hasn't been further damaged. Al's an x-ray on my broken right thumb, just a month late or more. I even wobbled up to the shed today with a bit of support 😋 and had a "new" b12 injection yesterday. Lovely jubbly