Have just been refused B12 injection - Pernicious Anaemi...

Pernicious Anaemia Society

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Have just been refused B12 injection

Liz0808 profile image
21 Replies

Hi,

I'm due to have a B12 injection this Friday. I went to pick up the prescription from my GPs and they said I don't need them any more (I've been having them every 12 weeks for around 4 years) as my B12 levels are fine. I said 'I do need them, i'm exhausted and can't cope with life' They said a doctor will ring me this morning.

I'm now awaiting the call but what do I say. How do I explain that I stll need B12 even though my levels n my blood are apparently OK?

A quick reply would be helpful.

Thanks

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Liz0808 profile image
Liz0808
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21 Replies
Nackapan profile image
Nackapan

say if tested negative for IFAB.

Only picks up 50% of those with PA.

Say whole point of b12 injections is to keep levels high.

Say no proof of ill effects or anything ' overdosing!!

Say should go by symptoms.

Look through posts

I wrote one post' letter recieved. '

Press on my icon to see post and replies

Inform PAS if you can .

Ridicilous whats going on AGAIN

Jillymo profile image
Jillymo

Tell them this is the very reason it states not to recheck bloods because once on therapy it is common sense your levels will be high !

Point them to guidlines or Pas .

It is like dealing with a load of ruddy imbaciles that havn't a clue on how to treat the condition.

You could also ask for a second opinion.

Liz0808 profile image
Liz0808

Thanks Nackapan - sorry to hear you are having a bad time of it as well. thanks also Jillymo . So the the doctor rung. They seem to think that my level - 391- is OK and that to give me more B12 wouldn't be safe - said I would be 'zoned out'!! But as I was so exhausted I could have the injection this time but will take my bloods again and will look for other causes. The doctor also said that she had pernicious aneaemia so knew all about it. I think she said I had negative IFAB and was implying that I don't need B12 for the rest of my life. I was exhausted to argue - so will have to do that once after the B12 i get on Friday takes effect.

Nackapan profile image
Nackapan in reply to Liz0808

That doctor should know better .

Surey wouldve read up on PA.

Also be very aware b12 levels dont mean a thing once on b12 Injections.

Your symptoms are the most important

The response to b12 injections .

If anything you need more rather thsn less .

Your reading low on injections.

The doctor shoukd know this

Stck with the gp with PA

Mord likely to read stuff

Print off stuff.

Offer to self inject ??

List symptoms and note when they return. Or improve

Zone out ???on too much

I zone out when i need it

Narwhal10 profile image
Narwhal10

oh Liz0808,

I am so sorry and appalled. It is understandable that you are too exhausted to fight. Firstly, they shouldn’t be checking your levels and secondly a level of 391 is not ok. If they are going to check it - it should be sky high 1000 +.

Have your vitamin B12 injection. I do hope you feel better.

Best wishes

Sleepybunny profile image
Sleepybunny

Hi,

I suggest putting concerns into a short letter to GP and practice manager.

Unhappy with Treatment (UK info)

Letters to GPs about B12 deficiency

b12deficiency.info/b12-writ...

Above link has letter templates covering a variety of situations linked to B12 deficiency.

NHS Complaints

patients-association.org.uk...

Care Opinion website

careopinion.org.uk/

Local MP/devolved representative may be worth talking to.

If you suspect PA or have a PA diagnosis then worth joining and talking to PAS

PAS membership is separate to membership of this forum.

PAS (Pernicious Anaemia Society)

Based in Wales, UK.

pernicious-anaemia-society....

There is a helpline number that PAS members can ring.

Check PAS articles and their page for health professionals. You may want to point your GP to these.

PAS article "Testing B12 during treatment"

Has some useful quotes that might be worth including in a letter.

pernicious-anaemia-society....

Article from Dutch B12 website "Testing B12 during treatment"

(Units, ref ranges, treatment patterns may vary from UK)

stichtingb12tekort.nl/engli...

Other PAS leaflets/articles

pernicious-anaemia-society....

PAS page for health professionals

pernicious-anaemia-society....

Some GPs have wrong ideas about B12 deficiency

B12 article from Mayo Clinic in US

The Many Faces of Cobalamin (Vitamin B12) Deficiency

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articl...

Table 1 in above article is about frequent misconceptions about B12 deficiency that health professionals may have.

Diagnosis and Treatment Pitfalls

(From B12 Institute in Netherlands - units, ref ranges, treatment patterns may vary from UK)

b12-institute.nl/en/diagnos...

I suggest you track down the local B12 deficiency guidelines for your ICB (Integrated Care Board) or Health Board and compare the info with BSH/BNF/NICE CKS links below.

BSH Cobalamin and Folate Guidelines

b-s-h.org.uk/guidelines/gui...

BNF Hydroxocobalamin

bnf.nice.org.uk/drug/hydrox...

NICE CKS (Clinical Knowledge Summary) B12 deficiency and Folate deficiency

cks.nice.org.uk/topics/anae...

I know you would like a short answer but if you can manage to wade through the threads below there may be other info that might help you to argue against their decision.

Links to forum threads where I left detailed replies with lots of B12 deficiency info eg causes and symptoms, more UK B12 documents, B12 books, B12 websites and B12 articles and a few hints on dealing with unhelpful GPs.

Some links may have details that could be upsetting.

Some of the info will be specific to UK.

healthunlocked.com/pasoc/po...

healthunlocked.com/pasoc/po...

healthunlocked.com/pasoc/po...

I am not medically trained.

Sleepybunny profile image
Sleepybunny in reply to Sleepybunny

PAS members can access a leaflet/article "Treatment Changed - What can you do?"

pernicious-anaemia-society....

Blog post about help if B12 injections stopped

b12deficiency.info/are-your...

Jason_h123 profile image
Jason_h123

really sorry to hear this, I am expecting the same when I return as the HCA ignored my notes and requests and gave me a B12 test as well as a begrudged B12 jab last visit.

Complaint letters were sent but not even acknowledged 😟

Litatamon profile image
Litatamon

stichtingb12tekort.nl/engli...

stichtingb12tekort.nl/engli...

stichtingb12tekort.nl/engli...

So sorry you have to deal with nonsense. All the best to you.

(Sleepbunny probably posted them already -- but reposting because they are great links - concise & with footnotes.)

Saoirse2016 profile image
Saoirse2016

I was told that [here in Ireland] the HSE changed the 'standard' for low B12, from below 500 something something to below 200 something something (sorry, don't know if it's mmol. or what!), and that GPs aren't telling patients what their numbers are...

I've been told mine is 'fine' but I feel terrible, I've been using an oral spray the last 6 months which is helping a bit, but I'm beginning to think I'll need to start self injecting

cheriton22 profile image
cheriton22 in reply to Saoirse2016

Have you asked the surgery to e mail you a copy of your blood results,

Saoirse2016 profile image
Saoirse2016 in reply to cheriton22

If I ask them anything they get very antsy at me. I'm due to get bloods done (for diabetes) again soon, so I'm going to speak to a different doctor and see if they aren't any more help. I'm really suffering at the moment from pain and fatigue.

Sleepybunny profile image
Sleepybunny in reply to Saoirse2016

"If I ask them anything they get very antsy at me"

Have you tried asking in a letter as this avoids face to face confrontation?

Can your local MP help?

Apologies as I don't know much about health issues in Ireland.

Access to medical records in Ireland

citizensinformation.ie/en/h...

themdu.com/guidance-and-adv...

HSE B12 deficiency and folate deficiency

(Based on NHS info)

www2.hse.ie/conditions/vita...

Your GP might find the UK documents in my reply to Liz interesting.

Saoirse2016 profile image
Saoirse2016 in reply to Sleepybunny

I've already printed off information about PA and shown it to them, I was 'told off' for using the internet

I can't see why any politician would be interested in helping me (they're totally useless over here!) 🤷‍♀️

I will try another doctor as the one I've been seeing the past 5/6 years has clearly been talking to my mother's doctor and going along with whatever she's saying about me 🙄

shaws profile image
shaws

My mother was also given the same excuse that she didn't need more injections as 'blood' was fine.

Both my sister and myself thought that was good.

Unfortunately (no internet at that time) that decision by the GP caused my mother to develop stomach cancer and we had to plead for more pain relief (we were caring for her at home) towards her 'end of life',

I also have P.A. but my GP said I can have as many B12 injections that I feel I need.

Narwhal10 profile image
Narwhal10 in reply to shaws

I’m so sorry to read about your mother. Palliative care is very difficult.

Good to hear you have a good G.P.

wedgewood profile image
wedgewood

Really pleased to hear that you have an intelligent, caring doctor who has informed himself about the nature of Pernicious Anaemia. 👍👍👍

EllaNore profile image
EllaNore

I'm so sorry Liz0808, that they are doing this to you. Do you self inject at all?

This is a terrible position to be in. I'm so sorry.

Some people can afford to SI. But what about the ones that can't? They have to suffer at the hands of incompetence. They have nowhere to turn. They can't afford to save their own lives. They don't have a choice!

This is a matter of life. What the 🤬 is wrong with these people? I'm so angry for you. I want to reach through the forum and hug you. I wish i could give you the b12 you need. I can offer no help, just support.

Although, I'd be willing to ship you an ampoule or two and a syringe. Is that possible?

Midnight_Voice profile image
Midnight_Voice

Telling you that you have enough B12, and so you don’t need any more injections, is like telling you that your stomach is full, and so you don’t need any more meals.

EllaNore profile image
EllaNore in reply to Midnight_Voice

Good one Midnight_Voice!!

Flintfootfilly profile image
Flintfootfilly

Look up paradoxical B12 deficiency. Gregory Russell Jones has written and interesting paper on it.

Whether you could geta doctor to read it, it change their opinion asa result of it is another matter though.

.

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