I had three grey hairs when I was 12 years old. I was wondering how many members here started going gray at an early age. Since I stopped dyeing my hair I have been told I have a gorgeous head of "Irish" white hair. Is it true that people of Irish descent tend to go gray earlier than other groups? If so, does that mean that Irish people have a genetic predisposition for having pernicious anemia. These are just some questions that popped into my head this morning.
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MoKayD
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I’ve often heard it said that premature greying of the hair could be indicative of Pernicious Anaemia . I’ve never heard that the Irish are more prone to P.A , just Northern Europeans in general .
I started getting a few grey hairs some years back, in retrospect around the time my B12 dosage was too low but I just put it down to age and maybe genetics at the time. Although I'll never know for sure, it now seems quite possible that it was the B12.
I do wonder if there's a link to the genes of Celtic types.
Certainly people with red hair and freckles are known to have more sensitive nervous systems nih.gov/news-events/nih-res...
And most red heads are coming from Ireland or Scotland, or both in my mother's case.
I inherited this red hair too and quite a sensitive nervous system. And I wonder if that extra sensitivity requires higher rates of B12 to support the bodies fragility.
It's a controversial topic I suspect. But I wonder if Celtic tribes (Scots, Irish, Welsh, Cornish) may be more predisposed to B12 deficiency or at least should not reduce meat intake because they may have higher requirements to support their nervous and immune systems.
Just a theory...and yes, a female friend of mine has Irish parents and she went grey at 25. Dyed it ever since!
This paper might shed some light - but from a (fairly) quick scan read, it looks as if the identified loci need further interpretation - how frequently do they occur in the various populations?
Genome-wide association study identifies five risk loci for pernicious anemia
My daughter and granddaughter had gene tests done, which pointed to difficulty absorbing various vitamins, etc. including B12, D, etc. - passed down through the maternal line. Four in close family also suffer with gut problems. My dear mum was Austrian, father - Irish descent with red hair. Once told by an aunt that her three cousins had the reddest hair she’d ever seen.
My sister (auburn hair, blue eyes), was misdiagnosed ME/CFS for years and, after research produced, was eventually given B12 injections. These were then stopped by her surgery, sadly with subsequent deterioration. Even though we fought for her, the medics/psychiatrists refused to take into account the research papers presented and the injections the family gave were too late to stop the horrible effects of nerve damage. The surgery then claimed it was vascular dementia.
I have Dupytrens (Viking’s Disease) - left little finger now permanently bent into palm in the last few years - one research paper found links this with PA!
Dr Chandy’s book, ‘B12 Deficiency in Clinical Practice’, interestingly mentions John Kennedy and his Irish family history of PA, thyroid and Addison’s Disease. Four in our family have PA/B12 def. and three have Hashimoto’s thyroid disease.
Two years ago at beginning of lockdown, I was taken to hospital with suspected Addison’s disease after a back injury, (second bout in my life of relentless nausea, etc.) and given days of rehydration treatment - long story but cortisol was never tested ! Previously thick hair started to fall out afterwards and what was left turned into weird, frizzy striped white/grey/dark grey patches, (now starting to normalise) - other signs were skin pigmentation and terrible anxiety but, thankfully, I’ve found huge relief after treatment with herbal Adrenal Tonic 🤗
I hope this history helps other families as, apparently, autoimmune disease is on the rise. Could it be that people whose ancestors came from countries that were badly affected by poverty, starvation and stress in the past are more vulnerable ?
Sad that your daughter has had so much to contend with at a young age, Nackapan…….. I was told Addison’s is very rare but, as two doctors suspected Addison’s from description of symptoms, and every test done but cortisol, I’m really not convinced, especially having read up about it since.
The only diagnosis I haven’t had difficulty in obtaining is high BP, which is obviously white coat syndrome. Little wonder - BP probably starts to climb as soon as Dr No appears 👾.
They were all very kind but I’m obviously classed as even more ‘non compliant’ since this last last incident uncovered B12 self injection, Metavive thyroid hormone and homeopathic Arnica for pain. I couldn’t help wondering if the royal family had this problem 😊
Interesting. All of the PA and B12D sufferers in the family are/were red-heads, except for beige- headed me, but only I have the vitiligo. All pale, blue eyed and freckled, although the vitiligo seems to have suppressed my freckle-production! I am greying mainly where the vitiligo is in little patches on my scalp.
I started going grey around 14 or 15 i think, right about when the psychological symptoms of B12D started. By my 20s I already had whole patches of grey and by 30 i was ready to finally dye my hair. I'm not a anywhere close to being irish
I too have often heard that premature greying can be linked to PA but I don't think i've ever seen studies on it.
Statistically speaking development of PA has long been associated with premature greying and also with blue eyes.The suspicion is that the genetic variants that makes people more susceptible to developing PA are more common in people who also have premature greying and blue eyes which fits with North European ancestry
I've heard several times in the past (but don't have references) that it is genetically linked to blue-eyed, blonde Scandinavian types and I've remembered this because it describes me. I have the dimple in the cartilage in the end of my nose that is frequently found in Saxon lineage and my father's family's name meant "Saxon town". In theory my maternal ancestors came from Gascony, south west France, but they were all blue-eyed blondes too so not of the region's type. I suspect they originated from Northern Europe as well and I've got a double dose of the genetics.
Being so blonde it's hard to tell if B12d produces premature aging but in my case I think not - I had quite severe B12 deficiency symptoms long before I found my first white hair aged 28, and I was only looking because all my friends had them. It was more it's slightly crinkley, thicker texture that gave it away! 😃 Now 50, having had the sun on my hair this summer, I just look just as blonde as ever, with my lighter hairs just blending in.
There's no reason why the Northern European B12 deficiency which is linked to blue eyes (and possibly fair skin and hair), that possibly doesn't cause premature greying, has not developed entirely separately from an Irish/Scottish, possibly red hair linked gene, which does affect pigmentation!
The article that helvella posted was talking about variants on genes that have variants that are associated with auto-immunity. There is so much more to genetics and disease development than what genes do you have - and still a lot that we don't know about what specific variants do and what activates them - ie a lot of environmental and probably some cross-gene interactions.I think you also have to be careful about samples that have been used to draw results - if you have only looked at Northern samples then things are going to be skewed to Northern traits.
Hello. Both my father had as I do too PA. We both went grey/white in our early 40s. I stopped colouring mine bout ten years ago and now love the colour. There may be a link but I also have vitiligo too so that may contribute.
Ironically, both my son and I have PA. We both have grey hair but since self injections of B12 twice weekly for a couple years we are less grey!!! Colour coming back to both of us. My hairdresser is amazed! She wants me to keep quiet in case she loses clients wanting grey hair coloured!!! Haha
Interesting thread... I'm Irish descent, when young had very dark hair, grey eyes and pale complexion, have vitiligo and carry the Haemachromatosis gene, so the full Irish complement. I started colouring my hair at about 40 due to the odd white one however, when my first signs of my lack of B12 hit in, (which I didn't identify) the whitening started working from my forehead backwards like a white wave. As I quite liked the look I stopped dying the hair. As soon as I was diagnosed with a B12 deficiency and started the jabs, the speedy whitening stopped. I look complete white from the front and the back is a slate grey which is only very slowly gaining more white hairs. As far as me personally the link to my B12 deficiency is absolute.
My hairdresser brought up the concern of my graying hairat age 44 bc he had never seen anyone go gray so fast. He said I should get some bloodwork done. Between that and the neuro symptom of sudden stabbing sensation in my thigh, I was luckily able to get diagnosed quickly and b12 shots have helped…..stilll would be all gray at 48 if I didn’t dye my hair.
When i was very young - pre-teens I think - I had a big white streak at the back. Didn't notice much because of being so blonde then, but my mum used to struggle to get a brush through it. Not having seen much of it myself, i'd forgotten all about it - until my sisters reminded me of it a few years ago. I'm only 1/4 Irish - so maybe that's why I only had a streak !! Irish white hair sounds wonderful.
I have seen a video about PA where one of the women had significant frontal hair loss, on treatment, it returned to it's original dark colour - amazing !
I suspect I have had B12 problems since childhood (I have a diagnosis of functional B12 deficiency now). My first grey hair came at 19; by my early 30s I started dyeing my hair to cover it. I use semi-permanent (quicker to put in, and more forgiving as it fades out), but now I am in my early 50s the roots that grow in are completely grey at the front, with only some colour remaining towards the hair at the back of my neck.
I have never associated it with B12, so am very interested in this thread! I had always assumed that it was because I must have shorter telomeres (the protective end caps on the ends of the chromosomes, that act as buffers and stop the genes becoming damaged), as premature greying is linked to shorter telomeres. Interestingly, hormones can protect the length of telomeres, so they typically get shorter during the menopause, when the hormones change / reduce.
Anecdotally, quite a few posters on this forum have said that B12D / PA has worsened / emerged after menopause. I suspect there is a cascade effect of things that change how our genes function, epigenetically. And B12 D / PA might be the cause of a lot of it. High levels of metabolites (MMA and Homocysteine) have a really major impact on the functioning of hundreds of other genes…
I also had auburn hair, hazel eyes and freckles..!
Early graying is common in my family. I suspect my paternal grandmother had B12 deficiency and one of the reason I think this is because I've been told that her hair was completely silver by the time she was 40.
I did not start at 12, and I also did my hair but noticed quite a bit of gray in my 30's. I stopped dying my hair 12 years ago and have a pretty cool gray going on with two large white streaks in front. I get a lot of compliments and people like to touch it. Lolol
I always related it to having a hysterectomy and being chemically put into menopause at 23. Looking back now, I had PA type symptoms decades ago.
when I was 14 years old I get some grey hairs. When I was 30 years old, my hair was white for 100%. My hairdresser told me this was not normal, I had many health problems but no docter checked if my B12 was oke. When I was 45 years old and very sick I was checked on B12, it was very very low and it seemed I have PA.
Since I have injections I am not 100% white anymore but get more and gray and black hairs.
Are you getting what I refer to as reverse Gray? The more gray my hair gets this one patch of my hair stays dark reddish brown. It's kind of cool. have never seen anyone else with it. I've seen some beautiful gray hair though. I'm so glad people are going more natural. Gray can be quite stunning.
I had some grey hairs when I was a teenager but in my twenties I got white hairs, not first gray but straightaway from black hair to white. Yes I think b12 is doing something with pigmentation of te hair. I am happy now with my white hair with a little bit of black and grey , although some little children call me grandma😂.
Ya, the whole Ma'am thing gets me. And people treat me like I'm old. 👵 Shoot I still ride a motorcycle. Well, not at the moment but I hope I can again one day. I want to be old with long gray hair and still ride at 80 years old. Lolol
My hair started greying by 11. That was the last trip to the hairdresser for me. I was so embarrassed, as an 11 year old, when the hairdresser started making a fuss and asking everyone to come look at my head. I've cut my own hair since then. I was sick to the point of it really affecting me by 16. I don't know how I survived it. I didn't get proper treatment until I was in my late 20s. I'm American of Spanish and Native American descent. We all know how the Spanish got around so I've always assumed anything could be in my ancestry. My hair is dark but I have lighter skin, but tan fairly easily. I have many family members on my paternal side that are light haired and blue eyed. I've never done a family background and only know the history up to my grandparents and great-grandparents. My hair did on occasion return to its original color and I had many dark brown hairs that were red in the middle and white on the ends. I still have a lot of white hair but it has slowed in changing, since proper treatment. For a while, I expected to be all white by 30.
You sound beautiful. I'm sorry it was such a life changing thing for you. One would never imagine being gray at 11. Being different as a child is quite difficult. Kids can be cruel and it sticks with you. It's fascinating that you're hair changes color. I always thought mine was more brownish red some days, but it was so subtle it was hard to tell. We earned every gray hair. We should embrace it.
Haha, yes I've often fantasized about waking up in morning with a full head of white while I'm still young. It is a badge of honor, and I've always thought women with natural pure white and silver hair had absolutely gorgeous hair.
Gray is in these days. We were hip before gray was hip. Lol
Hi. My mother was a redhead from Newfoundland, Canada and turned grey in her early thirties. She had Irish lineage and died from Alzheimer's 15 years ago. Since then other of her siblings have died from Alzheimer's. Since I've been struggling with B12 deficiency/PA, I've often wondered if she might have had a deficiency and never knew it - and perhaps her sibs as well - or at least a combination of it along with the dementia.
My mother too. I found out recently that her folate had been low and B12 too. She was given a short course of folic acid but nothing else, and then plenty of folate depleting meds. But I suspect it was treatable if not totally reversible.
By the time my PA was diagnosed my hair had gone completely white. After a while of getting injections I started getting a lot of dark hairs, it’s now grey/white because of age but I think I would have kept my colour for much longer than I did.
I'm 60 this year and have only a few grey hairs. My husband, who doesn't have P.A. has been completely grey for many years - he says putting up with me sent him grey 🤣
Super interesting research about PA. I have a research question of my own: I wonder if being born prematurely leads to higher risk of developing PA or other absorption issues. It wouldn’t surprise me if rates of PA might be higher in people who were premature or extremely premature.
Interesting question! Could be the mothers had untreated PA & thus the children are at a higher risk too. There's quite some literature out of India & Turkey about children born to mothers with b12d, mainly due to dietary reasons, but the result will be the same. I'll have to check what the reported issues were but low birth weight was among the issues I remember, will have to check about premature birth. I haven't seen any research on whether being premature on its own leads to absorption issues but I haven't sought out that info. You might try searching on Google scholar.
yes I've also read articles that describe the link between maternal b12 deficiency and premature birth. But so far I am not aware of any studies that have researched whether adults who were born prematurely are at higher risk of developing PA or vitamin absorption issues. I myself was born extremely prematurely at 26 weeks and I've developed a host of issues that my docs and I suspect were linked to my prematurity, and so naturally I wonder if my PA is also somehow linked. No one in my family has PA or any absorption issues that I'm aware of.
Have you had a PCA test(Parietal Cell Antibody), gastrin test and pepsinogen test?
These can help to diagnose PA. If you have symptoms consistent with B12 deficiency and close relatives with PA, I think GP should be taking another look at PA.
I left replies with lots of B12 info on threads below. Some details may be upsetting.
That is fascinating. I started greying in my early 20's and am sure I was B12 deficient all my life. Mother was English/Scottish and she was fully white by age 40 or earlier. Was diagnosed with alzheimers but I suspect it was B12 dementia. A big hug to all of you whose parents were misdiagnosed with Alz. By the grace of God hopefully we can avoid it with B12 injections.
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but I just put it down to age and maybe genetics at the time. Although I'll never know for sure, it now seems quite possible that it was the B12.
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