B12/folic and crohns: My friend and... - Pernicious Anaemi...

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B12/folic and crohns

57 Replies

My friend and neighbour has crohns, I know little about this only of what she tells me. We have been talking frequently on phone even though she lives two doors away. She has not been well so I popped down last week with a treat, She has lost a lot of weight I hardly recognised her. Rang her christmas day morning she thought she was having heart attack. I said no. No. Got hold of son and daughter (both have cancer) they came over and dealt with her. This morning she phoned and said I need to call 111 can you help. Went to see her, her legs three times bigger since christmas day.She told me that it felt like someone putting needles in her feet (alarm bells rang with me) anyway got through to 111 asked many questions, she forgot about the pins and needles and breathlessness she had been suffering from. She got an appointment to night at 6.30 at local hospital so nurses can see if further action needed.

I told her to write down everything and take it with her.

I just hope and pray more investigations are done!

She puts on a brave face so as not to worry her children.

57 Replies
Nackapan profile image
Nackapan

It is well known chrohns disease csn deplete b12. Let's hope they include thus and other nutrients thsf may nir be absorbed tested

On her bloods

K Hooe she imltivrdxsnd get tge help needed

in reply toNackapan

Thanks nackapan, it was only through this website I knew about this. My friend and partner went to school to gether over 65 years ago, and both are suffering at the moment they are like two peas in a pod. 😜She is aware of b12 deficiency, both her daughter and granddaughter have it. I'm not so sure she knows all the symptoms. One will telephone each other several times a week to see how the other is doing!

I don't like to interfer, but she knows she can phone me any time if she needs help. She is not on any b12 medication which is a concern, at least my partner has at least been given injection.

Your thoughts are probably are the same as mine, but will have to wait and see. Just praying now the hospital will do more to help her.

Thanks for replying I know you are below par yourself and only too willing to help.

One other thing I picked upon was the fact she could only eat banana this morning and her breathlessness subsided. (Could be folic ?)

Nackapan profile image
Nackapan in reply to

Let's hope b12 and folate iron ect tested with full blood count. Ask her .

It often isn't done .

Breathlessness and swollen kegs coukd be her

heart?? Which wi be checked

Main thing is she's being seen.

in reply toNackapan

She has just phoned to ask if she borrow the ice packs I took down.

Here we go round again in circles, a & E doctor contradicted her doctor. Put her on another load of antibiotics (third lot).

She is being tested for b12 etc January 5th, Until then she has to lay down with her legs elevated above her heart.

As she said she can do no more than do what they say!

Sleepybunny profile image
Sleepybunny in reply to

Banana is a good source of potassium.

in reply toSleepybunny

Yes she eats banana every morning.

She rang this morning ... they say bloods tests OK ?????

In hospital she was given warfarin and had to go back today for scan.... if no blood clot found she is going to have to have cat scan !

Looked up the doctor she was under at surgery newly qualified GP.

SHe didnt get around to asking about levels as doctor was in a bit of a panic and sent her straight to hospital.

She did mention that the one leg (right) was measured and a lot lot bigger than the other.

Sleepybunny profile image
Sleepybunny

Hi,

Maybe you could pass on the details for PAS and B12 deficiency Info websites and suggest she looks at this forum.

PAS (Pernicious Anaemia Society)

Based in Wales, UK.

pernicious-anaemia-society....

There is a helpline number that PAS members can ring.

Link about "What to do next" if B12 deficiency suspected

b12deficiency.info/what-to-...

Maybe she can get hold of one of these books below. Some local library services have copies.

"What You Need to Know About Pernicious Anaemia and B12 Deficiency" by Martyn Hooper

Martyn Hooper is the chair of PAS (Pernicious Anaemia Society).

BNF treatment info is out of date in book. See link below.

BNF Hydroxocobalamin

bnf.nice.org.uk/drug/hydrox...

"Living with Pernicious Anaemia and Vitamin B12 Deficiency" by Martyn Hooper

Has several case studies.

"Could it Be B12?: An Epidemic of Misdiagnoses" by Sally Pacholok and JJ. Stuart (US authors)

Very comprehensive with lots of case studies.

"Vitamin B12 deficiency in Clinical Practice" (subtitle "Doctor, you gave me my life back!" by Dr Joseph Alexander "Chandy" Kayyalackakom and Hugo Minney PhD

NICE guidelines Crohn's disease

cks.nice.org.uk/topics/croh...

Research article about functional B12 deficiency in Crohn's disease

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/262...

in reply toSleepybunny

Unfortunately she doesn't have internet access. I am sure she is aware of b12 deficiency, the only problem I can see is if her results come back quite low but within the guidelines, but even in that case they SHOULD be willing to treat her. One thing the doctors should do is read the latest edition on the website where it saysA particular drawback of testing B12 levels is that currently widely used tests only measures total of b12 and not active.

There is also reference to levels of 400 can still be borderline.

How many doctors read this and act.

I spoke to her this morning, she is sleeping alot and keeping her leg elevated, but when I speak to her again I will mention to her about getting the actual figures.

She is on Iron tablets !

Many thanks.

Sleepybunny profile image
Sleepybunny

If I remember correctly the CCG for your area does not have a good reputation for the way B12 deficiency is managed.

Maybe you could copy this blog post to give her at some point.

b12deficiency.info/blog/202...

in reply toSleepybunny

You are correct re area. And will give her the blog. Thanks.

Sometimes I wondered if I had a plum in my mouth life wouldn't be so difficult.

😱...... 🤪

in reply toSleepybunny

My friend phoned yesterday, on fourth lot of antibiotics Even stronger ! Contrary to what A and E said do not use Ice packs. She is sleeping on a mattress on the floor, cant get upstairs. At least the Doctor did take blood tests earlier than her original appointment. She was more concerned about the breathlessness .

Just my opinion going through link you posted on Sally's Book, I think she has Thrombocytopenia. Surely 4 lots of antibiotics would have cleared an infection.

I am no doctor, only to say the information gained on this website and Knowing that Doctors have little knowledge of b12 deficiency.

Perhaps today or tomorrow we will know the results !

What does concern me is if she is b12 deficient, will she get the appropriate treatment, after all we live in gloucestershire, and their treatment is a DISGRACE!

in reply toSleepybunny

Well my friend has just phoned, her blood tests results are in ! I wont reveal all deficiency as too numerous to mention. But yes she has numerous Anaemias and thrombocytopenia.

🤞🤞

Sleepybunny profile image
Sleepybunny in reply to

I hope your friend gets a paper copy of or access to all her blood test results.

As to getting adequate treatment if she is B12 deficient, I am not hopeful as you're in Gloucestershire.

May be you could both move somewhere in the future where the guidelines are better.

Maybe she could join PAS if PA is a possible diagnosis.

There was a PAS support group in Gloucestershire but it needs a group co-ordinator.

pernicious-anaemia-society....

PAS membership

pernicious-anaemia-society....

There is a PAS members telephone helpline.

"I'm not so sure she knows all the symptoms. "

Maybe you could copy and print out a couple of these symptoms lists for her and she could tick off symptoms and add any extra symptoms she has.

GPs are more likely to take notice of NICE list I think.

Symptoms of B12 Deficiency

pernicious-anaemia-society....

b12deficiency.info/signs-an...

b12d.org/admin/healthcheck/...

Next link mentions symptoms of B12 deficiency and of folate deficiency (from NICE CKS)

cks.nice.org.uk/topics/anae...

Symptoms of Peripheral Neuropathy (damage to peripheral nerves)

nhs.uk/conditions/periphera...

Peripheral neuropathy can be associated with B12 deficiency and sometimes with folate deficiency.

Neurological Consequences of B12 Deficiency

PAS news item

pernicious-anaemia-society....

PAS article about SACD, sub acute combined degeneration of the spinal cord

pernicious-anaemia-society....

Maybe you could print out part of these documents for her.

UK B12 documents

BSH Cobalamin and Folate Guidelines (whole document)

b-s-h.org.uk/guidelines/gui...

Summary of BSH Cobalamin and Folate Guidelines

pernicious-anaemia-society....

Diagnostic flowchart from BSH Cobalamin and Folate Guidelines which mentions Antibody Negative PA.

stichtingb12tekort.nl/engli...

BNF Hydroxocobalamin

bnf.nice.org.uk/drug/hydrox...

NICE CKS B12 deficiency and Folate deficiency

cks.nice.org.uk/topics/anae...

BNF Folic Acid

bnf.nice.org.uk/drug/folic-...

See Cautions section in above link which says that folic acid should never be given on its own for PA (Pernicious Anaemia) or other megaloblastic anaemias caused by Vit B12 deficiency as this may lead to SACD, subacute combined degeneration of the spinal cord.

BNF Iron deficiency anaemia

bnf.nice.org.uk/treatment-s...

NICE CKS iron deficiency anaemia

cks.nice.org.uk/topics/anae...

Crohn's support - Gloucestershire

crohnsandcolitis.org.uk/sup...

in reply toSleepybunny

I am really concerned, as she has had 4 x antibiotics which have made her legs worse.She did say this morning that she was not going to take anymore as they were making her legs swell even more. (On reading more info on thrombocytopenia antibiotics can further increase the RISKS!)

I just hope and

🙏 that they now treat her deficiencies in the correct order. (Potassium and salt also very low).

She was told originally not to add salt to her food!

This is what you get when treatment is done by telephone calls and not seeing patients!

Before christmas she wanted to go into hospital

To find out what's was wrong........ she said this morning that it was now her biggest fear as she now realises her immune system is so low she fears she would catch covid.

Her son is at the hospital this afternoon, re:cancer

So it only adds to her concerns.

Sleepybunny profile image
Sleepybunny in reply to

I have read a few articles which suggested there may be an association between B12 deficiency and oedema (sometimes spelt edema) in some cases.

Oedema is the medical term for fluid retention.

I think your friend should talk to her GP or another doctor about her concerns over antibiotics.

G care is the reference website for doctors in Gloucestershire.

g-care.glos.nhs.uk/

in reply toSleepybunny

I am pretty sure now they will get expert help in how to approach her multiple problems (or I'd like to think they would. She did tell me that when she went down to the surgery last friday(blood test etc) that the doctor phoned a specialist whilst she was there for advice on treating her legs. Now they have the blood results surely they must seek specialist advice.

She also said that after seeing the doctor she sat back in the waiting room (nobody else there) waiting for her lift and the receptionist asked if she had seen the doctor, yes she replied.....

The receptionist said then you cant sit there you will have to wait outside.

😱

Is it any wonder that this surgery was voted as one of the worst in the area.

in reply toSleepybunny

She rang yesterday, she cant eat, tongue red raw and swollen.Today she rang...... she cant take anymore, doctors not done anything at present.

I ve just been down to see her, (I wish I hadn't as she looks 30 years older )

Her daughter has now collected her, and I told her daughter that they will have to threaten the surgery with getting the M.P. involved !

What else can they do?

Sleepybunny profile image
Sleepybunny in reply to

Hi again,

I'm assuming one of her deficiencies if B12 deficiency.

Does she have folate and iron deficiency as well?

Have her Vitamin D levels been checked?

Has she has any B12 injections yet?

Important that if she has B12 deficiency and folate deficiency that both deficiencies are treated. B12 treatment would usually be started first. Treating folate deficiency without treating a co-existing B12 deficiency can lead to neurological problems.

1) Has she rung NHS 111?

They can give advice on urgent medical issues.

nhs.uk/nhs-services/urgent-...

In a medical emergency, people should ring 999.

2) Support

Has she spoken to any Crohn's charities who should be able to offer support and pass on useful info?

If PA is a possibility, has she spoken to PAS?

pernicious-anaemia-society....

Some people on this forum have been helped by person who runs B12 Deficiency Info website.

b12deficiency.info/

3) Like you, I think it might be helpful to get in touch with MP.

MP's website should have a contact number for MP's case workers or an online contact form.

4) Perhaps she or her daughter could ring GP and/or practice manager and explain that she is deteriorating and ask for treatment to be started.

Might be worth following phone call with a brief letter to GP and/or practice manager outlining the issue. This is proof that issue has been raised. Keep copies.

b12deficiency.info/b12-writ...

5) If problems getting treatment continue, they might want to consider going to Press/other media. This is likely to permanently affect relationship with GP but can be effective.

Newspaper article about patient struggling to get B12 treatment in Scotland

eveningtelegraph.co.uk/fp/i...

And a positive follow up story

eveningtelegraph.co.uk/fp/b...

6) If problems getting treatment continue, she might want to consider a formal complaint.

CAB NHS Complaints

citizensadvice.org.uk/healt...

Photos

"tongue red raw and swollen"

Might be helpful for someone to take a photo which could be sent to GPs etc.

Glossitis (sore, inflamed tongue) is a classic sign of B12 deficiency. Can also be associated with other nutritional deficiencies.

Fingers crossed that your friend gets the treatment she needs soon.

in reply toSleepybunny

She has gone to her daughters, and she did say to me that her daughter would not hold back and give the surgery hell. I even told her to tell them She was going to get MP involved.

I would of adviced her to take B12 and other vitamins, but I was afraid as she said she was low in potassium and salt. I wouldn't even know what to treat first. She is gaunt, her legs are awful, she cant even move her toes. Another neighbourgh came out as we were struggling to get her in the car and she was concerned.

What I didnt know was the doctors has taken her off Iron supplements months of not a year before after years and years of taking them. I assumed she was still on them. So numerous anaemias could include iron.

She did say that she hadn't had a blood test for 2 or 3 years. Which I could not understand as I would of thought having her condition she would of had bloods taken quite regularly.

in reply toSleepybunny

My friend back home, just phoned had to have further blood test (just 1 vial) they want to double check results.She showed nurse legs and said she had to see the doctor, she told them she had a telephone call book for thursday. THe nurse said that's no good he cant see them over the phone. The nurse disappeared and seen the head doctor and he change the appointment to a surgery visit.

By this time hopefully that blood test will be back.

She said that her mental health is being affected although now she does feel a little better. She stopped antibiotics last week which was definitely draining her.

Sleepybunny profile image
Sleepybunny in reply to

I'm sorry that your friend has still not started treatment.

She might want to take photos of any symptoms that are visible so these can be sent to GPs if face to face appointment does not take place.

If she thinks she may need to make a formal complaint in future then worth collecting evidence such as photos, copies of letters to GP, copies of test results/medical records etc.

If she has balance issues, other neurological issues and/or spinal symptoms, it might be worth her pointing out to GPs (in writing and in conversations) that not treating, under treating or delayed treatment for B12 deficiency can increase the chances of developing damage to spinal cord. This might make them see the urgency of the situation.

I am not saying she has SACD, sub acute combined degeneration of the spinal cord, I am not medically trained but I am saying that her doctors should be aware that SACD is a potential consequence of B12 deficiency. Can also be a consequence of folate deficiency although I think this is rarer.

Neurological Consequences of B12 Deficiency

PAS news item

pernicious-anaemia-society....

PAS article about SACD, sub acute combined degeneration of the spinal cord

pernicious-anaemia-society....

See Point 1 in next link, about writing to GP if under treated for B12 deficiency with neuro symptoms.Point 5 is also useful as mentions neurological damage.

b12deficiency.info/writing-...

"her mental health is being affected"

B12 deficiency can have a huge impact on mental health, folate deficiency can as well. Hopefully her mental health will improve once her deficiencies are all treated.

B12 deficiency and mental health

b12deficiency.info/mental-h...

stichtingb12tekort.nl/engli...

After what happened to me I am still polite but far more willing to confront doctors.

I known that if they withdraw treatment, I have my own supplies.

"her daughter would not hold back and give the surgery hell."

I'm glad she has a family member who will support her.

Has she spoken to PAS and her MP?

in reply toSleepybunny

No I dont think she has spoken to anyone.I have read on here before that some people have had test results for b12 so low that the they dont record a level. I am beginning to wonder why they are now retesting only one set of bloods, is it a possibility that this could be b12 and the doctors think there might be a mistake with the results.

As regard her sodium levels being low, as she can only drink water I have told her to put a little pinch of salt in it, in the hope this will raise her levels slowly.

Knowing Nackapan's daughter suffered with low sodium there is an article in the daily mail today stating salt is needed for proper nerve function.

Again all in moderation!

The other thing that was noticeable was her big toe..... fungal infection...... when I goggled this again there was a possibility of b12 def.

I will speak with her before thursday and ask her to get levels.

She has lost an awful lot of weight.

in reply toSleepybunny

TO put you in the picture of her awful treatment over the years. She has been hospitalised many times over the years with stomach issues, always put on to drip, has had to have salt and potassium many time (which she hates). Around fifteen years ago started to vomit (I won't say what) just to say she was rushed to hospital flashing lights.She was given 50/50 chance and her family were warned she might not survive. This is when they discovered crohn's. She had emergency surgery and was in hospital for a month.

Since then as you can imagine she would rather have the runs than go through that again.

Possibly due to covid and GPs not seeing people

Her health has deteriorated.

So one thing after another, all these things do not happen for no reason, but failure to investigate has been her biggest hurdle with her gps.

Sleepybunny profile image
Sleepybunny in reply to

It's horrendous what she's been experiencing.

With her permission, maybe her daughter can write a letter on her behalf to GP and copies to practice manager. She may need to give signed written permission for someone to intervene on her behalf.

Advocacy (help with NHS Complaints)

citizensadvice.org.uk/healt...

Has she considered seeing someone privately, maybe a private GP if treatment problems continue?

Time is really of the essence in treating B12 deficiency to avoid permanent neurological damage.

Can't think of anything else at moment that might help. I hope you will update this thread if things change for your friend.

in reply toSleepybunny

I will keep you updated if only to enlighten people to the pitfull of not seeking further investigations and to educate yourselves in any particular ailment you suffer!

It is so easy for doctors to prescribe medication (in both our cases repeat prescriptions for imodium which resolves the problem but does not CURE the problem).

Sleepybunny profile image
Sleepybunny

A few more articles that mention Crohn's and B12 deficiency

gut.bmj.com/content/68/Supp...

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articl...

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articl...

Was she tested for PA?

pernicious-anaemia-society....

Might be worth updating the forum on this story by starting a new thread as it's now 15 days old and responses on older threads don't always get noticed. If you do, include a link to this thread.

in reply toSleepybunny

JUst spoken to her, she said that the first nurse who took bloods told her everything they were testing. The secondRetest the nurse refused to tell her what they were testing other that they were retesting. ( We are both wondering why ?) Have advised her to get the figures as she wants to compare results to her daughter and granddaughters B12 results. Will see how open they are to revealing the results!

Sleepybunny profile image
Sleepybunny in reply to

She has the right to access her results.

The only reasons I can think of for them to refuse access to records is if GP feels it could cause harm to patient.

If she was able to access internet , she could then register for online access to medical records at her GP surgery.

Search GP surgery website for "Patient Access/Online Access or EMIS access" which should then show how to register for online access.

As she currently has not got access to internet, she could write to, email or phone GP surgery requesting copies of all blood test and give date or at least month when tests were done.

I suggest she puts any request in writing as harder to ignore.

GP surgeries have to respond to these requests within a certain time limit although during pandemic there may be some leeway.

Should be info in links below.

Accessing Health Records (England)

patients-association.org.uk...

Some people access test results and medical records with NHS app.

nhs.uk/nhs-app/nhs-app-help...

BMA article on accessing medical records (16 pages in PDF)

bma.org.uk/media/1868/bma-a...

Retention of UK medical records

bma.org.uk/advice-and-suppo...

Don't rely on there being evidence of a past diagnosis of PA (Pernicious Anaemia) or other cause of B12 deficiency in current medical records.

If she gets proof of diagnosis eg positive test result/letter from specialist confirming diagnosis etc keep a copy in a safe place in case it is needed in the future.

"the nurse refused to tell her"

There is as far as I know no reason to refuse to tell her what tests have been done.

Is it possible that the nurse didn't know?

Sounds a bit strange to me.

Because these days I do tend to confront things, if that was me I would have contacted the practice manager and asked why nurse refused to tell me. Confronting things can irritate the staff.

in reply toSleepybunny

At the moment confrontation is the last thing she wants ! She is alot wiser now and just awaiting the appointment tomorrow. She is also more clued upon B12, so who knows she might just give them a little bit grief. (No more than they deserve)✊✊😂

in reply toSleepybunny

She was taken straight to hospital from the surgery !

Sleepybunny profile image
Sleepybunny in reply to

Hopefully she'll see a specialist who knows more about B12 deficiency and other deficiencies commonly found with b12 deficiency.

I sincerely hope your friend is listened to and gets the treatment she needs.

If you want more people to comment about what has happened to your friend, I suggest you start a new thread with an update on her story and include a link to this thread.

There may be others on the forum who could offer support.

in reply toSleepybunny

Ok.

Sleepybunny profile image
Sleepybunny

Next link explains when people with b12 deficiency should be referred to a haematologist and gastro enterologist.

cks.nice.org.uk/topics/anae...

If she has neuro symptoms, she should also see a neurologist.

When she's well enough, I recommend she gets copies of her hospital records.

It's possible that some info will be sent to GP as well. See link below.

patients-association.org.uk...

in reply toSleepybunny

She has just returned, deep vein thrombosis. Running down from groin to ankle. Doctor said it was one of the longest she had seen. She was told that recovery would be slow , possibly months and months if she was lucky !

She has to return in a month and frequent blood tests.

(Just goggled b12 and dvt !!.... ) say no more

Sleepybunny profile image
Sleepybunny in reply to

She could access her records at some point to see if homocysteine levels were checked or perhaps ask her doctors directly.

B12 deficiency can be associated with high homocysteine levels.

High homocysteine levels might be more evidence that she has a B12 deficiency.

High homocysteine levels can be associated with an increased risk of stroke.

labtestsonline.org.uk/tests...

Interesting articles when I searched for "homocysteine thrombosis" "homocysteine stroke" and "homocysteine B12 deficiency"

Might also be worth her seeing if MMA levels have been checked.

stichtingb12tekort.nl/engli...

in reply toSleepybunny

Yes I been reading them and it all links up.

I have told her to get results, will just have to wait and see........ she knows my views about B12. I will leave it for a few days, let her come to terms with her condition and hopefully have another conversation .

The older generation are alot less inquisitive of ailments and trust there doctors knows best !

As we all know on here doctors are not clued up on B12, if they were we wouldn't be on this website !

Sleepybunny profile image
Sleepybunny in reply to

I trusted my GPs and nearly ended up with dementia and spinal damage. After that I totally lost trust and these days I always check things for myself.

in reply toSleepybunny

I was the same ! ..... trust has gone especially as none of the doctors know me or the other half.Bring back family doctors !

in reply toSleepybunny

Spoke to her yesterday.... today blue flashing ambulance.......... 🙏🤞

Sleepybunny profile image
Sleepybunny in reply to

My thoughts are with your friend.

Has she started B12 treatment and treatment for other anaemias yet?

Just hope there's someone in the hospital who will take a real interest in her case.

in reply toSleepybunny

Spoke with her yesterday.... in answer to you question is no! I said to my partner she is beginning to sound like my sister who has dementia.... repeating the phrase "you know and that" time and time again.

Cherylclaire profile image
CherylclaireForum Support in reply to

Awful story. Let us know, Hidden .

in reply toCherylclaire

I will ,, other than that I don't know what to say!

Sleepybunny profile image
Sleepybunny in reply toCherylclaire

I'd like to say that I can't believe that Sallyannl's friend has still not started B12 treatment and treatment for all her anaemias but sadly I don't get shocked any more.

in reply toSleepybunny

Sadly to say even if you are one digit over the minimum, you are not treated. This is why I got blood test results....now the doctors surgery has a note saying not to ask for print out of blood tests on the entrance door !Seems we are going to be denied more and more,

You are not allowed physio for 3 months, have to pay for your own, buy your own b12 and iron tablets. England are having to pay more and more and parking fees. Scotland and Wales are the opposite (not against Scots or welsh in any means)

Just the difference in borders !

And now they are trying to bring in all 60 to 65 years old to pay for prescriptions from april !

Ah well it's all sent to try us !

Sleepybunny profile image
Sleepybunny in reply to

"now the doctors surgery has a note saying not to ask for print out of blood tests on the entrance door"

They might say not to ask but as far as I know you're still entitled to them.

Potentially to refuse to provide paper copies could be a discrimination issue as unfair on people without internet access.

Could be a matter to discuss with local MP.

in reply toSleepybunny

Dont worry I always ask !

Sleepybunny profile image
Sleepybunny

I wondered if any of her family members can intervene.

Maybe someone in her family could contact PAS and maybe B12 Deficiency Info as well.

Article about PA/B12 deficiency and stroke

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/170....

Further articles are listed at bottom of page.

NICE Guidance Venous Thromboembolism

pathways.nice.org.uk/pathwa...

nice.org.uk/guidance/qs201

in reply toSleepybunny

Thanks sleepybunny!

IF it wasn't for the fact that her daughter and son both have cancer and having to deal adverse effects of medication I would pressure them.

in reply toSleepybunny

Update....

My friend just rang from the hospital, She has had a stroke...... lost use of her right side..... MRI revealed blood clot on the brain. They have stopped the medication she was on and now injecting her. They have warned her she could have another stroke but

🤞 crossed hopefully it will disperse. She is not impressed with her consultant, but she said that the foreign (Indian) understudy was lovely and held her hand.She did say it has been a bit of a shock, but she is determined to try and gain the use of her right arm!

She had a dementia test !!!!!! Which was exhausting passing some questions and failing others.

So will just have too see and

🙏

Sleepybunny profile image
Sleepybunny in reply to

I will be thinking about your friend. Does she know if they are going to start B12 treatment in hospital?

Another article about B12 deficiency and stroke risk

(May have some details that could be upsetting)

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articl...

in reply toSleepybunny

I really dont know, she was talking to me when someone in the hospital went to see her so she had to ring off.

Strange how we both could see the red flags !

Sleepybunny profile image
Sleepybunny

This NHS list of symptoms of B12 deficiency mentions dementia

nhs.uk/conditions/vitamin-b...

Found this interesting article from US which discusses dementia due to B12 deficiency

practicalneurology.com/arti...

in reply toSleepybunny

If you look at the Gloucestershire b12 website dementia is one criteria that allows b12 injections. The rest is tablets.

What she needs is a good specialists who looks beyond the stroke and what caused it !

Sleepybunny profile image
Sleepybunny in reply to

Dementia guidance Gloucestershire website

g-care.glos.nhs.uk/pathway/...

There is a note to test B12 in someone with suspected dementia.

Sadly I'm guessing that the possibility of dementia symptoms being caused by B12 deficiency will be discounted if serum B12 levels are within normal range.

I think all the B12 books I listed in an earlier post mention B12 deficiency and dementia. I think Sally Pacholok's book "Could it be B12" has a chapter on it.

The first film in this link narrated by Sally Pacholok mentions B12 deficiency and dementia, gives case study of a doctor whose B12 deficiency was not recognised until he had developed dementia and neuro damage.

Could be upsetting to watch.

b12deficiency.info/films/

I hope your friend can get them to start B12 treatment soon and treatment for all her anaemias.

Blog posts from B12 Deficiency Info and PAS about B12 deficiency and older people.

b12deficiency.info/a-year-t...

b12deficiency.info/christin...

b12deficiency.info/a-tale-o...

martynhooper.com/2017/06/22...

martynhooper.com/2017/07/01...

in reply toSleepybunny

Yes it is! One of the few criteria's for b12 injections. The rest is tablets. To be quite honest I wish I had'nt seen the B12 pathway in gloucestershire... its absolutely abysmal. Even if you are very low they suggest retesting in three to six months by that time so much damage is done. (What you don t know doesn't hurt).

in reply toSleepybunny

One thing that I think needs exploring is the flu vaccine.Both my friend and partner had the vaccine with in days of each other. Both went down with chest infections , (I know my partner said to the doctor that he had felt awful since having it in October) both been seriously ill since, and in the same way more than you can imagine. Neither could drink coffee, both lost over a stone in weight, the only difference was I managed to get b12 injection into my partner. (He did have a violent headache possibly tia before B12 injection)

Being me I look up stroke flu vaccine and b12 deficiency,

Interesting results and something you should read. I have come to the conclusion that the flu vaccination have affected them both in a detrimental way. We all discussed this just before Christmas the similarities and what caused it and they are of the same opinion NO more flu jabs. (both are borderline b12 def.)

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