Deputyship

[lolly64]

Hi I'm just starting the process of applying to ss for my son who is 48yrs old next week for supported living it's already taken SS a year to finally make an appointment to see me they rung me last Mon and they are coming tomorrow the lady on the phone said before the process can start I have to have a ref no for a deputyship application with a solicitor.. She sent me a link the info is mind blowing I'm nearly 71, I wanted less stress not more but some of the things I'm reading do not instill me with confidence in the local authority 🙄does the supported living hinge on having deputyship I have appointee status with dwp that horrendous post of taking all their money barring £25 I'm not a fan of SS because we've slipped under their radar they are now rushing things and why can't we do POA that's a lot cheaper can anyone help please

[Eeviee]

hi. Deputyship requires the person not to have capacity to understand the document that they are signing. So if your son cannot understand what a tenancy agreement is or its consequences then someone else needs to sign on his behalf. That would be his deputy legally appointed by the court of protection. The deputyship can be obtained without the use of a solicitor; Please check out other posts as I’ve recently written about financial deputyships and their benefits. Good luck

[parasiticworm]

If you son is moving into supported living they shouldn't be using all his disability benefits to pay for his care. Thats sounds more like residential care. I'm in supported living and get all my benefits paid to my deputyship and I don't have to contribute anything towards my support hours because I've been on a section 3 and currently on a community treatment order.

[49Twister]

Hi it is a nightmare unfortunately which I wasn't anticipating when my 50 year old son went into supported living at 41 years of age. Regarding deputyship not everyone in supported living needs it . I was just appointee for my son and I now have POA which in all honesty doesn't seem to make a lot of difference. It depends on your son’s mental capacity for understanding stuff, which wasn't explained to me very well either in the beginning. The social worker should be explaining not just sending you stuff to do,

As far as support costs most of my son's PIP payments go to this, he pays £650 per month then all food, energy bills etc on top it's not cheap living in supported living especially if he's not being supported properly as my son hasn't been sadly. I hope things turn out easier for you but it's not a quick straight forward process. Make sure when the SW does the assessment for your son you answer the questions as if he was living on his own. As mother's who care we do a lot of stuff for them without realising they can't do this if on their own. Good luck and stick to your guns. I would have done things so differently if I was just starting the process. Like you as many have from that era slipped under the net and been forgotten.

[Eeviee in reply to 49Twister]

Hi. I’m not sure what you mean when you say having a POA doesn’t make any difference ? If the local authority suddenly want to change your sons accommodation or provider they don’t need to consult you if you only have POA but they MUST you if you are the deputy. POA implies that your son has capacity for these big decisions Deputyship confirms that he does not.

[49Twister in reply to Eeviee]

Hi Eevie we have had the wrong advice from day 1 unfortunately. I applied for POA for health and finance thinking it would protect my son who doesn't have capacity for these issues but the care company "supporting him" ignored this. He has severe learning disabilities but is a chatty guy which has been misinterpreted all of his life. He is now in an assessment place for 2 years after being in supported living for nearly 10 years, and misunderstood for all those years. I am 75 and it's been the hardest time of my life I'm hoping he will be in his forever home while I'm still here.

[Eeviee in reply to 49Twister]

Hi there. I’m sorry to hear that you have had these worries. If I were you I would get the deputyship now and include any siblings or close family as deputies so you can have some peace that your son will have strong advocates when you are gone. I would also get the health and welfare deputyship. You can do it yourself on line. Annual fees would be exempted for your son.

[49Twister in reply to Eeviee]

Thankyou will definitely look into thisx

[Tiger0606 in reply to 49Twister]

Hi thanks ,yes definitely the same for us just been lost,they do not seem to care about it.This has been going on since summer for us they told us possibly he had a flat now the not sure ,I go in for surgery on Monday 20th January.So this is really stressing me as it’s a foot operation so I am not going to be able to walk for a while and was hoping they would have it kind of in place.which sadly is not,think they may offer some respite for a week or so.My social worker has gone on the sick ,someone else has took over hasn’t read his file yet and does not seem to know a thing it’s been awful with the unsettled stress and just been in wonderland.Hopefully I get to hear some news this week.Upto now I have been my sons appointee since he was young,I do plan to get POA.Thanks to all for more information x

[49Twister in reply to Tiger0606]

Good luck for your operation and the constant battle with SS x

[Balamorym]

Agree with above that supported living is usually cheaper than residential care and it's more flexible to the person's needs so check which you are applying for. POA can only be used if your son understands enough to grant you authority over his finances himself. You don't need a solicitor, maybe MENCAP or others on here can advise on completing the forms.

[1946timmy]

Hi my 47 year old son moved into supported living in May this year. I am his appointee and it was not a problem for him to move in. He was assessed as not having mental capacity, but it was agreed this was for his best interests.

He is in a house with 2 others he has 1-1 , 24/7 .

From his benefits he pays towards utilities, he pays his transport costs and food.

So far all working well.

It has been suggested I do look at deputyship as I am now 73.So will probably do this with my daughter named as well. But we definitely were not told I had to before he moved in.!

[Eeviee in reply to 1946timmy]

Deputyship can be obtained when a child reaches 18. I would do this asap and definitely add siblings as deputies. As I understand it only deputies can sign a tenancy agreement on behalf of the tenant who does not have capacity ? I’m all about protecting the rights of the vulnerable adult Everything is fine until it isn’t. You need to know the terms and conditions of the tenancy and what happens if the housing arrangement doesn’t suit your son.

[1946timmy in reply to Eeviee]

I do understand everything about my son’s tenancy. My Charity built the property he lives in and a specialist landlord leases the property from the charity. His tenancy is secure. Everything has been fine with me just being his appointee for the last 45 years. But as I said I will do the deputy ship now he has moved. Thanks

[SpeedyH in reply to Eeviee]

It depends on whether the supported living is a social care commissioned provision, in which case you don't need any court authority, or whether the accommodation is through a private landlord or housing association in which case you have to either have capacity to sign a legal lease or a deputy/attorney to do so on your behalf.

[Eeviee in reply to SpeedyH]

Hi. With supported living , Care and accommodation can be supplied by separate providers and not just by one provider. I’m not sure if it is a “true” supported living provision or a care home if the vulnerable person lives in shared accommodation with others especially if bills and other expenses are shared. That sounds like a care home arrangement. Either way deputyship gives more protection to the vulnerable person as they have an advocate to whom all people engaging in the vulnerable persons life are answerable to. Surely that is worth having.

[Greatauntie]

We found deputyship allowed us to ask more questions and see records. We as much as we can via bank care charges, taxis, chiropodist etc Relative in supported living for 20 years, now in 60's. Initially we left it to support staff as she seemed basically happy however, found they only did things they wanted to do, mainly shop till they dropped. Once we were deputies and had more access to records we found lots of areas lacking, especially keeping appointments and spending - this avoids vague entries such as 'personal spending', 'shopping, 'lunch out'. Eg Despite contributing to joint food kitty £600 a month for 3 residents, we found extras for eating out at fast food places amounted to as much again and sometimes more. By accident last year saw another residents record and it was the same for them all eating fast food 10/12 times per month. My advice would be to ask for receipts to support all spending cash or card. can then be reassured the spending is on relative, staff are aware you are checking (for your records), helps with budgeting and ensuring money is available 'extras'. Easier to authorise extra spending than ask for an explanation as

[Eeviee in reply to Greatauntie]

Totally agree. Unfortunately you can’t trust anyone. When people know they are being monitored they will behave.

[parasiticworm in reply to Greatauntie]

Thats what the staff used to do at other properties at my supported living place... They would take less able tenets outs for meals and they would pick the nicest meals themselfs and charge the amount to the service user who had to pay but don't understand, even though they probably had capacity because they didnt have a appointeeship they would still get taken advantage off... My company stopped staff from using service users to buy them coffees and food.... Which is unfair because I value my staff and if I want to treat them to a coffee (a place they wouldnt normally go) I want to do this..

[Eeviee in reply to parasiticworm]

I understand that you want to be kind but please don’t. It’s the employing company who needs to pay for their refreshments. Any type of “gift” is not allowed under CQC rules and guidance