Newly Diagnosed, currently in watch & wait.
Anyone have an opinion on beer & CLL? I'm a light drinker but I usually have beer on weekends (mostly light beer). Just as a social thing with friends & family. Thoughts? Is this ok? Understood that heavy drinking/smoking is not good. But what about a beer every now and again? 3-4 a week.
I have had CLL for 12 years now and am on my 3rd treatment plan and I enjoy a beer or a glass of wine socially since the beginning with no repercussions.
Diagnosed 9 ya, still on W@W. I have always enjoyed an India Pale Ale or a gin and tonic in moderation..... without any problems. Cheers🍻.
I asked my hematologist and cll specialist the same question. Both said it was fine. I have a couple of drinks or beers on the weekend. No issues at all. I watched my blood results and didn’t have any ill effects. Alcohol does suppress your immune system, so you don’t want to drink if you think you’re getting sick. My doc said “enjoy yourself!
Kvbtexas
W&W is fine from experience and everything I've read. I've had nights out with the gang on my usual beer-and-barbeque diet with no issues.
In treatment, though, my doctors have discouraged it. I've listened. Truth be told I've also sort of lost my taste for it. I have had the occasional social drink but have cut back significantly.
I'm in clinical trial, so they may be erring on the side of caution in my case, but I believe at least one of the meds I'm on has an alcohol interaction issue of some kind.
I’m on watch and monitor as well. My Cll specialist told me not to drink alcohol because it damages your bone marrow. I was a social drinker as well. But when I drank 5 times a year or so I would drink a case of beer 😀. Not good but I haven’t drank in 3 years.
John
Like anything that isn't the best for our physical health, the question really should be "does this make my mental/social health better to offset any physical health issue I may have?" Aka - does the "reward" I get outweigh the risk?
At low levels, for socializing and stress relief rewards, it's probably worth the offsetting physical risks as long as you're not in treatment or taking meds which prohibit alcohol.
But we all make our own risk/reward trade-offs.
PS - And welcome from another 40's CLLer. We have a lot of trade offs we need to make b/c we have decades to live, so for us, it is all about risk/reward b/c we still have to live a lot of life!
I enjoy a beer or two occasionally without any problems.
Beer is liquid carbohydrate and I'm anti-carbohydrate but I do enjoy a shot a whiskey from time to time 😁
Hey my friend Leo
I just had to comment on your reply, because I became a Vodka drinker many years ago for that reason. I had done the Atkins diet for two months, lost fifty pounds, and had read Atkins book before sticking to his rules religiously.
In his book he mandates absolutely not one drop of alcohol during the Boot Camp phase of the diet. But Boot Camp is usually only one month or maybe like I did two. Atkins says in his book, and I quote: "after the weight loss phase of my diet, your better off if you stay away from alcohol as much as you can. If you need to have a drink or so here and there, then drink Vodka because it has ZERO CARBS.
Carl
Hi Carl, I never read Atkins but accidentally we seem to think along the same lines 😀. No alcohol is better than any, but zero carb, small volume, large kick in the head variety is better for me than the alternatives. It doesn't expand stomach volume, does not make me burp and does not supply much calories and still can get me as high as a kite 😁.
Hi, I was diagnosed stage 4 in 2020, straight to treatment. I now live a full normal life as before .... love Beer , wine and Gin , drink probably more than the average bear but have done all my life. Plenty of coffee helps . Enjoy life quality not quantity is my view.
Sugar.is fuel for cancer it will only make it worse. All the answers.of people saying my doc said it's ok is because doctors want us sick so they can make money off us. Look into Hoxsey biomedical center and bonita wellness on YouTube for real answers.
I did look into the Hoxey Biomedical - one of the first sites I came across said in so many words it “is a scam” and that Hoxey himself went for conventional treatment when he ironically developed cancer. So, one way or the other don’t believe everything you read on the internet ....
Back to the subject, I happily drink a glass of wine most nights and no one has ever suggested otherwise. I am on w&w so things might change if I ever need treatment (i think it is amazing to be able to say if and not when as I did to begin with).
Thank you Claree, for sharing your research into Hoxey Biomedical.
GhostOfHarrow Sugar doesn't drive CLL healthunlocked.com/cllsuppo...
and
"Reviews by major medical bodies, including the U.S. Food and Drug Administration (FDA), the National Cancer Institute, the American Cancer Society,[1] M. D. Anderson Cancer Center,[2] and Memorial Sloan-Kettering Cancer Center,[3] have found no evidence that Hoxsey Therapy is an effective treatment for cancer. The sale or marketing of the Hoxsey Method was banned in the United States by the FDA on September 21, 1960 as a "worthless and discredited" remedy and a form of quackery.[4]"
en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hox...
Neil
Why do you think it was banned. Know who started the FDA? Look deeper. To each his own. But it works and saves so many people. The program isn't easy as most people are just greedy and not willing to give up their lifestyle.
A critical requirement for the acceptance of medical research is independent verification. I'm sure there would be much more interest in how Hoxey Biomedical treatment "works and saves so many people", if this existed. Are you able to provide this? I'm seriously asking this of you, because this is the first I've heard of Hoxley Biomedical in 14 years of checking out claims of cancer cures for their evidence basis.
Neil
Yes I have first hand experience and know people who lives have been saved after been given 3 months to live over a decade ago. It works if you are willing to do the program. It's strict and not easy. It's a real thing I wish more people knew about it and gave it a chance. As I said each to their own. Go on YouTube and look at bonita wellness.
Unfortunately, what you have provided is considered to be on the lowest levels of evidence per the attached evidence pyramid.* Apparently, "No peer-reviewed scientific studies have been published that allow one to reach any conclusions about the effectiveness of the Hoxsey tonic and treatment."
You haven't mentioned the cancers concerned where people survived way longer than expected. Randomisation is used in clinical trials (RTCs) to allow for spontaneous remissions or misdiagnoses, as these do happen. There's a 1% incidence with CLL. It's also not unknown for promotional material to omit mention of failures, or long survival to be due to prior treatment, such as surgery.
I haven't been able to find any CLL specific claims for Bonita wellness.
*The EBM Pyramid is © 2006 Trustees of Dartmouth College and Yale University.
Neil
if you research deeper, you will get a bit more clarity about sugar fueling cancer. It’s not quite that simple of a statement. Excessive is sugar is not healthy and can fuel health issues like obesity and diabetes but does not necessarily fuel cancer. Even the American Cancer Society and famous cancer centers like City of Hope and MD Anderson have posted articles on the subject.
Doctors want us to be sick? That's crazy...
The concept that doctors want us sick, so they can make more money, is beyond absurd. I'll leave it at that, since the idea doesn't deserve more communication. Doctors and Nurses are caring people, and their entire motivation is to heal and help us feel and get better. I'm not saying that many medical practices make a lot of money, and that the owners are motivated to do so. What is wrong with that; it is what makes capitalism work. I'm certain however that doctors and nurses main goal is to help us get better.
I'm with Steve on this one. Eat well, exercise, don't smoke, drink in moderation. Same advice given to non-cllers. I have a couple of beers on a Fri/Sat/Sun and occasional p*ss up with mates. Its like a liquid targetted therapy for my mental health.
I can't believe for 1 second that that level of drinking has any adverse affect on my health.
I'm on W&W for about 5 yrs now and I try to live stress free as much as possible. And stress free is one of the reasons I dont visit this site much either because of too many stories full of anxiety , but i got triggered by an email about this post CLL & Beer and just had to look at it and give my personal opinion on the subject.
As I said I try to reduce stress as much as possible. So my advice is to try to live a life where you can relax and enjoy all the good things that life has to offer. One of that is enjoy your time with friends and family and don't worry about what you can and cannot eat or drink. So sure having a beer, a glass of wine or two or three is absolutely is part of that too. Enjoy life, worry less and live on happily 😀
Cheers joneill77 🍺🍺
I was on W&W for 23 years. I drank two beers every night of those 23 years (and enjoyed everyone of them plus an occasional glass of red).😀
enjoy you beer, but don’t get drown in it!
yes enjoy a drink or 2. I’m on w&w for 8 years and lead a normal life with family and friends and going out. I love a cold beer in the sun and lately being trying Heineken zero to cut alcohol intake down. Taste the same 👍
Agree with most everyone on the post. Enjoy life and drink in moderation. There are some nice non alcoholic drinks also available. Do whatever makes you feel best, and try not to stress over it. I usually don’t drink, but am coming back from a trip to Italy where I was visiting my daughter who lives overseas. It was delightful to enjoy a few glasses of wine with her on the trip. It made me happy! Do what makes you happy and enjoy life. We all have only one life and our choices should be to enjoy it and not feel guilty because it goes by fast for all of us regardless if we have CLL or not.
Hello again – I say “no” to alcohol consumption when you know you have cancer or if you want to prevent getting cancer. Although my nutrition specialty is breast cancer prevention, I am on this forum because my husband was diagnosed with CLL this past spring.
Recently, I wrote a post with citations and references, on why melatonin was an important cancer fighting hormone. I wish I had time to do the same level of writing for this post, but I don’t, so the short answer is NO to alcohol consumption for so many reasons.
Here are two:
1. Because alcohol interferes with melatonin production and you need melatonin as per my previous post to help fight abnormal cells.
2. Because everyone has a different Phase I liver detox capability and if you are a slow Phase I liver metabolizer alcohol hangs around longer in your body. Which one are you?
I love this question and as soon as I finish my current storm of academic work, I am going to find the time to do a proper paper with all the trimmings (citations and references in APA 7th ed format). In the meantime, my professional opinion is NO to alcohol. Abstain for 90 days and see the results.
Be well everyone
Not too sure about your research skills given you could not even find out what CLL treatments were available in your country! But yes, we should all definitely stop drinking alcohol immediately, along with playing sport, surfing, riding motorcycles or anything else we enjoy in life. That way, we will know for sure that the CLL has really got us, even if we are in stage zero W&W😀.
Asked my consultant "Should I give up alcohol?" His response: "Good god man, don't ruin your life!" I'm on w&w.
6 years on W&W and try to make sure that CLL doesn't affect any of my recreational habits.So still shooting fishing camping and all of the drinking that is included. Trying not to let this run my life
I'd say listen to your body. If you can drink a couple of beers (or glasses of wine/ nips of spirit) without noticeable after-effects, why not? Just make sure it doesn't become an automatic thing with the same trigger cos before you know it...
Over the years my body told me to drink less and less often. My taste in beer changed from bitter, hoppy ales to pilseners and American pale ales, plus the occasional strong dark stout. If you want to drink socially and limit the alcohol intake, there are some low alcohol beers tasting not far short of the real thing.
I am in the same situation and drink beer frequently with no adverse effects. Warren
Hello joneill77
In the summer I enjoy non-acholic beer with tomato juice. I also enjoy glass of red wine in evening and have for years in the winter. Now that I am doing V&O treatment no alcohol, as alcohol causes my liver blood numbers to go above average. Venetoclax also causes liver bloods to go up. Venetoclax also says no alcohol . For those in W&W, have fun. Blessings.
Sorry, but Venetoclax does not say "no alcohol". I don't doubt your personal experience, but it is not contraindicated and my doctor explicitly said it was okay in moderation.
Hello jijic
Your right nothing about Venetoclax does not say contradicted by alcohol, and neither did I. My doctor and Medical & Life Sciences News says "Drinking alcohol while you are taking Venclexta may make you feel sick or vomit". Which I do once or twice a week.
Perhaps I misread "Venetoclax also says no alcohol." I just didn't want someone to stumble on that and assume! I never experienced nausea or dizziness while drinking and my doc said it was really quite rare of a side effect.
A beer or two, an early morning walk with your pooch and an occasional hug from your partner or friend…..makes cll just a bit more bearable. enjoy!!
Is that the recommended order of events?
In case my wife is reading this, it’s obviously in the reverse order. Between you and me though, there is nothing like a cuddle with our gentle standard poodle, Kali. She and my wife have made this long cll journey much easier.🥰
Hi,
I also drink wine and beer in social situations. However, I do make certain that I drink extra water during the day to avoid dehydration which leads to awful leg cramps (which I NEVER had until CLL)
Cheers!
Sandy
I have leg cramps as well. Never had them prior to CLL . They almost always happen in the middle of the night. I did add vitamin D and Calcium to my vitamin regiment and it seems to have helped but also might just be coincidental. Most of the time it happens after a decent length hike. I m terrible about drinking enough water so that probably factors in. I know this sounds a little out there but I pinch my upper lip in the center and it helps the pain until the spasm passes. Must be and acupressure point of some sort.
interesting! I have had horrible leg cramps and become very dehydrated so easily. I drink a lot of water too! Magnesium helps some, but dang it! When they hit, I’m a mess. They start in my calf and it seizes all the way up to the base of my rear! Then I have soreness and even bruising for a couple of days.
ouch!
Wanting to drink beer sometimes with your friends is totally understandable, and it might be smart to choose red wine instead when you feel you can, as it contains a lot of resveratrol, which is thought to be healthy for people. Pinot noir has the most so it is usually what I drink when (rarely these days) I am out in a group. Sometimes I have a glass of beer but I drink less of it than I might like, if I weren't trying to live well with CLL. Eat extra fresh fruits and vegetables to reward your hard working liver, too.
When life is feeling too harsh I have a glass of pinot noir or red wine with dinner to take the edge off the day. And I do drink a lot more when I visit my family in France, because a lot of wine and beer are served, and I get caught up when I am not careful. At home, I often go weeks without alcohol, other times I drink a bottle of wine over the course of a week for several weeks in a row. I know it gives my liver extra work so when I catch this going on too long I stop the wine for awhile. I buy the occasional six pack of beer but it is a rare treat for the most part.
Once more: fresh fruits and vegetables! Eat them.
Chacun à son goût mon ami.
Party on Garth stay the course...lolololo
I did not read all of the replies .But, what MisfitK said is almost what my Hemo/Cll specialist told me when I asked about beer/drinking alcohol.With the understanding that any alcoholic is a bad period. I am not a Teetotaler by any means. I was in the restaurant biz for 40 years, and partied hard. Once retired I slowed my drinking some but still drank most days. When diagnosed,like most I went on watch and wait and asked my Doc THE question. Re-read MisfitK's post and you will have the answer he gave me. Balancing lifestyle is not easy,but important.So 3 or 4 times a year I might have 2 or 3 drinks, maybe even 3 or 4 days in a row, think Holidays or special occasions. And then not have a drink for months. That is MY decision, is it the best one ,probably not .But knowing that No alcohol would be the best , I chose a drink now and then, that's my choice ,my lifestyle. Enjoy W and W, treatment these days is not bad, for some no difference feeling than before treatment ,but it is treatment no matter how benign.I was on W and W for a year ,then a trial , and then ten years later and two different treatments ,I'm still kicking.Your experience may or probably will be different . So will your decisions. Remember a step at a time and lifestyle
good luck
Michael
I think you should live how you see fit. Obviously, drinking less is healthier. But you never know what will kill you. You may outlive us all being unhealthy. Warren Buffett eats McDonalds for breakfast all the time.
I am currently on a clinical trial and made the personal decision to not to drink at all. I slipped the week before I added venetoclax to zanubrutinib but I was at a restaurant that had a brew that sounded really interesting. My plan is to enjoy a pint when the drug combo completes in April 2024. Now that I think about it a stout sounds good.
I was diagnosed 11 years ago (probably had CLL at least 16 years based on previous blood results) and I'm still on watch and wait. I am extremely lucky that most of my numbers are better today than when I was first diagnosed. Over those years I would consider myself a moderate drinker, averaging maybe 3-4 beers and 2-3 glasses of wine a week. So in my specific case I would say it has had no detrimental effect on my CLL. For me diet seems to make the biggest difference with my CLL. I tried Mediterranean diet for 6 months a few years ago and my WBC dropped close to 40% over that period . My diet had gotten worse since then and my counts started going up slowly until recently I had bad gallbladder surgery that made me really concentrate on my diet . I cut out McDonalds and all that junk and my WBC dropped from 39 to 25 in 6 months and all my other counts improved dramatically. Maybe it's coincidence? I'm not sure, but I say enjoy that beer and make sure you maintain a healthy diet.
I was diagnosed with CLL Oct 2013 on W&W 1 yr...doing well but abstain from alcohol..was never much of a drinker anyway but like the occasional Pina Colada or a small glass of wine. What bugs me more is the fact that we have to stay away from Ruby Red Grapefruit juice!
Why do you have to avoid grapefruit juice on W&W? I sure didn't. It simply interacts with certain treatments like Venetoclax.
When I asked my doctor what else I could do to help myself besides eating well and exercising, she said to have a more alkaline diet. Things that are more acidic are meat and alcohol etc. One website says wine in moderation is ok and another one said only drink wine if you want to die. I would say to ask your doctor, moderation and enjoy life
I have a couple of beer or wine everyday, and have for the almost 5 years with CLL. I feel great, and the bloodwork is that of a healthy person. It works for me!!
Been doing 3-4 for o r 15 years. No problems.
Hey Joneill
Without reading the other replies, I want you to know that I had a post recently that was related to yours. There was a huge response to my post, so you might want to find mine by clicking on my profile and looking at my post history.
I'll give you a heads up before you check it out, the response was overwhelmingly supportive of have a few drinks per week.
To add to this, I messaged my Specialist at Dana Farber about this issue. I breathed a sigh of relief when she replied that a few drinks a week won't hurt me. My Wife had gotten on my case about this issue, because she had read that alcohol reduces the immune system ability. Ours is already of course greatly reduced anyway, but she was saying I likely shouldn't have any alcohol at all. She isn't a health professional, but still she's my wife. So I posted on our site, got great responses I liked from our Members, and for the Coup De Grace my very highly rated Specialist told me it was fine.
Carl
My (German) oncologist said a couple of drinks here and there is fine, even when I was on Venetoclax.
W@W here. Diagnosed in 2020 after a severe bout with Covid19. (I think the Covid triggered this immune response, since my blood tests confirm I did not have this condition prior)
I choose to enjoy a cold beer or 2 in a frosty mug almost daily. I think I would get depressed if I had to give it up, so I won't.
SH,
This was an older post but one worth visiting again.
I take my doctors advice, “keep hydrated.”
Jeff
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