Fasting for 3 days

[Alobs]

Has anyone got any informed advice or experience about fasting? I'm on Watch and wait (UK) and heard that fasting for 3 days can help the immune system. I read a research paper that said it lowers the WBC. Hmmmm....

[AussieNeil Administrator]

There is promising research in some cancers, but don't forget, CLL cells don't respond well to feedback, but keep growing - that's why it's a cancer.

[mantana]

White blood cells are not bad for us.

Heck, I wouldn't even look at lymphocytes as something bad for us with CLL! It's the malignant lymphocytes (malignant B cells for most of us) which cause our disease.

Most routine blood tests will just say how many lymphocytes we have and won't differentiate between cancerous and normal lymphocytes.

Most simple/routine blood tests won't even say how many B cells there are (in healthy individuals, B cells are 10-15% of total lymphocytes) - they will just present a total of lymphocytes.

cancerquest.org/patients/de...

However, knowing the norms for healthy people, and being CLL diagnosed, we can track our disease development with a relatively inexpensive and quick blood test done every few months. And for us with CLL, lymphocyte count growth is caused by growth of cancerous cells (+/- some minor deviations of healthy cell numbers).

Now, fasting for 3 days - will it make any difference for our malignant lymphocytes? Vitamin and mineral deficiency may disrupt production of healthy white blood cells, but will it make a difference for CLL? I'd be afraid CLL cells could grow even more, seeing less cell competition from healthy lymphocytes.

[Research123 in reply to mantana]

I did some fasting - 5 days at a time using the fasting mimicking diet. My blood count went down from 39000 to 16000 over 4 months - I thought it was the cure - then in next 3 months went up to 30000 despite 2 more 5 day fasts. I lost rather too much weight. Haven't had any tests for a few months now with this lock down. Now I do the occasional 2 day fast (every month or 2). I think I'm healthier generally for the fasting but the ups and downs may just be the cycle. Still I figure I have nothing to lose whilst I can see other health benefits.

[Splash24]

I did a few water only fasts and then switched to Dr. Longo's FMD (no affiliation), both my WBL and Abs.Lymph count are back at 2013 levels and have remained there for a couple of years. This was after 6 straight years of increases. I am certainly not suggesting that it is a cure, but it has helped me. Good Luck

[LeoPa in reply to Splash24]

Wow, amazing! Congratulations. Sometimes it's worth trying everything possible, isn't it?

[LeoPa]

There is more to fasting than meets the eye. It is very benefitial IF DONE RIGHT. I am a habitual faster and recommend taking your time to read up all available information before jumping in. No rush, do the learning first. Most folks could not do a 3 day fast if their life depended on it. Some of my dedicated friends do 3 to 5 day fasts regularly (once in a month or 2), but they do not have CLL and they are keto adapted. I do 16 to 18 hour fasts daily, I am keto adapted as well (I have HCMBL). There are a lot of other protocols in between and much depends from where do you come from (diet wise), and where do you hope to go. The information re. fasting from the below sources is reliable and trustworthy. It will get you started on the topic and don't be afraid to go down that rabbit hole It's worth you time.

Don't get derailed by the fact that McDonald is a former bodybuilder, Berkhan is a trainer and Sisson is a former world class triathlete. Those are the folks that know more about fasting than just about anybody else, since they used it to tweak their preformance to the max a human body can achieve. Their goals might be different from ours, but the knowledge they share is universal. Should no other benefit come from our fasting than just increasing our general health, strength and wellbeing - so be it. I'd consider that a success too.

Lyle McDonald: EAT STOP EAT (book)

leangains.com

marksdailyapple.com

[Rickc in reply to LeoPa]

Thanks for this. I did IF for about 8 months last year. I did 16/8 which was surprisingly easy to follow.

I can’t seem to find The Lyle McDonald book you reference called EAT Stop Eat. I looked online at amazon.com. I found several books by him, and also an Eat stop eat book by another author. Do you have a link you could send?

[LeoPa in reply to Rickc]

Hi Rick, welcome. I made a mistake. Brad Pilon it is. Funny how my memory plays tricks with me sometimes. I was quite sure McDonalds wrote it. Anyways if you did 16/8 for 8 months you have a good idea about what it's going to take No fun. I experimented with the 1 meal a day aka 23 hour fast. I lasted 2 weeks only, lol. It should be doable on a permanent basis and that wasn't. For me 16 to 18 hour daily fasts are doable indefinitely. Girls have it much harder, different hormones and all. 12 to 14 hours is a respectable fasting stretch for them. Good luck.

[LeoPa]

Oops, I forgot. For multiday fasts, its important to stay properly hydrated and to replenish salts and minearals. Search for SNAKE JUICE on youtube.

[Splash24]

Good point, it takes more water then you think when fasting, and you are correct, that most could not do a 3 or 4 day fast, I did it about 5 times and it is not for the faint of heart!! I went back and read studies/succeses they had in 1950's-60's, they had some amazing results in dealing with a variety of issues, but it is not hard to see why it has not become popular...lol, for the reason you stated, very few can do it.

[richutchens]

I fast 18 hours a day. That said, fasting will help the immune system. My fasting is call intermittent fasting. At least a million YouTube videos about all kinds of fasting.

[SamanthaJane123]

When I was first diagnosed I tried many alternative methods to help heal my body whatever that may look like. I worked with a naturopath and nutritionist who specialized in cancer. Both recommended intermittent fasting (IF). Fasting 16 hrs. and eating within an 8 hr. window. They also said I could try fasting for 24 hrs once every 2 weeks or once a month.

I had some difficulty with the 24 hr fasts. I would get major stomach pains after I consumed my first meal. I later learned I needed to be careful of the foods I ate initially and the quantity of food, ie. no fibre.

My naturopath recommended taking something I purchased from him, bitter greens. I would take it 30 minutes before breaking my 24 hr fast. The bitter greens helped but I still had to be very careful of eating no fibre and starting off with something small and light.

I have found IF to have a positive impact with my well being. For me, I reap more benefits of IF when my food is in order. I really felt my best when I was doing IF and eating primarily a whole food plant based diet. l also had all my ducks in order which included exercising, good nutrition, meditating, earthing it, therapy, daily saunas and balancing my days. I think working towards good health has many facets and isn't just one thing.

I was in watch and wait for 4 1/2 years and I am now on ibrutinib. My haematolgist and naturopath both said I can do IF.

I have fallen off the wagon, so to speak, from time to time. Think this post is actually acting as a vehicle to get back on track. Thank you.

If you choose to do fasting, especially anything more that fasting for 16 hours, I would suggest working with a naturopath and/or nutritionist who specializes in cancer. I would also run it by your Dr.

Let me know how things go.

[MN1999]

A fair amount of the info I have on fasting came from "The Complete Guide to Fasting" by Jason Fung, MD, plus from one of our daughters who likes to fast one day a week.

I haven't done extended fasting but do usually practice time-restricted eating. Fourteen to 16 hours between evening and 'break fast' seems to feel the best for me. I also try to maintain a semblance of Keto / Paleo and avoid gluten as much as possible (in between the stolen trip to a fast food place!) Since I take Imbruvica in the morning I feel better if I have an empty stomach and drink much water then.

I think the key is to do what feels best for your body.

[Tortola2019]

I’m amazed at how many members who have tried various “fasting“ regimes, diets and/or exercise programs to improve their health. I’ve been on an “16/8 IF” plus aerobic exercise routine for several months. My lymphocyte numbers and BMI decreased a bit, which is better than my historical upward trends! I wish someone would organize a clinical trial for CLLers to scientifically determine best diet and exercise practices...we do have a lot of CLL people here who may well like to participate!

[Blueish in reply to Tortola2019]

Have you tried to lower your carbs intake as well? in my case I have seen a good reduction in lymphocyte numbers ( 40%) after a month of 18 / 6 IF and lower carbs, quasi Mediterranean type diet.

One year later the lymphocyte numbers haven't yet gone up, I also managed to push the IF to 20-22 / 4-2 with a 24 hrs fast once a week.