Calcification test

[Frankiefocus]

Hello

Has anyone ever had a "Coronary artery calcification" scan or test done?

Was it expensive and were you glad you done it?

Thank you

[Hidden]

No I haven't, but from what I know of them it would be far more useful than a cholesterol test and a lifetime on statins. But then people would start asking questions as to why the statins haven't slowed disease progress, and we can't be having that.

[Jenny_F]

I have but I got it on my works private health care. Its the price of a CT Scan to my knowledge

[Chappychap]

I think it's about £400, a bit more expensive than the alternative £300 ultra sound scan for calcium build up that's performed on your carotid artery.

I've had the carotid ultra sound scan done privately, but not the CAC scan you're talking about. The CAC scan involves a (very low) dose of radiation which means many doctors are reluctant to use it, the carotid scan is ultra sound so there's no radiation.

Are they useful? Well, that depends. For some people either might be life savers, for others they're both pretty pointless. If you're looking for a first test to show your risk of a heart attack then a CAC test is well worth considering.

Conversely, if you've already had an angiogram, then I personally wouldn't bother. And if your objective is to assess progress following adoption of a new lifestyle, then make sure you have tests done on the same machine and ideally with the same operator, they're susceptible to quite large variability from machine to machine and even operator to operator.

I had a carotid scan in Canada and one in the UK about a year apart, totally different scores! As the second test was lower I'd like to believe it was down to my healthy life style and aggressive exercise programme. I'd LIKE to believe that, but I'd probably be kidding myself, random test variation probably swamps any therapeutic benefit.

Another big issue is that the "Calcium" measured in both a CAC test and a carotid scan, isn't necessarily the baddy you might think. Calcium isn't really what causes a heart attack, in fact calcium is a subsequent stabilising factor in plaque build up, so perversely it can actively prevent heart attacks! Ideally you don't want any plaque nor any any calcium, but if you are going to have plaque then better it's the more stable calcified version than the unstable uncalcified type. Yes, I know, it's all pretty complicated, and this is just the super simplified version!

Good luck!

[Frankiefocus in reply to Chappychap]

Thank you so much for this information, I am worried about my heart as my Grandfather died of a heart attack (he was a smoker aged 70) my Dad had a mild one then a stent was installed (he still smokes hes is 74). I am in my early 50s and was diagnosed with Rheumatoid Arthritis 4 years ago and having RA makes you more likely to experience a serious cardiovascular event like a heart attack or stroke. So I am worried as I did smoke but quit 4 years ago and straight onto a plant-based diet. I do get the odd heart palpitations that scare me so my doctor got me on the 24hr heart monitor and all was good. I was thinking would Vitamin K2 MK7 be good for my heart but now your info on the carotid ultra sound scan sounds what I am looking for. Thank you.

[Chappychap in reply to Frankiefocus]

Agree. The CAC scan sounds ideal for you.

I love the NHS to bits, but preventative heart medicine isn’t really their strong suite. In an ideal world we’d all have a comprehensive DNA test at 18 delivering a tailored lifestyle & medication plan, plus a CAC scan every five years after that. Nice idea, but doubt it’s even remotely affordable.

Good luck!

[Pitt12345]

Had one about 3 years ago cost about £400 plus £200 to see Consultant. showed some minor narrowing but nothing needing attention. The same Consultant arranged it as looks after my husband on NHS when he has had his heart attacks . I just contacted his Secretary and had it done within couple weeks I think

[PeterpPiper]

Very interesting, I wonder what our nhs doc would say if we turn up with a high calcium report from a private calcium test - increase the statin ? Or do statins even decrease calcium. I hear vitamin K2 does but the K range can increase coagulation so expert help is needed and nhs not too well versed on vitamin supplementation

[84green in reply to PeterpPiper]

My understanding is that one of the ways that statins stabilise arterial plaque is by calcifying it, as well as reducing inflammation. That is not to say that calcified plaque is a good thing - it’s not! However, calcified plaque is less likely to rupture, unlike soft or “hot” plaque which is more of a risk.

In theory, whilst a CAC scan of 0 is excellent news, the scan won’t tell you if you have any uncalcified plaque - a CT angiogram or angiogram would be needed for that.

Statins will therefore increase your CAC score if you already have plaque in your arteries.

google.com/amp/s/consultqd....

[PeterpPiper in reply to 84green]

Thanks for the reply. The next step is Should we take K2 if on statins, it’s not advisable for Warfarin users but not sure with asprin, K2 is reported to reverse calculations but may increase the blood coagulation which stent folks might not want .. unfortunately nhs are not generally to well up on vitamins, I’m not on K2 myself but it’s an interesting bedtime reading study ( providing it doesn’t keep you awake )

[84green in reply to PeterpPiper]

I’m afraid I don’t know the answer. I agree that doctors seem at best non commital when it comes to vitamins. In my experience they tend to fall back on the rationale that there is insufficient data to indicate a benefit or not.

I take K2 as part of a daily multivitamin as it apparently helps with the absorption of D3.

[Hidden in reply to PeterpPiper]

For several weeks I was taking K2-MK7 200mcg along with 4000IU of D3 each day. I stopped this because I started having problems with supplements (separate health issue). Since then I've been getting as much sun as possible and choosing foods that I know are decent K2 sources. Eggs (I like duck eggs), and I'm making my own sauerkraut which I eat everyday. I believe liver may also be a source.

[Frankiefocus in reply to Hidden]

Homemade sauerkraut is a great source

[Milkfairy Heart Star in reply to 84green]

A calcium score of zero does not rule out non obstructive coronary artery disease.

6 % of heart attacks occur without permanent blockages.

Myocardial infarction non obstructive coronary arteries MINOCA.

[PeterpPiper]

Yes I see some K2 in my multivitamin also, will be interesting to see any comments about upping the dose of that specific vit.Good health to you