Liverpool "Care" Pathway

[serenityfrank]

Hi folks.

I have been reading about this so-called "care" pathway which seems to me to put into the hands of my trusted carers - consultants, GPs or even nurses - the arbitrary power to decide to kill me by means of starvation or even worse, thirst, without necessarily getting my permission, or that of my relatives.

It now turns out that government has been paying medical institutions millions of pounds to achieve high levels of deaths via this "care" option, which has been the preferred method in most hospitals for some years.

This appears to be state sponsored murder, in a horrific way, and those of us with lung problems which are likely to take us into terminal situations in hospitals, sedated with large doses of morphine to ease our way (for whose benefit - ours or the medical staff's) are prime candidates.

I have always had a dreadful fear of thirst, and I completely fail to understand the hypocrisy of politicians who deny me the civilised form of termination available in Switzerland whilst paying medical folks to starve or dehydrate me to death, assisted by a mood altering poison.

I must confess that this week, having finished my PR without noticeable benefits, I seem to have become obsessed with this Liverpool thing since I feel it's getting closer.

Am I alone in my paranoia?

[tarzan]

On my several stays in hospital I have witnessed the demise of several COPD patients whilst observing the shocking care and treatment at first hand.

A can of worms, the least said the better as any attemt to complain is futile, similar to a situation at the bbc

Cancer and heart patients are monitored and cared for on an entirely different level of nursing care and understanding.

example the o2mask delivering 10 lit to patient had dropped off, nurses were aware but in their wisdom felt half an hour without mask on was acceptable, the patient was a corpse after a few hours of casual mask coming off episodes

Even saw patients with masks fitted but o2 not switched on and treated jovialy when brought to attention and worse but least said the better possibly

[lavender1]

Hi serenityfrank. This is awful news however the lack of attention paid to this disease by the powers that be make it frighteningly believable even to those of us who have not been hospitalised (in my case had better add as yet). Forgive my ignorance but is this a medical care option singular to Liverpool. Maybe it's true that ignorance is bliss. I wouldn't say tarzan- and thank you for your observations whilst you were in hospital - that the least said the better. The more said the better - come to think of it I haven't seen evidence of much being spent on surgery etc. for our condition so are we saying that those of us who have paid nhi stamps for say 50 years are having our money spent by the government paying under the counter to "care" options. Has the humanity and skill gone out of medicine for good. I won't be using my vote again unless someone who wishes the privileges of being in government voices their concern and their intentions toward the treatment of respiratory diseases.

[JanBatten]

The concept of the LCP is to, ideally, promote a dignified and painfree death for an individual when all of the possible reversible causes for their condition have been considered. But first there needs to be a thorough assessment by their medical team following the LCP guidelines and a mutual agreement with the individual (if they are capable of making such a decision) and their family or representative. Problems appear to arise from poor communication,or indeed, lack of communication and poor interpretation of the guidelines.

The media highlights, quite rightly, when things go wrong, but never appears to write about hospital teams who follow correct practice, i.e. who take patients off the Pathway if they show signs of improvement.

For people who are likely to be admitted to hospital, this can be an extra worry they do not not need. If possible, in conjunction with family/friend/representative, put in writing any wishes about procedures or medications you do or do not want, sometimes called a 'Living Will', this can be taken into hospital and read by hospital staff and they are exactly aware of your feelings.If anyone would like to discuss any issues please call the Helpline - 03000 030 555

Have a good weekend,

Jan

[jandan in reply to JanBatten]

Good advice about making your family aware but don't forget your GP and if you are under a consultant at a hospital/clinic make sure they are aware of your feelings too. I carry a card which states I have a Living Will along with contact numbers,just as I carry a steroid card and a donor card ( I like to cover all basis)

[Hidden]

Thought I'd post this link again, it is a free specimen Living Will, in case you don't want to consult/pay for a solicitor compactlaw.co.uk/free-legal...

You and your proxy must sign the Will in the presence of two witnesses, who must each sign and print their name and give an address and occupation. The date of signing must be inserted at the top of the first page. Also, the person you appoint as proxy must not be someone you're leaving money or possessions to in your main Will

Age UK has a good factsheet about it ageuk.org.uk/money-matters/...

FF x

[richardcrossroads]

hello

I have been feeling that this was what they are doing to me very often, as i have had to fight for everything, and the attitude is one of well it is a condition that kills you, and it is your own fault, what do you expect, and if you are ill they look no further than the COPD, in my time i have had a thyroid problem,vitamin D, testosterone, glandula fever, plus alergies etc due to medication, and no investigations all the symptoms were blamed on the COPD.

[blue1]

In todays daily mail 'Jeremy Hunt is to make it a legal requirement that doctors fully explain the end-of-life treatment in order to obtain the consent of the patient or their relatives'. The practice of obtaining no consent will be outawed by next week.

looks like this should help sort this out as currently this seems to be euthanasia by the back door.

[serenityfrank]

Hi Blue1 & everyone who joined in this topic. Maybe there is a spirit of justice (or at least coincidence) in the world!

It looks as if the legal requirement announced by Jeremy Hunt may be coming in time to alleviate my fears - though there can be nothing done for the thousands already euthanised (good word that - although I still like "murdered by the state").

Thanks also to fairyfootsteps for reposting the link to a living will - I for one will be taking that up.

Frank

[warwickstag]

Ian Duncan Smith was charged with thinking the unthinkable to get down the cost of welfare benefits. This should not surprise anyone who witnessed Thatcher turning the state militia against the working man. I bet Dave and George won't be slipping away quietly on some run-down NHS ward.

[serenityfrank]

If party politics is coming into this topic maybe it should be emphasised that the Liverpool "Care" pathway was introduced under a New Labour government - & Tony Blair's £10million a year income will ensure that he too will have better treatment than I will

[pulmonaria]

I do worry about the anxiety that media reports such as these create for all those feeling understandably vulnerable. I can only speak from experience but my husband, who had IPF, died in hospital a few months ago. The treatment and care in the hospital was exceptional, the staff, from nurses to consultants, consulted my husband and I at every step of the way and they did everything that they possibly could have to make the end of my husband's life as comfortable as could be under the circumstances and, most importantly, he said to me that he felt safe.