I have had a Wellue ECG device for a few days -- the kind that can record heartbeats for up to 24 hours.
When I review one of these recordings, I can immediately see the ECG tracings. The file with these tracings can be hundreds of screens long, one screen per minute of recording time. You can advance from one screen to the next by pressing the right arrow key.
Quite convenient! Immediate viewing. One minute, one screen. Easy clicking from one to the next.
This ECG data can be submitted for AI analysis, as y'all probably know.
What comes back in 30 minutes or so is the same representation of ECG tracings, with a new side panel that has a list of notable events -- PVCs, for example -- and when they occurred.
You can click on one of the events in that left panel, and in the right panel you will see the minute during which that event took place. Presumably, the event will be obvious to the trained eye.
*** Here's my question: Where is this ECG-data file located on my computer? ***
In the Settings section within the Wellue program, I get a folder location with a very long file name.
That folder name is c:\users\[my name]\AppData\Local\ECG Browser\DATA.
But when I go to that folder, all I find is two empty folders -- but no file with the ECG data.
I have Show Hidden Files and Folders in my Windows settings.
I am aware that I can make a PDF out of this ECG data, but a PDF is really screwy. It comprises hundreds of pages, each page comprising 13 lines of tracings of 7 seconds each.
Plus, this PDF does not have the ability to find events that the AI feature has identified.
Instead, the PDF is merely hundreds of pages of tracings.
So, again, I'm wondering where I can find the data file that is submitted for AI analysis.
I would like to take the file to my cardiologist to look at, to check the diagnoses of the Wellue program. I would like to take the file to him on my laptop computer, while also continuing to use my desktop computer for the day-to-day business.
I have "reached out" to Wellue, but have not had an answer.
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Another question.
Does anyone else have this problem with their Wellue program on a Windows PC?
When the program is up, after a few actions, I can no longer drag around the window. Nor can I access drop-down menus. Nor can I close the program.
The only thing I can do is go to Task Manager (Ctrl-Alt-Delete) and end the Wellue task.
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THANK YOU for any help you provide!
Written by
Corazon17
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For the third time, I went into that folder and now I *do* find a folder three levels down with data files inside. These data files *might* be what I'm looking for, but they seem small in terms of file size.
It's very light at night, so I will rudely leave things for the time being.
Maybe someone can tell me how to delete one of my posts?
Hi, Corazon17. To edit or delete a post click on More at the bottom of the post. A pop-up will appear with options to Edit or Delete your post. I hope this helps.
I doubt very much you would be able to do very much with the data files directly as they will be structured specifically for their software and probably in binary or hex form of some sort. I'd say the idea of taking the laptop along is probably the best.
My experience of its analysis is that the AI analysis may be ok if you have a quiet trace, i.e. just a few episodes, PVCs, whatever, to report on, but for me, where my ECG is permanently all over the place and I have a tiny p-wave, I'm not confident it gets it right at all. So even using their software to click against an analysed event and have it take you to the trace will depend on how accurately it got it the AI right. A risk of using that in front of a cardiologist (certainly with my trace) is that after having viewed a couple of examples, if they turn out to be uninteresting to the doctor, it risks devaluing showing these traces to the doc.
What I do is to create the ECG pdf file, having noted (in hospital Holter old-style) a list of day times and what I felt, fast run, ectopics, whatever, then just print out the relevant pages. I also scan through the pdf (much quicker in a proper pdf viewer such as Adobe reader) and print any other pages of interest - it definitely helps if you learn a bit about how to read ECGs (lots of info on the net). You can also try to select pages by clicking the events list in the software, noting the time, then looking at your pdf. Then take your selection along to the Cardiologist.
I also ensure I have downloaded the ECG trace pdf and the Report pdf in case the program does something funny in the future.
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As for the software glitches, the program is very unreliable. The biggest problem I have is that after connecting the USB it sometimes won't download, or after downloading it won't Remove Safely, especially if it has been plugged in for more than a couple of minutes. When I get the USB problems it freezes the USB connections and even stops you ending the task or shutting the computer down. I frequently have to do a hard shutdown (hold the power button down) to force it off. I've currently a query in with their Help desk about this, but in general their help I've found pretty poor. They did mention there's software called Livenpace which you can download. It looks the same, as does the Livenpace device, but whether it's safe to use it or whether it will mess up the AI-ECG Analysis s/w or the device, I have no idea. I can let you know once I've heard.
Once I get a successful trace download and remove the USB straight away, it normally works ok, but even making sure the device time clock has re-synced properly if the battery has been low involves leaving the USB plugged in and the AI-ECG prog running for several minutes, and even doing that will freeze the USB and even the computer.
As for me locating the data file, I would copy it from my desktop Wellue to a new installation of Wellue on my laptop computer. I would place the data file in whatever folder is appropriate for the laptop version. I would not expect the data file to be useful outside an installed version of Wellue.
I got an answer from Wellue tech support. "Jennie" wants me to make a *video* of my problem. Well, to be fair, I also asked her about the "freezing problem," which I described very well. I suppose the issue is that people in tech support are not English speakers. She so far has ignored my question about the data file.
I guess I will let the freezing stuff go, until an update maybe fixes the problem. I am comforted that you have the same issues, down to the need sometimes to force a shutdown by long-pressing the power button. I try not to be paranoid about the China factor.
Overall, the documentation and tech support for this program are as bad as I have ever seen with any product. But the results are very useful -- and perhaps better than the other products? I do not know. But it demands an unfair amount of skill from the user.
Your suggestions about a PDF viewer, etc., etc., are very astute and helpful. That is what I will do. A very long time ago, I had a Holter monitor for a day, and I kept the diary. I thought it was significant that at my workplace, I had a nasty dispute with a co-worker. During discussions about my diary, the 20s-something reviewer offered sweet advice about being mellow, etc., etc. She had no concept of someone being right and someone else being lazy and stupid. She also did not know who the vice-president of the U.S. was, despite having a college degree. (It was Dan Quayle.)
One of my current Wellue reports, for a period of 13 hours and 6 minutes, alleges 561 supraventricular heart beats. Then, on another page of the report, there is a list of how many were found during each of the 13 hours, for example 150 between 6:00 a.m. and 7:00 a.m. (assuming the device has the correct time).
So I can go the PDF for this time span and see what the tracings look like. And maybe the tracings will be interesting to the cardiologist, and not some cute thing that he amiably tolerates. I'm now 77 and see the looks of kind patience, with the slightest of smirks. I want to say, "Look, Shithead! I used to do stuff at a DOS Command prompt! I dropped acid at Disneyland in 1969!"
Maybe the simple allegation of 561 will be enough to . . . well, I'm not sure what it might do. I wish the AI had more I. For all I know, the number might be completely incorrect on account of how I was lying on the device (*if* I was lying on it). Or the number might be telling me to call an ambulance. But 561 seems like more than an artifact.
Ah, I understand about moving the files now. 2 computers!
I've just today sent a help request to Jennie re. the freezing, I explained that as the computer was frozen, there was nothing to video! Gave them a detailed explanation and if they don't speak English, there's always Google Translate or AI to do it. Not gonna let this one go until solved. It's like the USB device has taken over the USB allocation table, my USBDeview.exe program won't even do anything. Have to do a hard shutdown or just pull the devicd
The desktop icon I am using says AI-ECG-Analysis System.
The AI-ECG program informs me that I have the latest version of AI-ECG.
I have another desktop icon called Livenpace.
When that program is opened, the interface is very similar to the AI-ECG interface. The Livenpace behaves the same way, with freezes and so forth. Its version is 1.0.1.
When I had the troubles with Livenpace -- which came from a USB drive that came with the heart monitor -- I went to the Wellue website and downloaded the AI-ECG thing.
Maybe your experience is similar?
I have Windows 10. I am not willing to have Windows 11 until I am forced to.
There are large files -- 14 MB, for example -- with time stamps that match the time when I imported data from the thingie that goes on my chest.
I plan to install AI-ECG Analysis on my laptop computer, and then go to the folder of the same name, and then paste the data files from my desktop computer. Then, presumably, I can show stuff to my cardio.
I know he will be thrilled and appreciative and grateful -- right?
My next challenge is to see if my Windows 8.1 laptop will work for this program. Stay tuned!
Thanks. They've sent me a link to 1.0.2.1. The livenpace . com site has a link to that on the home page. I will be trying it in due course, but the several versions of AI-ECG over the past year+ have all had the USB freeze problem, so chance of success is ?? They have actually confirmed to me that AI-ECG Analysis is no longer the recommended software, and that Livenpace now is. Thanks for telling us!
They've told me I don't need to do Remove Safely, that you can just unplug, though if it hasn't frozen, Remove Safely works fine anyway.
They have also said that the ER1 has a write protect mechanism and if you (or a program) tries to write to the ER1, then quote: "any write operation will cause some strange problems." This looks to me to probably be the cause of the freeze problems. I have suggested the software should fail gracefully with a "write operation disallowed" message rather than locking up. We shall see...
As I say in more detail below, I installed Livenpace 1.0.2.1, and it is working well so far. Not one instance, in a few hours of messing around, of freezing or refusing to close.
As for Removing Safely, I haven't done so for years. Bad me, I suppose. But not a bad theory.
Let's hope it's true on a W10 installation too. It could be that 8.1 is not doing something 10 is doing and causing its "write protect" facility to throw a wobbly. I will see, probably after a 24 trace I want to start today.
The good news is I'm still following your efforts with genuine interest.👍✔️
However, the bad news is that potentially there are loads of Chinese Govt security personnel doing exactly the same, but with different interests in mind.🤔❌ But I hope not!
I got my Livenpace 1.0.2.1 working yesterday. It redownloaded 8 traces, total about 29 hours, that were still stored. I think it froze once briefly but I just pulled the device (they said you don't need to Remove Safely). But after pulling and restarting it worked fine for an hour or two, plugged in, whilst I reanalysed a trace and did bits and bobs. This is on Win 10. Time will tell, I am in mid-24 hr trace at present, so should find out this afternoon.
The Livenpace web page has buried two instructions I shall also try: i. plug the device in *before* starting the program (but not before starting the computer, they told me), and ii. run the program as Administrator (right click, Run as Administrator).
To add to the confusion they are clearly under themselves too, the Wellue site download page has a link to download the s/w saying "1.0.2.1", which is obviously Livenpace. Mmm, I thought, then went to download it and found it was sending me Wellue 1.1.13!
Yeah, maybe that's how I got AI-ECG Analysis System 1.1.13 a few weeks ago.
I would like to get into *real* questions about these reports. Of course, that will be in a new post. Such as, which of the "mm/mV" settings is best to use on the ECG tracings? And what the heck is "mm/mV"?
In fact, I will do that now. I hope people do not mind my laziness.
mm/mV is the vertical displacement of the trace, 10 mm/mV is the standard used on normal doctors' 12 lead ECGs, which means 10 mm peak height corresponds to 1 millivolt electrical signal measured. I have found on the Wellue that the chest strap gives a greater peak height than the sticker method. Chest strap can give overlapping traces on the ECG pdf at 10 mm/mV, and sometimes you have to change it to 5 mm/mV before making pdf.
Please let us know if you are able to have 2 copies of the software on different devices, although I imagine if the software is contained on a USB stick, it would seem highly probable.🤔
I have been interested in this device, or rather the newer 24/72 hour model, for quite a while as it seems the best for monitoring myself during sleep. However the poor Wellue customer service you describe (I also sent an unanswered query) and the obvious software bugs have so far left me unconvinced, sadly.
I am still waiting for the market to offer a portable 24/72 hour device that offers a similar AI report and detailed analysis possibilities via an App, and not needing to own a personal laptop or other computer (which I don't own). The AI analysis would be undertaken via connection to an online website. I'm sure this is the direction of travel re these heart monitoring devices, although being 77 like you, time might not be on my side.
However, I do like your "can do" attitude, and hope you can find a way through the technical issues you are so lucidly describing, along with the helpful input of Cliff_G . 👍✔️
See my long comment below. For here, a brief summary.
It seems that I *can* have this software, and its capabilities, on two devices -- a desktop computer and a laptop computer. The underlying data folders are gigantic, by the way. Computers are essential for this software.
It seems that in order to get AI reports, I have to request them separately from each device. It seems that I am allowed to do this, without protest from Wellue.
I plan to keep data on my desktop for my use, and on my laptop for taking to doc appointments -- assuming the doc will tolerate my use of a "toy" (his possible words, not yet a direct quote). I will probably have far fewer files for the doc version.
Thank you for this and your fuller reply. Your investigations and explanations have been very helpful, even to someone like me who is interested but doesn't own a computer.
And, from contact with other Forum members who own similar Wellue devices, I can appreciate that the 24 hour ecg monitoring results produced by this Wellue personal device are currently uniquely valuable in understanding a patient's burden of arrythmias.
Good luck for your upcoming contact with your cardiologist.
On the Wellue website, there is a FAQ page that has the answer you need. I copied this:
"The device can store 10 ECG/EKG records, 30 hours in total. Each ECG/EKG record can up to 24 hours."
I think it best to save each recording that you want to preserve or it will stay on the device itself rather than on your laptop or PC and will need to be transferred again to the app on your laptop. There is limited space on the device itself, which is a kind of USB memory stick and I suspect once it is full it will auto-delete the oldest record which will then be lost forever..
I actually find little use for the whole recording and only save the summary in general, although I really use it these days as I am now confident that my arrhythmias have been identified and are being treated as well as they can be.
I use my Windows 11 PC for this, and can check later if you need me to.
I think it is *essential* to import data from the "chest thingie" into the computer programs, for permanent storage and later reference.
In fact, you actually *have* stored data on your computer when you are viewing results that were captured by the chest thingie.
For a while, I was making my own copies of results, until I realized that those results are permanently stored on my computer.
For a while, I was deleting sessions from the interface, thinking that by doing so, I was freeing up space on the heart thingie. But now I realize (or think) that the heart thingie does its own deletions when it needs to start new sessions. We do not have to curate the heart thingie nor worry about a "disk full" (in old DOS terms).
Thanks for that. Yes - it self deletes when it is full. I have not used mine in a good while, but I seem to recall having to re-download the data from the chest monitor as when I tried to view the PDF from the PC program, it didn't work. I shall have to have another go! Thank you for all your time in looking at this and for the advice.
Note: This has been edited slightly at Numbers 14 and 19, where I *had* speculated about the fast speed of the delivery of the AI report.
Some exciting developments. I realize that this interest might seem demented to some of you, and completely beside the point of "getting better medically." In fact, this work might trigger afib! But I think something here might help someone else who is trying to get Wellue info to a doc.
1. To work with the Wellue ECG device, I installed Livenpace 1.0.1, using the USB drive that came in the box with the heart monitor. I am using Windows 10 on a decent, recent desktop computer.
2. That program has many faults, such as becoming not closeable and not draggable; causing the computer to not shut down properly; locking up; and so forth.
3. In response to this, per credible advice somewhere, I found and installed AI-ECG Analysis System. This program has the same problems I mention in Item 2, although less frequent. I can work arouund these with computer tricks, Task Manager, and so forth. With all these hassles, the results and reports *are* very useful.
4. Our Cliff_G, having similar problems, received the advice from Jennie at Wellue that the preferred software is Livenpace 1.0.2.1.
5. I was able to install Livenpace 1.0.2.1 on my desktop computer. I found the program at livenpace.com / PC Software Downlaod / PC Download
6. Before doing that, I uninstalled 1.0.1 and restarted my computer. Alas, 1.0.1 did not have a way to inquire whether it needed to be updated.
7. 1.0.2.1 seems to work for importing data from the heart monitor. After a few hours, I do not have the problems I mention in Item 2.
8. 1.0.2.1 *did* provide an AI analysis of a 6-hour "session."
9. I *was* able to install Livenpace 1.0.2.1 on my laptop computer, a 10-year-old, slow-slow-slow, Windows 8.1 device.
10. That installation *does* import data from the heart monitor thing that goes on the chest.
11. The event list on the desktop goes from 1 at the top to 6 at the bottom. But the event list on the laptop goes from 6 at the top to 1 at the bottom. So far, I have not been able to figure out how to reorder the list on the laptop, which has latest on top, which I do not like.
12. On the laptop installation, I *am* able to get the all-important AI report, *even* for a report that I already received on the desktop installation.
13. The reports are for a session that lasted 6 hours and 56 minutes.
14. The desktop report and the laptop AI reports match each other *exactly* on their Page 3s. To me, Page 3 is the most important. I quickly compared the other 7 pages and saw no differences.
15. The laptop opens its AI report in *Firefox* and divulges the file location of this report, with the full "DOS-path" file name -- an obscenely long string of characters.
16. The desktop opens its AI report in my PDF reader, divulging the "ultimate" file name, but nothing else, in terms of folders. (I guess that the laptop action results from the fact that right now I do not have a PDF reader on the laptop. That results from a recent "cleaning" of the desktop.)
17. Alas, my efforts to export data from one installation to another installation has so far failed. I copied data from the deep-down data folder in the AI-ECG installation on the desktop into the equivalent deep-down data folder within the new Livenpace installation on the laptop. Alas, this imported data does not show up in the "top-level interface" of the laptop installation.
18. Bottom line: In order to have a laptop version of data to take to my doctor, I believe the solution -- obvious-obvious-obvious in hindsight -- is to simply install TWO programs, one on the desktop and one on the laptop. Then import data from the heart monitor into each installation. Then request the AI report from each installation.
19. I was hesitant to believe that would work, but it seems to. As silly as it might sound, I do worry about the billions of files that fly around every day, and these are *giant* files, and me asking for things twice. I wonder how long the service will be free.
Thanks, Corazon, interesting stuff. I will instal the latest Livenpace probably today as I want a new 24 hour trace after my semi-successful ablation last week. Let's hope it is freeze-free for me too.Re. points 15 and 16, yes, it will be the default program settings on the laptop which make a pdf open in Firefox. Firefox has (obviously) its own pdf reader, if you install Adobe reader may reset the default reader to itself or you may have to do that in the W8.1 settings somewhere. You may also need to change Firefox's own "open in" defaults for files, in its own settings.
On this however (I'm not sure which model of Wellue you purchased? perhaps the original 24 hour model?), I know a UK Forum member who bought the 72 hour version of the newer model (with both 24 & 72 hour versions available) now sold by Wellue. And with this model he/she was offered a subscription Premium App experience as follows viz. 1 week free trial, £70 per year, or £20 per 3 months. The Premium Service seems to provide additional heart diagrams and calculations much along the lines of other health Apps, although from previous Wellue feedback I'm not sure how useful or reliable this Premium Service would be. However, my friend was able to refuse the subscription offer and still receives the so-far free AI report summaries and the ability to interrogate the arrhythmias that you also enjoy.
Ok, so, a 24 hr trace finished today. Downloaded, analysed and reviewed using Livenpace. No problems except it would not "Safely Remove". Just pulled the device as advised by them.
I had even more problems with Wellue AI-ECG this time, though, it downloaded the device ok, but when Analysed, it wouldn't show the Analysing progress bar, then when complete it would not change the Analyse button to View Report, and when I tried to view any of the reports (old or new), it refused to open them. It also locked up Adobe Reader from opening any other pdf files (outside of Wellue) and needed a reboot to get it working again. This was repeatable. I am beginning to suspect the installation has gone bad, so I will uninstall, reinstall off the shipped USB stick and re-upgrade.
Both the above I ran in Administrator mode.
Re fast analysis on their server, both times above it took probably less than 5 minutes to complete a 24 hr trace, much quicker than before. I think they've upgraded their server.
At least Livenpace seems to be working.
I hope this is "it" for the present. Someone to whom I recommended the Wellue runs AI-ECG 1.1.13 on Win 11 and has had zero problems!
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Review of the Wellue 24 hour heart monitor with AI analysis.
for UK Afibbers £15 off Wellue at amazon
What AF looks like on an ECG
Well that explains a lot.
