Funny Turn that wasn’t Funny 😔

[Ailsablue]

Hello everyone 🤗

Hope you’re all enjoying the sunshine we’ve been having!

I was out today doing just that and had an easy walk around a couple of shops with my husband. We started heading home in the car with him driving but a couple of minutes in I took an alarming funny turn. I do have more or less permanent Afib but never experienced such a strong feeling before to the point I thought I would either die or pass out. It was a sudden feeling in my stomach which seemed to travel upwards then the feeling of a faint and not feeling right. There was never any pain and then it slowly wore off me in a few minutes. However, I was left with anxiety which took longer to go away and I was left scared out of my wits. I don’t get much bother with feeling palpatations much and can’t even say if I felt any when this was happening to me.

I suppose I’m looking to see if any of you have experienced similar kinds of episodes and can enlighten me as to any possible reason as to what it could have been especially those with smart watches. On looking later my heart rate had been 49 at that time then the next reading five minutes later was 132. It stayed high for a few seconds then came back down to 106. I’m not an expert on how long between readings and I realise any replies are mearly speculative but I’m needing a wee bit of support on this.

Thank you 🙏🏻

[Peony4575]

I get that when I have air in my stomach . It is alarming but nothing bad happens . If you google can air in my stomach cause palpitations or similar . The vagus nerve causes your heart to slow or go irregular , then it speeds up to play catch up . Am not saying that’s what happened to you but I have had that very occasionally for decades usually happens when am anxious

[Ailsablue in reply to Peony4575]

Thank you Peony, I will Google what you have mentioned about air in the stomach. I’ll also look into the vagus nerve catch up which makes sense. It’s all very unsettling as I was enjoying the day then after sitting in the car ….boom! x

[Peony4575 in reply to Ailsablue]

Yes it’s very unpleasant . There’s a name for it something beginning with R syndrome

[Lizty]

Ailsa, this is quite common for me... although I don't have permanent atrial fibrillation. It happens when the gap between heartbeats is a couple of seconds longer than normal and my blood pressure drops as a result. Feels like I am going into a faint - but recover as soon as the next beat commences. Yes... it is a very scary feeling. Am not sure if it is directly related to at. fib. or a supraventicular arrhythmia... as I get both. It may not be the same in your case... did you eat anything whilst you were walking around? There may have been some little trigger. It can happen to me if I am a bit stressed or, ironically, a short while after I have had something to eat.

[Ailsablue in reply to Lizty]

Hi Lizty, no I didn’t eat anything whilst out and about. I’d only had some cereal and a cup of tea before I left and was heading home for some lunch. We weren’t out a long shopping trip. I do notice these quick drops to the 40’s more these days.

[Rainfern]

I certainly had a few of those near passing-out moments when in persistent AF. I put it down to fluctuating blood pressure more than heart rate, though of course both may have been involved. But I’ve had occasional “funny turns” throughout my life and my sister gets them any time she eats high processed carbs or too much sugar. She nearly passes out and has to rest up for hours. Her diagnosis is “dumping syndrome” - worth checking out online. My funny turns always cause anxiety. My sister less so, perhaps down to her medical background!

[Ailsablue in reply to Rainfern]

Thanks for replying Rainfern. Never heard of ‘dumping syndrome’ but I’ll certainly check it out. The anxiety is a problem in itself to be sure.

[Popepaul]

Agree with the comments above. It sounds like presyncope. Your pulse and blood pressure have been labile. If so then the potential danger would be full syncope with a fall. For me these incidents have faded since I started bisoprolol. Stay hydrated.

[Tricia239]

We’re you possibly dehydrated?

[Ailsablue in reply to Tricia239]

Possible I suppose. I will endeavour to drink more fluids as it was a horrible experience.

[Tricia239 in reply to Ailsablue]

I totally blacked out once on a coach, felt dreadful, was ‘out’ for quite a while. Eventually had a drink of water and quite quickly recovered. We were on our way to a flight home from Spain and so I deliberately didn’t drink! But I will never forget how dreadful I felt. Fingers crossed that’s all it was with you.

[Ailsablue in reply to Tricia239]

😲 It must have been really frightening for you. It’s one of my biggest concerns as I don’t like flying anyway and am due on a flight in May. I don’t drink beforehand (or much at all these days) and wear the dreaded support stockings tho my ankles do still swell. Now that this has happened it’s made me even worse at the thought of dealing with airports and flying. It’s such a rogue condition to deal with.

[Tricia239 in reply to Ailsablue]

Oh, I didn’t mean alcohol - wouldn’t risk that! You could ask for Assistance at the airports, that would reduce the hassle and anxiety considerably.

[Ppiman]

Strange you should write this as I had a more momentary feeling than yours, but similar and equally disconcerting, the other evening. It was the worst feeling I have had with my arrhythmias since 2019 when it all started off with fast atrial flutter (since ablated and stopped - now I have frequent ectopic beats and AF).

I also have a low heart rate at times, as you do. I did run an Apple ECG as soon as I got myself together, as it were, and it was showing no AF but runs of bigeminy, which I guess was the cause. I haven't had another, thankfully. It was the closest I have been to visiting A&E since all this started five years ago; and that is not something I would ever want to do given its current parlous state, but it frightened me.

Steve

[Ailsablue in reply to Ppiman]

It’s the not knowing Steve that’s bothering me. By the time I got home and got myself together my blood pressure was fine. Didn’t do an ECG though. The low heart rate is coming up in comments and is relatively newish for me where I normally jump around in60’s to 80’s. It’s been as low as 40. totally agree with you about avoiding trips to hospital 🥴. I’m now waiting on another episode happening which isn’t good for anyone.

[Tricia239 in reply to Ailsablue]

If you’re worried about your low heart rate, I would speak to your Consultant and see about having a pacemaker - I had one because of a slow sinus node recovery - I.e. when I reverted naturally to NSR, there was a long gap and, as you describe, it is incredibly scary, the pacemaker would kick in until the heart is back up to speed.

[Ppiman in reply to Ailsablue]

My low rate is likely caused by my also having a "wide QRS", and that is caused by what's called a "left bundle branch block" (LBBB - most have RBBB, but as we get older LBBB comes more common). If you have any recent ECGs then have a look at the peaks - are they "wide" looking. My consultant told me that bradycardia, as well as arrhythmias can cause drops in the blood flow to the brain (unmeasurable using a cuff BP machine) and these can create issues such as brain fog, memory issues, "distancing" ("depersonalisation"), a light-head and so on. I asked him if the LBBB was also responsible, but he said he didn't think so, but that that can contribute to the bradycardia.

So far, I haven't had a repeat of this, which I feared would happen (thank goodness), but I am reasonably satisfied that it, as well as perhaps yours, were cause by arrhythmia.

Just to mention it, another thought is of its being linked to neck issues. I have some cervical disk bulging and that can, as we get older, I gather, also cause dizziness or issues with sudden movement, so that adds another possibility but I feel sure this was the heart issues (LBBB + bradycardia + arrhythmia).

Below is a run of an ECG that I took close to the problem. The heart rate on this shows as 69, which is not bradycardia, of course but... the bigeminy kicks in so soon after the natural contraction, that the ventricles would not have had much oxygenated blood in them before the second contraction comes along, effectively, I am theorising, reducing the heart rate significantly.

I hope you are continuing to feel well. I share your fears and offer my sympathy.

Steve

Contec PM20 ECG showing arrhythmia.

[Tapanac]

I kept getting that feeling lightheaded as if I was going to faint and couldn’t hang on, but eventually despite my afib/tachycardia it was discovered that my heart rate kept dropping to low 30s and during the night under 30 so I was given a pacemaker

I still have the afib/tachy but thankfully no more fainting or nearly fainting episodes.

All the best

[Ailsablue in reply to Tapanac]

That’s a really low reading. It’s good you got sorted out with a pacemaker.

[Buffafly]

Yes, happens if my HR suddenly drops I think. I used to have semi blackouts when reverting to NSR from AF caused by pauses of several seconds. If it happens regularly it could be ‘sick sinus syndrome ‘ which leads to inappropriate changes in HR so I would report it if not a one off.

[Ailsablue in reply to Buffafly]

Thank you for replying. I’ll have to investigate sick sinus syndrome as I don’t know anything about that. It’s the first time I’ve felt as bad as this so I will definitely be keeping a closer eye on things.

[jeanjeannie50]

I sometimes get a strange feeling come over me and feel like I'm going to pass out, a darkness comes over and then when just on the point of losing conscious back I come. It's a horrible feeling, unfortunately I have no idea of the cause but guess my heart or BP is doing something odd.

I probably experience this around once a year. Does that sound similar to what you had?

Jean

[Ailsablue in reply to jeanjeannie50]

It does Jean. I’ve had other experiences of the ‘darkness’ as it’s the nature of the beast but this one was much stronger and scarier. Does your heart rate show lower readings at all? I’ve turned into a hypochondriac with this horrible condition. There are so many different feelings/sensations with it. I also wonder with sitting down in the car whether I’ve compromised something with slouching and my heart has complained about it. It’s catching proof of any changes that’s the trick as often my watch is charging. This time though there was an obvious low to high jump - the low 40’s being a newish reading for me lately.

[baba]

It COULD be that you are having long pauses between some heartbeats. This would account for how you were feeling (a horrible feeling) and also for the temporary drop in heart rate.

Very hard to capture evidence unless on continuous monitoring.

Let your medical team know and save any evidence you have on your smartwatch.

Best wishes

[Ailsablue in reply to baba]

Thank you Baba. I’m going to start taking diary notes and make sure my watch is charged regularly. I have a Kardia for ecg readings but to be honest I’m not terribly sure what I’m looking for tho did show a doctor once as I felt the line between beats was long at times (how many squares is too long 🤷🏻‍♀️). Needless to say he wasn’t concerned. As you say very hard to detect these changes if you’re not wired up at the time.

[baba in reply to Ailsablue]

I never managed to capture it on Kardia, because I either recovered quickly or lost consciousness.

[MarkS]

It lasted a few minutes so that rules out a lot of what has been suggested. I'm wondering about a TIA? Are you on anticoagulants? How was your sight and speech whilst you were having this episode.

[Ailsablue in reply to MarkS]

Yes I’m on Apixaban. My sight and speech weren’t affected thankfully or it would have been straight to hospital.

[Electricblu]

Hi Ailsablue, this used to happen to me, but not for a long time now. The worst episode was when I once reached up to open the curtains, I lay on the floor because I thought that I was going to pass out - I was still there two hours later! My BP machine was also on the floor where I had left it earlier and I was able to reach it. My BP at that point was 45/40 and I really thought I was dying. At a subsequent cardiology appointment I was told that my BP monitor was 'obviously broken' and what had happened was dismissed. Well my fit bit showed similar readings, so I disagreed with the cardiologist which didn't go down too well..... I now have a fantastic new cardiologist and still use the same BP monitor 😉 My BP very slowly continued to climb around 10mg every 20 mins or so. By this time I was convinced that I must be hemorrhaging somewhere and was going to die anyway but I'm still here to tell the tale. I notice from your bio that you take 10 mg Bisoprolol and also Digoxin - is that still the case? I'm wondering if the drugs might be playing a part in this. I was only on 1.25 Bisoprolol and my heart rate would drop to the low forties. I subsequently managed to get a Kardia reading showing bradycardia so the Bisoprolol was stopped and I was put on Digoxin 1.25mg instead. Two years later the same awful feelings were happening again along with the plummeting BP so Digoxin was also stopped. I know we're all different and Digoxin has other uses but I would be asking my doctor if two rate control medications were necessary, especially with such a high level of Bisoprolol. They don't always get these things right and in my case trial and error under medical guidance is the only thing that has stabilised my condition. I do hope that things improve for you. All the best.

[birdpie]

I happened to be wearing a Zio patch to monitor my heart when I had a 6 or 7 second pause in my heart rhythm. I also felt this as well. It wasn't long after that I had a Pace Maker placed to protect me from any future pauses. It would be a good idea to contact your doctor to report your symptoms. Take care.