I often give the advice ‘AF generally isn’t fatal unless you try to run a marathon in AF’. So today I see that Luton’s captain, Tom Lockyer, had a cardiac arrest during a game, having previously had a collapse on the pitch caused by AF and having ‘an operation to fix the problem which shouldn’t happen again’.
I might be quoting this incident next time someone has an ablation so they can return to extreme sports…..Yes I know, very unlucky and fortunately he seems ok now but it does show the risk is real.
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Buffafly
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It's sad, but I'm sure he had medical clearance by a top cardiologist and/or ep.
So hard to make any conclusions or recommendations based on what has happened. Wasn't it Professor Shilling who said in the posted video that he tells his patients not to worry about thinners, just go out and do what you want to do and he mentioned Rugby.
I may not agree with Shilling about playing Rugby on thinners, but the point is that I don't think anyone here should fear that they are going to have a cardiac arrest just because they have afib and engage in vigorous activity. I'm sure Tom Lockyer's case was a lot more complex.
My son was an extreme athlete, not so much now, mostly hiking and some cycling- things he can do with his family- he had an ablation 17 years ago, I was only diagnosed five years ago, but when I think back that his cardio (a fellow canoeist) said to carry on as before, and what I have since learned, I would have had a heart attack years ago constantly worrying about him !
From memory you and I have been on this forum ( and maybe on the earlier incarnation of it on Yahoo ) for a long time. I forget over the last 14 years ( for me) how often you and some others have made similar statements ..... sadly to little or no avail.
Equally I forget how many times I have read of many people boasting/bragging of their success following an ablation of getting back into their own extreme activities, whatever they maybe. Unfortunately, we hear little from them in the months, years that follow so we never know what really happens to them ...........
Also, equally, over those same 14 years I have read of/ heard of/ seen reports of (onTV) people who indulge in extreme activities falling dead ... in each case it was reported that they had a history of or were or had been treated for Atrial Fibrillation.
So my view is all treatments should come with a health warning ( like on cigarette packets) by the health care professionals involved in treatments, stating that in the normal run of life AF won't kill you ...... but if you indulge in extreme activities you can't always offer any guarantees. For me, a heart that has been mugged by AF, is one that isn't up to it (anything ) any more and needs treating with respect.
Reading the report of the first episode it seemed to come on suddenly while he was playing, so maybe same again though he was passed fit, but as we all know by now with AF you may be fit until you aren’t. I had a MI2 (artery spasm heart attack) as a result of trying to do a bit of light housework when I felt very ill with AF so I’ve learned my lesson…..
Agree, John. My experience was AF was spotted when I was working out in gym. I may or may not have had episodes before that. But as I'd always enjoyed exercise and been told like many that exercise is good for the heart I asked consultant about whether exercise would help AF. he said no definitely not, don't do vigorous exercise that puts your heart under pressure. Problem I've found is that if you enjoy vigorous exercise you miss it and I suppose if its your livelihood you miss it even more.
All cases of reported sudden cardiac death in the last 14 years associated with Afib? Are you absolutely certain of that? I must have missed that because I don't think I've ever seen a report of sudden cardiac death associated with Afib, although there may have been one or 2 that had Afib. Happy to be proved wrong
I don’t particularly believe in proving people right or wrong. All I am stating are facts that have emerged ( as morbid general interest items of news since I was diagnosed with AF ) and come to my attention.
Buffafly is ahead of me and 2 victims come to my mind too, although, I have a feeling there was a third who was in some athletic meet overseas. I have lived most of my life in Australia and still (quite naturally) follow their print news and in this way came across the fact that at least three Australian athletes have died in pursuit of their sporting interests, 2 marathon runners and an Olympic cyclist in recent years. There are heaps more that suffered cardiac arrests and lived to tell the tale.
But the UK and Australia are not the only nations who have this issue, USA and New Zealand do too ( and there are others if I could be bothered to research ). If you do the research you’d also come across big name athletes who once retired ( in some cases those that are still active ) have been diagnosed with AF (in one or other of its incarnations). Billie Jean King being one. The athletes who seem prone to AF in the countries I’ve mentioned are; Rowers, Skiers, Cyclists and Runners and Triathletes. So, choose yer poison ! I am aware also, anecdotally, that fighter pilots can also become victims of AF.
It is a bit unfortunate that the general comment on this forum seems to follow the mantra ( promoted by the medical profession ) that AF won’t kill ya .... sorry guys and gals, it can and it does, but death is highly selective. I think sometimes that the whole concept of AF could be put into a more meaningful perspective for the benefit of all categories of sufferers from all walks of life.
The Aussie government seem to be quite on the ball when it comes to publishing facts and figures of interest in such health matter and over the period of years from 2001 to 2018 ( probably as current as you’d get at the moment ). I’m only gonna summarise ....... AF underlying cause - Between 2001 and 2018, the proportion of deaths in Australia with the underlying cause of AF increased 2.3-fold from 0.6% to 1.4% of all deaths. And AF associated cause - Between 2001 and 2018, the proportion of deaths in Australia with an associated cause of AF almost doubled, from 4.0% to 7.6% of all deaths. Overall - AF was listed as an underlying or associated cause in 4.6% of all deaths in 2001, increasing to 9.0% of deaths in 2018.
I haven’t bothered to examine the UK stats on a like for like basis. Certainly if I were Mr. Lockyer I’d be looking for a more highly skilled medical team if I were to continue in his chosen sport AND have a deep and meaningful conversation with myself as to where I wanted to go in life. It's a no brainer really.
I too, take issue with the "AF won't kill you" mantra as it may cause things that have potential to do just that. Being on the waiting list for a valve repair, caused by an AF induced enlarged left atrium, I can testify that's a life threatening issue caused by this pain in the butt condition.
I'd be having a serious think about my career options if I were Tom Lockyer. He may not get a 3rd chance.
Apparently, no UK insurer would cover him to play when he returned to football so he had to play abroad for a while before being allowed to play over here again.
this Wednesday is the first anniversary of my cardiac arrest, I wasn’t even doing anything, just lying in bed in A&E after a magnesium drip, now have a pacemaker waiting for cardiologist to decide whether to operate or not!
It’s a horrible toxic attitude and it’s shocking to see newbies signing up and questioning themselves about what they did “wrong”. We have to be so careful about internalising these attitudes. Like it or not, cardiac conditions are stigmatised by society. I had to put a friend right a few months back, when another friend of hers had to go to A&E with chest pain, saying “no wonder, all that sugar she was eating, all that weight she put on”. I had to put her straight about electrical conduction problems, arrhythmias, valve problems (which affect everyone to some degree by middle age), heriditary conditions etc.
‘an operation to fix the problem which shouldn’t happen again’. I must admit that when I read that on BBC news I thought the same thing. Was he misinformed? We all know that ablation is not a guaranteed cure for AF and many people on this forum report relapses and need two or three ablations before they get any long term relief. I'm surprised that he felt 'it shouldn't happen again' when we here know that after just one ablation 'it's very likely it could happen again' at least within the blanking period.
Of course I understand that we don't know all the details.
What a brave man. He was probably warned of the risk but was prepared to take the chance because of his love for football. Good luck to hime for a complete recovery. As a spectator following my beloved team I also feel, at times, I'm taking a chance but what to do😂😂?
Point is, you know you’re taking a chance (yes, I get it is a joke) and that is the motivation for posts that some people rate as ‘scare mongering’. Once you’ve read the info/opinions it’s your choice. I don’t think it’s right to keep risks a secret so as not to upset people who are highly risk averse. One of the best things schools could teach is interpretation of statistics so that people can understand how information could affect them. The never ending ‘bloodthinner’ debate is a case in point.
In England, according to Sport England data 1.5 million people play organised team/league football at least twice a month. I think the case of collapse in elite athletes is always publicised but it is a vanishingly small number of people in relative terms. One case doesn't make a theory. I've had a stack of premium bonds for a long time, biggest payout £50, overall return below the stated amount. Looking at the big prize list recently someone with a few bonds held for a month won £100k.The footballer had been given the all clear. I guess maybe now his insurance may pay out if it is career ending or he'll carry on with what is a short career.
Risk and 'getting on with life' is a dilemma played out on HealthUnlocked pages. As a purely observational point the debates are often bipolar, glass half full, half empty and the mood is sometimes bipolar too!
It's awful coming to terms with a life changing event. It's stressful and anxiety ridden.
We search for answers, cures, treatments etc.
For me I look for #chinksoflight in a hopefully positive journey to make the best of what I have,what I can do. I see all around me a zest for life in the most profoundly challenging circumstances that make my challenges look almost trivial. But I do my bit to firstly improve my health ( not easy for a short, bald overweight old bloke , sorry him/he) , then to try and do and speak positively of my experiences above all as a thank you to the people who helped me get here.
Well, after reading all in this post, I'm a bit worried about going back to the gym after AF diagnosis, seems like pumping iron might be put on hold, and cardio being primary if I go back.
Your gym (not a gym bunny so I may be wrong) should have someone competent to guide you as to what level of exercise is beneficial and what is causing unproductive stress on your body. The BHF website has advice on exercise levels.
The main thing is not. to. exercise. strenuously. in. AF!
Hi Buffafly. Before diagnosis with this AF, and along with not being in a gym for about the past 3 years due to covid (picked it up twice from there), I was an aging bodybuilder, it's the typical gym atmosphere that would motivate me, and it's going to be quite different when I do finally go back, I know pushing myself is definately out, I'm just going to have to get used to taking it easy there.
Well the latest outcome and specialist speaking today said that his event on this occasion was not caused by Afib and he now has an implanted defibrillator fitted. As I said in my original response, almost quoted verbatim by athe Kings College Cardiologist, the likelihood of a footballer or athlete having such an event is vanishingly small, in fact because they are fit and have a healthy lifestyle they are best equipped to survive such an event. There will be no issues going forward should he wish to continue as a footballer. All people with heart issues are best advised to improve their health including exercise as part of their regime, according to their individual circumstances. The number of young people fitted with such a device is also a very low number.
That's a relief! I guess all us afibbers can now get out of bed But seriously, having afib is not only not a death sentence, it also is not a reason not to engage in vigorous spots activity unless your doctor advises you against due to your individual situation.
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I guess it was from reading, too many of the doom and gloom posts here about vigorous exercise and a fib. 
CARDIAC ARREST
cardiac discharge 
Implantable cardiac Device 
