This morning’s Daily Telegraph features this article from one of its regular contributors…..
Daily Telegraph article……: This morning... - Atrial Fibrillati...
Daily Telegraph article……
61 Replies
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Interesting read thank you, good to read something that’s written well but not particularly medical. I’m guessing lots of women identify with the stress, panic, peri menopause and menopause scenarios.
• in reply to4chickens
Yes, wouldn’t it be good if some of our male doctors read it and take it onboard…..hope you are progressing well 🤞
4chickens• in reply to
Yes thank you I’ll do an update after Thursday as it will be a month post op and test day to see if it was a Tia
Yes - I read this yesterday and have to say I felt cross with this woman . It's bad enough that male doctors lump us into the anxious , hormonal panic attack box .
Interesting to read, thank you for sharing FJ.
Thanks Flapjack. She seems a bit cheery about the whole thing!
I know!
That was exactly my first thought!
I was fobbed off by my GP for 5 years. One GP even gave me a leaflet on Hypochondria, I felt a fraud and was embarrassed. Panic attacks, anxiety, all in my mind was some of the things I was been told, all because it wasn’t captured on a 30 sec ecg in the surgery. Not sure how difficult it is for surgeries to hand out 48 hr monitors which will detect most arrhythmia s.
I’m at the stage where they found too much fibrosis at my ablation, so now I’m just on rate control. Must admit that the comment they would have needed to catch it ten years earlier did get to me. I tried! I guess the thing is that it simply never got caught on an ECG when I did get sent for one. It took me getting an Apple watch for it to be detected.
And I was told on a telephone appointment with the apple watch recording wasn’t accepted because it wasn’t a proper ECG. However, he did say the Kardia was so I had to buy one of those to catch the AF. When I had a F2F appointment the doctor saw that watch recording and said “yes, that’s AF” 🤷🏻♀️
I was still in n A Fib luckily. At least I’m anticoagulated now!
It's a bad job when probably the only way of convincing these shoddy excuses for doctors is to splash out £100 for a Kardia and then work to convince them that the ECG's produced are accepted by most cardiologists these days. GP 's surgeries should invest in half a dozen Kardias so that patients can capture a trace when the episode is happening. It just shows how ignorant most of them are about the nature of PAF .It's appalling that you should be given a leaflet on hypochondria.
• in reply toAuriculaire
But is it as simple as that. There are many forms of Arrhythmia and not all require the same treatment so it is fairly important for medics to determine the type of Arrhythmia before offering a treatment plan. The GP’s reference to hypochondria is inexcusable but hopefully a one off situation. All the many specialists I have heard speak on the subject say that paroxysmal AF is almost impossible to diagnose unless an ECG can be carried out during an episode and that can be difficult to achieve. Expecting surgeries to fund and dish out a number of Kardia monitors “may”, in time become more practical than 24 hour monitors. If someone can afford a smartphone, surely £100 is a small price to pay to help diagnose paroxysmal AF
I agree, and because of the fact I was fobbed off for five years it convinced friends & family that I was physically ok, and still even though I have had two ablations and been on many meds they think a lot of it is in my head to this day. It was in fact AF that was causing my anxiety. Because of this I spend a lot of time alone.
My GP when I showed him my kardia ECG said 'oh those things,' opened a drawer to show me 4 kardia's. Followed by ,'we allgot some ages ago, never used them'. He also actually told me to go on holiday abroad in a days time I was fine and overreacting. Ended up in AE that afternoon. GP,s really don't understand how sympathetic some people get.
A lot of them are useless. Fancy wasting money on useful gadgets and then not using them. I bet they diagnosed umpteen women with anxiety or panic attacks instead of lending them a Kardia.
Shocking. There was a GP at my surgery who played down my concerns and was responsible for having my arrhythmia clinic appointment cancelled. I didn’t even know about it but as this was during the delta wave I had put it down to the clinics being put on hold. She had actually queried the referral and didn’t consider it necessary. I had to be re referred by another GP so this was effectively a 19 month delay. Thankfully she has left the practice. She didn’t go as far as giving me a leaflet on hypochondria but she gave me the “ectopics are harmless” speech. Shortly after that I caught an episode of AF on my watch and had a consultation with a sympathetic GP who asked me to email the tracings. So we do need these devices and they are useful. Undiagnosed AF is a big problem and how do you “prove” it when it starts and stops? I’ve had two 24h ECGs since my first awareness of AF but no AF was picked up during the recordings because it’s paroxysmal. But it’s definitely not “hypochondria”.
Amizing isn’t it. I am sure in the future people won’t be fobbed off as we were due to technology, and I suppose back in the day AF wasn’t considered a heart condition as they were unable to detect arrhythmias such as AF so perhaps we can count ourselves lucky in the fact that we were eventually diagnosed and treated. But I think GP”s need to made more aware and act accordingly.
Ditto- neither of my two 24 hr Holters showed anything but a perfectly functioning heart! No afib, hardly any ectopics, nice and steady average of 60 - 65 bpm. "Luckily" I was taken to hospital in an ambulance as the paramedics registered it when we called the SAMU during the first full blown fighting frogs in the chest episode.
you could get yourself a Kardia and that would tell you if you have A/Fib. You could then show your doctor the results.
When I first went to the surgery I had never heard of afib, I was told my palpitations were down to anxiety & panic attacks, afib was never mentioned and I don’t think Kardia exsisted until 2-3 years ago. I was completely in the dark as to what was causing my palps. I also don’t think it is fair asking patients to purchase £100 Kardias on the basis it COULD be atrial fibrillation. More should be done to actually diagnose afib and diagnose it quickly instead of fobbing patients off with “anxiety”.
there is a real problem in that a lot of people only have paraxismol A/FIB. I suppose that surgeries could have a few Kardia type gadgets that they could lend out for a week or two but they do not appear to have funds to do so. Unfortunately people would have to have a mobile phone as well.
Quite a few people do suffer from anxiety in these troubled times
The cynical part of me also considers the amount of money pharmaceutical companies make in anti anxiety drugs 😏
you are right of course.
Actually it is hard to get real anti anxiety drugs -Benzos- these days as even the most useless GPs know they are addictive and hell to withdraw from. Instead they dish out anti depressants which can actually increase anxiety in some people and also can be hell to withdraw from -but that 's not acknowledged so much.
Always a problem for those with Paroxysmal AF because episodes would rarely occur to order. At least now there a number of gizmos available so patients are able to present their own evidence for doctors to consider…..
A well written report 👏
This article is attracting a fair bit of attention from Telegraph readers on line where they are able to add comments. I’m not sure if it’s possible to capture these comments and post them on the forum but I will try this evening………
FindingCaradoc• in reply to
Not sure it’s a demographic I would personally find representative… 😊 - but any article that raises awareness has got to be good.
Interesting that she was actually gaslighting herself by asking the consultant “could it be the menopause?” etc. It’s like she’s internalised the medical gaslighting that many women experience when they’re told their symptoms are down to stress, PMS, menopause or whatever. So we end up doing the same to ourselves and what’s really bad about that is that lots of women put off seeking help or give up advocating for themselves when they encounter that attitude.
Spot on. I was cross with her when I read the article yesterday.
Good article to raise awareness. How impressive to get to the point of "it's one of the best things" so quickly. She's clearly very resilient.
If AF is “one of the best things” etc, I dread to think what a miserable life she must have been living until AF struck!
she hasn’t got it all the time so she can still run 5k and thinks all she has to do is stop drinking coffee and smoking 3 cigarettes a day and she will have it under control. She will wake up eventually and realise what an unpleasant thing it actually is and how nothing really changes it.
Sometimes you see people post on here who believe/hope that they’ll be the one who will defy the odds with a few lifestyle tweaks and make AF disappear forever. They want to return to a time before when it had never happened. I suspect she’s in the stage of denial where she hasn’t really processed it yet. Unfortunately we can’t just sing-song away reality. If AF wasn’t caused by coffee it won’t be cured by giving it up, and if that was all it took none of us would be here. I wouldn’t be too hard on her, all things considered. We’ve probably all been through a similar stage because we don’t want to be “one of those old people who take pills” and there’s a bit of a stigma around people with cardiac conditions that goes something like “you smoked/drank/ate/slobbed your way into this, so your problems are all your own making” and of course we’re going to think “well, I’m not like that”, and if we did buy into the fat slob myth then we probably do hope a few more kale leaves and and a new yoga outfit will do it
I was used to AF as my Dad was diagnosed in his 40's. Slim, relatively fit as he had an allotment and cycled to work. I was also in my 40's when it hit. I was slim, fit as a fiddle and very active. I had a good diet and knew that the AF was nothing to do with any of that. I've never had a dietary trigger. I'm now a blob. I look like a fat slob but that's because I'm miserable and inactive and stuff my face with sugar all day because I'm so sad. That's all due to the life I've lost thanks to hypothyroidism. None of it has made a difference to my AF. AF is a nuisance. Hypothyroidism is a lot of unprintable words and I hate it with all my being. I have no idea why I can't get the medications to work. I've spent 8 years and a lot of money on tests and specialists trying to work out what's holding me back. But I'm just getting worse.
I just feel very cynical when I read stories like that in the paper. She will learn, sadly. And when she does she will feel a bit daft having published that article.
As I’m now stuck in persistent, with only rate control, I’m under no illusions about lifestyle changes getting me back to NSR. I never really avoided things or searched for triggers when I was paroxysmal.
Main reason that I have stopped alcohol is that the meds are raising my liver enzymes. Plus trying to get a few extra pounds off - that’s so my ticker has less weight to haul up hills 😂
thankyou flapjack. Very interesting
Great Post Flapjack,I don't normally read the rags but once in a blue moon they are worth a look. Thank you.
Thanks Flapjack, enjoyed it. She doesn't say whether she had the Covid jab but apparently that has caused quite a few heart issues. No doubt that potential cause will become clearer when the data for 2021/22 is isolated and published to see any abnormalities from earlier years in the decade referred to by the BHF.
• in reply tosecondtry
As I mentioned in the recent post regarding John Campbell’s video on BHF statistics, when I was diagnosed back in 2014, many medically qualified speakers at our support group meetings were, even then, quoting figures not too dissimilar. We now get TV ads regarding Kardia and Apple monitors which must have made an impact on people’s awareness and therefore contributed to increased numbers.
I’ve no idea whether the Covid jabs have had an impact on AF numbers, nor do I know what the world situation would be like now had it not been for the Covid jab………
Gumbie_Cat• in reply to
I think that the watches and devices make a huge difference to diagnosis. I am fairly sure that my AFib had been going on for years, and yet it was never caught on ECG. So, I am an early 2022 statistic and it has nothing whatsoever to do with Covid jabs. More to do with my extravagance at splashing out on that Apple watch. (Yes, I am vaccinated and continue to take any jab that comes my way. Just got the pneumonia one, then next up is shingles when I’m 70. )
I agree I can remember after having my first baby while in the hospital they kept me longer because I was having heart issues then. They didn’t tell me that but they told my husband, that was 47 years ago. Being in labor is a stressful situation I am sure all woman would agree. Yet, no one ever suggested I see a cardiologist. I was young a stupid at that time for sure.
Goodness - even if they had told you afterwards, but just to tell your husband! I’m sure I read somewhere on here that someone was debating whether to take their husband to their cardiology consultation. To help remember things, take notes etc.
One person replied that they tried that, but the doctor spoke to the man instead of to her!
She's very blase about her AFib. As if, oh, it's nothing. I wish mine had been nothing. It also reads as if she hasn't educated herself on the fact that it's a progressive disease and I don't know, she definitely plays it down.
• in reply toMaryCa
Personally I think we need to accept that she is a journalist, used to conveying information to the public in a way which tends to be different than the rest of us tend to adopt. I have a number of friends and acquaintances over 70 who have developed persistent AF (who happen to be male) and they seem quite content taking their prescribed medication. They wouldn’t dream (unlike me), of pursuing any form of medical intervention and it doesn’t seem to affect their lives but as we know, from the comments we get on the forum, AF affects people in so many different ways……
Buffafly• in reply to
I have a number of friends who are the same, just take the meds, get on with life as well as possible. We are hearing from people with either extreme symptoms or a ‘fixit’ personality or both!
Must admit that I am moving on from ‘fix-it’, to take the meds and get on with life. I haven’t really got the choice now, as the EP has made clear to me. I definitely wasn’t blasé at first, but now…
I guess the other thing is, keeping moving and trying to keep the weight down. All the lifestyle things, and being alert to anything worsening.
I was doing plenty before AF happened. It’s not been a “wake up call” or any of that nonsense as far as I’m concerned. On paper I’m “low risk”. When my diagnosis was confirmed it was because of “age” because there wasn’t anything else they could “blame”. Why are we continuously being gaslit that whatever condition we develop it’s down to us living our lives wrongly in some way? She can keep her “wake up call”. I’d rather sleep in 😂
Oh, I certainly didn’t mean that. Just mean that personally all I can do is to make sure I keep active, despite the lack of energy caused by the medications/condition, and to watch my weight. (Always been a little overweight, but not by much.)
In fact, I feel like the algorithms acted against me being diagnosed. Always told that I was low risk due to low cholesterol, low blood pressure, normal blood sugar etc. So I wouldn’t have been offered anticoagulants when I was under 65.
The reason that I kept suspecting it is that it is so very common in my family, on both sides. I definitely don’t think that I did anything to cause it!
Oh don’t worry, I wasn’t taking anything personally. I know what you mean, and I do understand that people have some kind of life event that prompts them into making changes, sometimes for the better. It’s not that AF was anyone’s fault but sometimes people are forced to re evaluate their priorities when things happen.
That made me laugh. And indo agree about the culture of blame surrounding illness. Not just the medics either who are putting this about Good.health is not a matter of prowess.
I think the pandemic brought out this attitude in people even more. I’ve heard and people saying “the only people at risk from Covid are obese and out of shape” and that kind of attitude. The other side of that is that there are quite a lot of people, young women in particular who are not as healthy as you’d think due to their unhealthy relationships with food and exercise resulting in hypothalamic amenorrhea, low bone density, disordered eating etc. I wouldn’t blame them either as they are only responding to the cultural messages that they are bombarded with. It’s very much a visually driven culture that makes it all about appearance.
What a flippant attitude she has.
I thought it was quite an interesting article because it echoes what I have suspected having been recently diagnosed. And that is that all those menopausal palpitations can be a sign of something more sinister and should be followed up more rigorously. I certainly had loads of middle of the night palpitations which Dr Google suggested were completely harmless. Given where I am now, I beg to differ.
Beautifully written and one that should be prescribed for medical students.
Good article, when I went to my surgery complaining of palpations and strange fluttering in my chest, I had my BP and told it was anxiety and to take codeine, it took 2 further visits before an ecg was done
It is good to have a positive attitude, but Afib is not a good thing for most folks.
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