I had a thought earlier while discussing some of my health issues with my husband - I've posted quite a lot on here, and discussed how my heart hits 200+bpm and I've even recorded it a few times ranging from 250-300bpm during my episodes and I have not seen anyone else post similar. I need to go to see a new EP soon (one that hopefully listens and believes me this time, they have to really since now I have an EKG from the paramedics). My previous EP quite literally acted like it wasn’t out of the ordinary at all for heartrate to be that fast because of afib.
Everything I read says what my heart is doing is extremely dangerous.
I have a friend who hits high rates and she goes in and out of consciousness. It happened to me once and I struggled to keep conscious, when I called for help the paramedics who came were astonished because what the rate was in my wrist was nowhere near as fast as what my heart was really going.
Yes, I would very nearly pass out. It was actually what prompted me to call 911 the first time, I was doing the starting to fall over (while sitting down), things going black, with a sense of doom so strong I thought I was about to die. Each time though, I would do the thing they tell you to do as a kid when you play sports. If you feel faint lay on your back with your knees bent, it's an automatic reaction for me, I fainted once when I was a teenager and since then I waste no time when that feeling comes on. My heart would keep going but I wouldn't black out.
I'll attach two things from my episodes. The highest "average" I've recorded was my (second) episode at 224, which was before I was on beta blockers at all and about a month after I got my watch because the Drs kept telling me I was just having panic attacks and I knew they were wrong. 2nd highest was 201 - I've had 5 episodes of 200+ since 2019. The last one, in January, the paramedics averaged my heart rate at 218 on the initial EKG when they arrived.
In actuality I am unsure what the worst average would be IMO, because there comes a point that I can't do the watch anymore, because to do it requires that I cross my arm over to touch the lead while lying down. I can only assume the average is higher at those points. I try to enter a kind of meditative state when it happens, just focusing on breathing. It's beyond terrifying if I don't.
Sept 2019
in reply to
Here's the January one that I called the paramedics soon after.
It must feel weird and frightening to have this, goodness. The ECGs look like each beat starts regularly in the atrium from the SA node, with a "P" wave, which is NSR. Is that correct? Rates like this can happen during anxiety attacks, so, your EP isn't telling porkies.
I was wondering whether your doctor might have advised you to take a higher dose of your beta blocker? Have you ever tried something like diazepam to control the anxiety this would cause?
The hospital did when I went in January to 25 mg atenolol twice daily but I’m not taking that much because it destroys my daily life - no energy and depressed really while on that much beta blocker. I always have warning signs so I am basically PIP with the atenolol atm, though I do take 12.5mg every 2 days as it seems if I don’t I feel odd (probably still my body being used to the medication after 2+ years). Basically the warning is ectopics will kick up, then I start getting short runs of tachycardia, I have hours of warning each time - it’s never come on suddenly. I’ve been afib free for 3 months now. Getting the digestive issues under control + taking magnesium taurate seems to be helping a lot.y
This is quite the ecg!! Have you had a professional read this particular one? I can't see if there are P waves or not, the R's are so close together-it almost looks like the T wave from a previous beat is overlapping the QRS of the subsequent beat-I don't know if that's possible electronically! There appears to be a minor irregularity in the QRS sequences, but with a rate that high I don't know if that minor defect is significant (when I am in PAF, the irregularity is MUCH more pronounced!). I'm only an amateur at ecg observations, but would be very interested as to what a pro would say.
You poor thing, scary isn't it. I wonder if it was flutter you were having? When I had my one occasion I thought I was going to die. Came over sick and sweaty and as I said struggled to keep conscious. When it happens and it's so terrifying I guess we all think 'is this it'.
The paramedics took me to hospital, meanwhile asking me if I'd ever been cardioverted, and gave me metoprolol intravenously until it came down, got me to 150ish on the way there with 2 injections (5mg each I think?) , then another injection at hospital got it down to 120ish. I was still in Afib for a few hours but it stopped eventually.
That was exactly my scenario. I would be sitting down calmly minding my own business and wham, I would go out like a light. The first time it happened I had been walking with my group and enjoying a soft drink in a local pub. I woke up with my head in my friend’s lap. I don’t know who was more astonished, him or me!
I have heard of people reaching these rates, but it’s not common or usual. 180-190 was my worst and I couldn’t lift my head off the pillow without blacking out! I have heard of people with those sorts of levels and I think the danger also lies in how you behave - not a good idea to go out for a run at that HR level for instance!
My understanding is that sustained rates at those levels could be life threatening but that it’s not unusual to get the occasional spike so what is important is the average rate over 30 seconds. If you have data recorded by Paramedics I would insist that it’s not normal and see another EP.
I realized at my last appointment my previous EP wasn't really believing me at all. I told him my heart hit over 250 bpm and he told me something about the watch not being accurate. So I said, I counted the blocks and I saw up to 5 beats per second, and I told him, the paramedics averaged 218 on the EKG, and he said "oh - yeah, that's high" - so seems to me for 2 years he was just dismissing it as me being mistaken.
I think it is one thing to hit those high rates and another to average at them over a period of time. My average was about 140.
I remember one day, waiting at the bus stop and knowing my hr was high, I leant against a wall and did an ecg with my apple watch. It was averaging about 197. Fortunately, the bus came quite soon after.
Another time I was in the garden talking to a friend and it got quite animated and I felt my heart speed up. I went indoors and it was over 200.
I don't know that it did any harm. Since my ablation, my resting hr is about 62 and hr 75. Only very rarely does it go over 100 now.
Seeing that it is the ventricles maintaining the hr it probably shows that yours are in quite good shape. (?)
I am on atenolol but I'm on very little at this point, I take half a pill a day if I'm having ectopics, sometimes every two days. It saps all my energy and makes me depressed - I end up getting nothing done. I've been much more productive and active (which is also good for my health) since I lowered the dose. My last major episode was in January, last afib April 4th. I've lowered my dose of the beta blockers greatly at this point, I seem to have gotten my major triggers under control but I keep the beta blockers on hand as PIP for if I feel something may be coming on. I always have warnings before it gets to 200+ - usually for hours I'll have frequent ectopics and then if I start getting short runs of tachycardia I know I could end up in a bad one. I haven't had more than ectopics here and there for 3 months now fortunately.
Did that! 2 week Zio in December, highest recorded heart rate was 272, but it was only a short run. It actually said it only detected 30 seconds of aFib during that 2 weeks and deemed the rest SVT. I did not have an extended episode while the Zio was on.
I'm posting this mostly to hear if others experience it, because I feel like I haven't really seen anyone discussing heart rates at this level. I'm doing well right now, it's just curiosity.
I do worry a bit about stroke, and I'm somewhat surprised they never suggested anticoagulants. My EP kept insisting that stroke was a worry for when I'm older. I don't see why that is, it's not like you can't have a stroke young with this sort of thing happening. Can an anticoagulant be PIP?
As often said on the forum, we are not doctors, and I only have my personal experience as someone in persistent afib.
Have you been told you have paroxysmal afib ? And as mentioned above, heart rates can spike, and your EP doesn't seem to be concerned. But 272 is quite high even for a short period.
Personal opinion, I would get a second opinion from a cardiologist who is familiar and experienced with afib. Check references. Strokes can happen at any age and it seems you should be on rate control medication and an anticoagulant. An anticoagulant is not a PIP.
Yeah - paroxysmal afib with RVR. When it's ranging from 200-300bpm for a longer period, I certainly wouldn't call that a "spike". My longest it was in this range was probably less than an hour, but regardless it was sustained. I def plan to see a new EP, I lost all trust in my previous one.
After years of battling with AF and now having been told my only option left with drugs is Amiodaron and not wanting to take that because of its toxic effects and just recovered from a horrendous attack where I struggled to stay conscious, I finally agreed to go on the list for pace and ablate. It's my only option and just hope it improves my QOL. I know how you feel when that awful sensation of the world slipping away and although my heart rate does not appear to be as high as yours when it happens the feeling is the same. Hope things improve for you.
Thanks - yeah I noticed that when I had an episode at one point while taking 50mg of atenolol a day. My heart rate only hit 150 but it felt just as bad as when I hit 250. Wishing you the best in your treatments!
Glad you've posted. You're in the US? Can you change your EP if so. You need someone who's prepared to listen to you and look into what's causing these high readings- AF or flutter - abd then offer treatment options. Have you been assessed for stroke risk? You can do the CHAD VAS score yourself online I believe.
Hi thereYes, before I was officially diagnosed I passed out in the cardiology department as I returned my Holter. My resting bpm varied between 235-250 bpm both on my Holter and after they admitted me and put me on their ECG.
It was quite frightening at the time.
At the time they denied I was in Afib and said it was SVT (supraventricular tachycardia) but during my ablation for the SVT they realised I actually did have Afib.
SVT was what I thought I had at first as well, mainly because it was the only guess anyone mentioned during my first 2 ER visits. It was mentioned by someone in training that came into the room with one of the doctors , the doctors only mentioned panic attacks. 🙄 I want to thank that student though because were it not for him I would not have pushed through and demanded a referral to EP to get an actual diagnosis.
Yes before I had my ablation and now on flecainide bisoprolol apixaban I regularly went up to 240. Uncomfortable and scary. Now possibly I go about 168-190All the best to you
186h/b on Metropolol. I had profuse sweating and had to stop walking after stairs or elevations. I was very tired and would sleep immediately after an outing or exerting myself.
1 year 3 months after stroke with AF I asked for a cardiac specialist.
She changed me to Bisoprolol but I only dropped to 156.
Not controlled but Specialist had no concern.
I wrote and said that I had NO QUALITY OF LIFE. No reply.
Trouble is GPs don't know what to do. They will increase your meds.
Nor good enough so on Locum Doctors's advice I went to a PRIVATE CARDIAC SPECIALIST.
He put me on Calcium Channel Blocker Diltiazem.
180mg dropped me from 156h/b to 51!
I was taking some of the Bisoprolol as well.
I settled on a reduced dosage of both.
Night average is 47h/b.
Balanced at a.m.120mg Diliazem (360 daily dose - TOO MUCH).
and
Bisoprolol 2.5mg at night.
As on day 4, hospital was diagnosed with Thyroid cancer, a biopsy confirmed Papillary type.
I take 125mcg daily away from food so between 5am - 7am.
My Diltiazem an hour or so later
and PRADAXA 110mg twice day 1/2-1 hr later.
ADD Ons
constipation - if necessary 1 kiwifruit or 140mg COLOFAC with full glass of water. Around no food.
Flixonase - 1 squirt in each mostril for allergy (CT scan shows a cyst in the sinuses.
POLYGEL 4 times per day (no preservative) NO WET LAYER TO EYES. Failed the blotter test.
That's me.
The top number you have is not used but on monitoring they can give your average h/b.
Then you know whether you are UNDER CONTROL. That's most important.
Yes, once. When I first got AF (that I was aware of) I was fitting a very heavy exterior door into an existing frame in an old house for my son and new daughter in law. I worked on it all day, and had noticed by lunch time that I was not feeling too great or thinking too clearly. Eventually I had to lie down in the garden for a rest and that's when I noticed that my heart was doing something odd.
I had to finish the job, to make the house secure and weather tight, and eventually went to get a curry and a glass of beer around 8pm. By 11:30 that night I was lying in bed thinking I was about to die, and sent for an ambulance.
The paramedics said my heart rate was 280bpm when they first arrived (I was convinced by this time I was dying). They calmed me down and eventually walked me out to the ambulance, and took me to the hospital on blues and twos, talking to me all the way and trying to keep me calm.
This has never happened again in all the years I've had AF. My usual high rate is somewhere in the region of 175 to 180 bpm and rarely any higher than 190.
I put this down to self education, the purchase of my Kardia so that I can track what's going on, and the good influence of this forum which has convinced me that AF will not kill me. No more 'fight or flight' response to raise the heart rate any higher!
Fear and anxiety are built in to protect you from immediate danger such as being attacked by animals (or other humans!), not too good for a heart condition. "Fear is the mind killer" as martial artists (or tennis players!) will tell you. Don't let it happen.
Yeah I’m calm these days when it happens as well, I’ve come to understand it won’t kill me after having multiple episodes and talking with people on here too, but I also learned meditation. It’s a necessity to stay calm really. I’m sure my episodes would be much worse without it.
Also I wish I could say I was actually doing something useful like installing a door for my first episode 🤣 - but mine was watching YouTube on the couch with my son I felt strange sensations in what I thought was my stomach, then I was brushing my teeth getting ready for bed and I started feeling faint too. I sat on the bed, and it kept getting worse, sense of doom hit, at some point I realized it might be my heart and asked my hubby to listen to it, I tried to calm it down and when the feelings just kept getting worse I had him call 911. The episode ended soon after they arrived so they had us drive to the hospital rather than taking me in ambulance. I had no idea what was happening. I do think I panicked in addition to the afib during the first 2 episodes, because after them I had extreme tremors throughout my body. I have not had those happen since.
when i was in pain through my chest call 999 and the paramedics recorded 218 bpm i was blue lighted to cardiac ward at the hospital and was told supervetricular tacicardia and if he they could not stop it all my organs would soon start to fail i was later after drugs did not work given an electric shock of 360 jules , so get to the hospital
well that is what the cardiac doctors told me at the time, as they was having difficulty slowing it down with drugs and i believe them as i felt so ill that was back in 2003 but things have changed now but if my heart was going today at 200+it would be 999 without a dought
I’m in Scotland and a doctor at my medical practice gave me a formula for deciding on whether your heart rate is too high. It is 220 minus your age. You may already know this but I think you should seek medical advice and take control of your condition. Good luck.
I've had lots of experiences of 180+ but don't think I've ever experienced, or indeed heard of, people getting those kinds of heart rates.Sounds pretty frightening.
I really hope the medics pay attention and you receive treatment that can help reduce those rates.
Yes, in the early days of AF. My first encounter was 250+ and I pretty much collapsed, thinking I was having a heart attack.Since being on Diltiazem, highest has been about 180 and since doubling Diltiazem, odd blip just over 100. Scary when it kicks off though.
I'm on Diltiazem. It sometimes is problematic after long AF episode (am also on Flecainide fir rhythm control) but it doesn't make me feel tired. Quite a few here are on it for rate control
Your worry should be heart failure at that rate, stationary.
And you should invest $100 in your own bluetooth SnapECG device, or equivlent, asap. So you can record your heartrate on your phone.
I have mine from a Chinese company, but it does the job, has no extra fees attached, and I can save and forward the records to anybody I want.
That will resolve whether your bouts are supraventricular tachycardia of some flavour, e.g. flutter, or irregularly irregular AF. It's kind of fun, you learn something and it puts you more where you belong - in the driving seat. Not to worry you but, as you have read, some forms of SVT are not to be messed with.
In AF your LA fibrillates at 300-400 bpm, but most ventricles can't possibly keep up with that. So, they sort of hum the tune in a Humpty-Dumpty style, well behind the pace, and all over the shop, like me at Karaoke!
You seem to be a bit of an exception if you are recording that ventricular rate stationary!
Before I was diagnosed with LPAF a dozen years ago I had been told I had the 'perfect heart', Which need not be untrue. But that didn' mean it wasn't subject to paroxysmal AF!
I used to grip those rails on running machines and think 'How fit am I? Doing 220 bpm in a fastish 8km jog. 'That's the sort of rate you're supposed to deduct your age from to get your heart-rate max!'. I just thought I either I was really fit or the machine was up the creek.
Well, I barely started an exercise stress-test at my Cardios sometime later when I was in AF, and was just about to demonstrate my stuff when they stopped it because I was already doing 220bpm in a slow walk on a modest incline. They were worried to death I was going to peg out right there and then. Whereas, I was quite asymptomatic.
Same thing recently with another green GP who thought I might not make it through the night. Bless her!
But I have come close to passing out on a treadmill once. And I have also had a tough time coming back into sinus rhythm from AF whilst on a demanding walk. Which is no fun on your own, miles from anywhere.
I have also had a TIA recently. And I can assure you there is nothing obviously 'transient' about one when you're having it!
So, despite the alarm bells that medics know to display with AF to protect their own back, often as not, your predicament is like that photo of a lady with her arm around the neck of a white rhino. The caption says "Just because you survived does not mean it wasn't dangerous".
That's really high. The highest heart rate I ever got with afib was maybe 125-130. I don't think it's a good idea to have a heart rate that high and I would call paramedics or to to the ER ASAP.
I read a bit further down you didn't feel well with the beta blocker your doctor Rx'ed. Ask for another one! There are lots of different beta blocker meds, and while some may make you feel awful (I've had that experience), another one may be fine. You need it to keep your heart slower. Please talk to your doctor about this.
Hi there, yes mine goes off at an alarming rate and when I was first hooked up to monitors when I was first diagnosed, the cardiologist said to the nurses "take that down, I'm not worried about that!". My EP doesn't seem to be I er concerned either. Where in the UK are you? I can highly recommend my EP
Hello! We seem to have a lot in commun! I fainted the 1st time while walking in a park. My head was spinning, I lost consciousness, fell and got back on my feet few minutes later. I declined the am bulance the passerby wanted to call. I walked back to the car feeling my heart pounding . The next day I was admitted to the hospital for rapid afib, HR 110s. Few days later, as I was getting ready for a cardioversion, I fainted again, I was fortunate to still be in the hospital and on the heart monitor. I saw myself again losing consciousness, I even saw my HR on the monitor, around 270. I went into sustained ventricular tachychardia, vfib and cardiac arrest... You mentioned, for you it was SVT and no dangerous arrhythmia. I was fitted for a defibrilator and a pacemaker (my resting HR is 50) 2 days later. For cardiac arrest, an ICD (defibrilator) seems to be the standard procedure. It was 1 year ago. The ICD shocks me if I go over HR 180. I am on Sotalol 80g twice daily. I also have a monitor at home that records my pacemaker every night.
You mentioned, magnesium supplement. I changed my diet to add magnesium and potassium thanks to this wonderful forum. (Thank you Flapjack for sharing the Afib British association conference magnesium and potassium food chart). I have learned the hard way, stopping my beta blocker or decreasing my magnesium and potassium gets me back in Afib with HR above 180. But overall, I still have a very active life. I just don't ski anymore when it is too cold and don't garden in the afternoon in the summer heat.
What you speak of is what I worry about when my heart reaches those speeds. Very fortunate you were in hospital! The potassium and magnesium have helped me greatly as well. I actually stumbled upon potassium very early and started drinking daily coconut water back in the beginning, and trying to get it into me with foods as well. My blood tests the first 2 episodes when I had and went to the ER came back with my potassium at the borderline low end, so I gave it a try. I feel it has helped me avoid many an episode since. Wishing you well.
Hi, when I first went into Afib my pulse was 200, rang 111 who said go to A&E. At A&E they said I would have to stay in if they couldn't get my pulse down. Luckily dose of bisoprolol did it. So if it was me I would go and sit in A&E when it happened and also ask to see a consultant asap
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