Monitoring Your Biomarkers

[PlanetaryKim]

I am still working my way through the new book The Afib Cure by US electrophysiologists Drs. John Day & Jared Bunch. And I have to say, the chapter on "Biomarker Monitoring" alone is worth the price of admission.

This photo is their table of the "Ten Key Biomarkers for Afib". And they spend a good 2-3 pages discussing each one, why it's an important gauge of heart health and Afib risk, what numbers you are trying to achieve on each, how frequently you want to test until you reach the "good" number (assuming you are working on lifestyle optimization that will get you there), and then how often you need to test once you are in the good zone.

The Ten Key Biomarkers they discuss are:

1. C-reactive protein

2. Hemoglobin A1C

3. Thyroid hormones

4. Comprehensive Metabolic Panel

5. Lipid Panel

6. Vitamin D

7. Complete Blood Count

8. Homocysteine

9. BNP

10. High Sensitivity Troponin

Some of these you can even test at home with home kits that are available.

Since my cardiologist is useless for anything other than writing prescriptions, I am going to work with my GP to get these tests done so I will have a baseline. And then I will recheck down the road at appropriate interval to see if I am making the necessary improvement on any that need improving.

The chapter on Biomarker Monitoring is followed by a chapter on Lifestyle Optimization, which is all about what you can do/change in your life to get your biomarkers into range.

All in all, this is a very empowering book packed with great information that you can start applying to your life today. And very easy to read.

[Spangle14]

For some reason, my copy has been delayed 😒 I was supposed to have it by now. That does look very interesting and I would love to see it more in context of the book - hopefully it'll turn up soon. Thanks for the post, Kim

[PlanetaryKim in reply to Spangle14]

I hope your book arrives soon!

[jeanjeannie50]

Hi Kim

Thank you for sharing.

Do the authors of this book claim to have cured people with AF by using their advice and methods?

[PlanetaryKim in reply to jeanjeannie50]

They use the word "remission" throughout. And they say they have gotten "thousands" of patients off drugs and into remission - some but not all with ablation as well as all the lifestyle factors. But some by lifestyle alone. The word "cure" only seems to appear on the cover, for marketing reasons I guess. lol!

They call their approach "BLAST:

*Biomarker Monitoring

*Lifestyle Optimization

*Ablation

*Stopping unnecessary drugs

*Tracking wellness

But they do repeatedly say not everyone needs or gets an ablation in order to achieve remission.

[jeanjeannie50 in reply to PlanetaryKim]

Thank you Kim. Will look forward to more updates from you.

[LaceyLady in reply to PlanetaryKim]

‘Cute’, Interesting, I’m a qualified Complementary Therapist and if I mentioned ‘Cures’ I’d be shut down by the authorities!

[Elli86 in reply to jeanjeannie50]

As Kim says they never actually say anyone has been “cured” as they are well aware that the condition can return at any time. The book is full of success stories though and some people that even say they’re glad they got AFIB as it made them turn their life around for the better.

Superb book. Gives you a completely different outlook on AF. Positivity all the way 💪

[jeanjeannie50 in reply to Elli86]

Sounds an amazing book Elli. Have you read it all and are you trying any of the tips?

[Elli86 in reply to jeanjeannie50]

Yeah I finished it on Wednesday, just waiting for hard copy to come through for reference material. I already don’t eat sugar, smoke, drink etc since reading ive been going to bed/ getting up same time every night, have increased veg intake MASSIVELY to where it’s 80% on the plate, need to go back over a few supplements in the book that my diet is probably missing and need to get my bio markers done as well. The books full of information about AF in general though. Just giving it a second listen so it all sinks in 👍

[secondtry in reply to Elli86]

Re going to bed the same time, not often mentioned here but I think sticking to routine strictly on almost all things helps to 'press the reset button' after being diagnosed with AF. Once stable, more variables can gradually be re-introduced.

I like the sound of this book, I certainly enjoyed the one Day did on Longevity.

[Elli86 in reply to secondtry]

It’s a great book 👍 definitely rams home the importance of being strict with literally everything when you have AF

[Hidden in reply to secondtry]

Oh bugger I am dreadful for random sleeping 😬

[Hidden in reply to Elli86]

That's how I feel about my flutter...a little leprechaun in my chest who kicks me in the heart when I lament taking care of myself. Lol! Same with my arthritis! Little alarm bells in my kneecaps telling me I should NOT have had that big plate of sugary crap! Beep beep warning!!unacceptable item in the bagging area!!!

[Hidden in reply to jeanjeannie50]

I would recommend the book. Some of the suggestions you will already be familiar with, but there should be plenty of new ideas, e.g. fasting. I would think it would improve the symptoms of a lot of people even if it didn’t put them into remission. Basically it puts a lot of ideas into a workable package for someone with AF. You can get it in Kindle format or even as an audiobook.

Reply

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[jeanjeannie50 in reply to Hidden]

Thank you Sam.

[Ianp66]

Brilliant recommendation thanks Kim, Peony said it was a good read, I'm working my way through the audible as of last week, certainly food for thought. Thanks for the heads up 👍

[Elli86 in reply to Ianp66]

Thanks for recommending it Ian 👍 most important book I’ve read in a long time if not the most 😃👍

[Ianp66 in reply to Elli86]

Was Kim's recommendation and thanks to Peony mate I got it, some cracking content hasn't it 👌

[Elli86 in reply to Ianp66]

Yeah it’s top notch mate! Just the info I needed 👍

[DutchCloud]

Thank you Kim for this good advice; 📚🇳🇱

[Elli86]

Superb book Kim. I finished it on Wednesday and am now relistening. Need to get a hard copy so I’ve got the reference material. Going to be getting all my bio markers done ASAP also. Great book with great advice and I agree it definitely gives you a positive outlook on the condition.

I’m ready to kick some serious butt now I’ve read it 💪💪💪

[PlanetaryKim in reply to Elli86]

I feel the same way upon reading this book - ready to kick some Afib butt! haha!

[Elli86 in reply to PlanetaryKim]

They’ve got a really positive outlook on it all. I’m convinced now it can be “cured” and you can be completely drug free providing you catch it early. Even then though with a successful ablation you can still be drug free if all goes to plan. 👍 great book! Very much needed right now in the world of prescription drugs

[LaceyLady]

I can’t imagine getting my GP to do these once let alone regularly. I wanted a calcium and vitamin D test and got fobbed off.

[Elli86 in reply to LaceyLady]

Show them the book and I’m sure they’ll come round to it? I find the younger gen in our gp are less stuck in the mud and open to new ideas! 👍

[LaceyLady in reply to Elli86]

I’m afraid all they look at is their budgets. They like to put you on anticoagulants but won’t test your bloods clotting ability. I got told ‘we don’t do that’ . My thinking was, if you have the propensity to bleed, anticoagulant would make you worse.

[secondtry in reply to LaceyLady]

Yep, sounds like my surgery too. I have to use an Alternative Practitioner to route the really useful tests through, which of course is not inexpensive!

[LaceyLady in reply to secondtry]

I’m a Complementary Therapist of 22 years.

[Auriculaire in reply to LaceyLady]

There are tests that work for DOACs but they are complicated and probably expensive and have to be done at specialist labs. One of the marketing drives for switching people to DOACs from vit K antagonists was dumping blood testing.

[LaceyLady in reply to LaceyLady]

Recently been put on anticoagulants without my consent and now you should see the bruises 😡

[PlanetaryKim in reply to LaceyLady]

How did that happen without your consent? Sounds terrible. and unethical.

[LaceyLady in reply to PlanetaryKim]

I ended up in a&e, sadly diagnosed with type 2 diabetes. I was just given the drugs without explanation.

[PlanetaryKim in reply to LaceyLady]

If my GP is not willing to do these tests, then I will go to my Integrative & Functional Medicine doctor. But visits to him cost me some money, so will try my GP first. However it will definitely be worth it to get a baseline on each of these biomarkers.

[LaceyLady in reply to PlanetaryKim]

I have private health scheme but have an excess. I already pay my Consultant cardiologist £120 for a consultation. I am a Complementary Therapist and

Try acupressure , biomagnetics, Reflexology. Consult a osteopath that isn’t covered by my health scheme. Have a masseuse. I don’t understand why you’re just given drugs without trying to find a possible cause. I get nothing much out of the NHS.

[PlanetaryKim in reply to LaceyLady]

I know. It astounds me too. Medicine these days is entirely protocol driven. Logic and critical thinking have been abandoned. Most doctors today seem to have no interest or even ability to investigate root causes, or to identify and correct underlying imbalances. They are just interested in managing symptoms and protecting selves from lawsuits. Especially where afib concerned. If you present with afib, then cardiologists go one of 2 paths: drugs or ablation. They do not even seem capable of having discussion re: triggers, underlying causes, vagal vs adrenergic. Every cardio I have spoken to believes once you have afib you will always have it, unless you ablate. - That afib cannot be reversed. They take the adage "afib begets afib" as inviolate. When in fact, it is merely a TENDENCY that afib begets afib. Lifestyle changes can unwind that and reverse that tendency.

[LaceyLady in reply to PlanetaryKim]

Ablation and cardioversion have repercussions. Having trusted a consultant eye specialist and had replacement inter ocular lens implants that are defective 10 years ago and can’t get any legal redress, I am reluctant to trust anyone to zap my heart when you don’t get the full story.

I do though think the electrical system misfiring can be impossible to ‘fix it cure’, terms that are used when they shouldn’t. As a ComplementaryTherapist of 23 years cannot say as I would be taken to court.

I’m really not happy with anticoagulation also.

There may be possibility to manage the condition, but to do that, we need co-operation with our medical practitioners 🤷🏼‍♀️

[CDreamer in reply to PlanetaryKim]

Actually I think doctors are interested in finding other ways but they are fighting budget restraints and beaurocracy and government and big pharma with very influential friends as well as a lack of knowledge and education or resources on ‘how to’ implement along with a reluctance by us patients to change what does us no good. Eg:- Our surgery had a GP wanting to start a free clinic on managing chronic pain without meds - 1 person turned up.

[Hidden in reply to CDreamer]

Christ. I'd love to have that clinic here. the pain clinics just basically tell people don't mix your heroine and parecetomol ...zero alternative to pills. I hope he kept it going anyway for that one guy I'm sure more people showed up the next week!!

[PlanetaryKim in reply to CDreamer]

You have got the ideal GP & clinic, CDreamer. While I really like most of my doctors these days (not cardiologist), none of them seems at all interested in exploring ideas or treatment strategies beyond protocol. It's like their minds can't work that way, and they all come back to: "why wouldn't you just want to do the protocol? it's been tested/proven etc?" So in other words, no ability at all to treat individuals--just statistical averages of large cohorts from studies.

[secondtry in reply to CDreamer]

We need more champions of integrative medicine, if you truly believe it works and is the right way then you persevere until you get there; it takes a long time but rewarding, I started promoting Social Farming aka Care Farming in the South East 13 years ago and despite considerable expansion most still have not heard of it, in the meantime thousands have benefited.

[Singwell in reply to PlanetaryKim]

Critical thinking absent - you said it!

[DizzyD in reply to PlanetaryKim]

Totally agree with you PK NHS docs do not investigate the cause of any medical condition. They treat the symptoms only with meds which I am strongly opposed to. All of my heart problems (hypertension, AFib and enlarged heart LAD) are massively attributed to me being over prescribed levothyroxine for over 30 years causing me to have medical induced hyperthyroidism. A year ago NHS endocrinologist literally informed me, that due to me being over medicated for so long this had caused my heart issues. So I have found the CAUSE of my heart problems. Now here I am trying to reverse the AFib issue, hence I look forward to reading the book mentioned above

Not surprisingly, I now treat (self medicate) for my thyroid issue. Benefits from this is: BP normal, cholesterol gone from 7.4. to normal, pre-diabetes gone from 4.5 to normal simply by self medicating to treat my thyroid issue. Despite, the massive benefits mentioned, GP is not happy that I self medicate. He is concerned about arrhythmias (AFib) but I am not. Unlike myself, GP is not looking at the whole picture..they never do.

Doctor's get too caught up blaming a person's lifestyle in many circumstances

[Elli86 in reply to LaceyLady]

Finding a possible cause is NEVER on the cards. They just want to get you out as quickly as possible. There are some decent docs out there who are at least open to certain things but they are hard to find. I’m going to bug the hell out of them till they give me the tests.

[Hidden in reply to Elli86]

Long, long time ago, there was a suggestion in a post, that the cause of AF may be the disturbance of "energy meridians" of the body, so being invisible, so to say "non-existent", and very poorly understood by the modern medicine.

[LaceyLady in reply to Hidden]

Check out the Vagus Nerve! I’m on a FB group, interesting, I’m not sure I gel with the author but.... you’ll find me asking questions I don’t get answers to 😁

[PlanetaryKim in reply to LaceyLady]

What is the name of the FB group about Vagus Nerve, LaceyLady?

[LaceyLady in reply to PlanetaryKim]

Found this:

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articl...

[Spud12345 in reply to LaceyLady]

Is this a book? And does it have to do with defining vagolyctic a fib? I believe that is what I get infrequent at 11:30 pm never during the day

[LaceyLady in reply to Spud12345]

Found this: ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articl...

[LaceyLady in reply to Hidden]

Kirlian photography photographs the meridians.

[CDreamer in reply to PlanetaryKim]

Because we have an Integrative Lifestyle GP in our practice who tries to push as much as they can through the NHS as they no longer have private practice, I have most of these tests done about every 12 weeks but not the full metabolic panel, just kidney, liver, glucose, and not the sensitive troponin and the BNP. If AF makes a reappearance though I will ask for them now!

Nearly all of the GP’s in the practice are now onboard with patients who are proactive about their health and wellbeing but even so they need a reason to order the tests although I have paid for some of the tests myself but you need GP to order a blood draw so they do need to be on board. I’ve found that the younger GP’s are much more proactive and more into nutrition and wellbeing and testing but sometimes restrained by budgeting restraints.

[PlanetaryKim in reply to CDreamer]

Sounds like you have a very forward-thinking clinic. I wish all health care providers were onboard with proactive patients.

[CDreamer in reply to PlanetaryKim]

One GP trained to attempt to resolve their own health issues. They have influenced the rest of the team. All very interactive with the community and gave talks on various subjects covering all aspects of Lifestyle Medicine - which is often very misunderstood and most of speak mostly of Nutrition but our two doctors both emphasised that tackling stress and sleep were best places to start. Before COVID our two Lifestyle doctors, one is NHS Consultant, managed to get into the local hospital to talk to the staff. Interestingly, the most resistant body were the dieticians.

All it takes is one NHS doctor in any area to start getting results to influence those around them. There is now a network of Lifestyle Doctors working within the NHS but like everything else, COVID has stopped or limited a lot of their activities.

[secondtry in reply to CDreamer]

I suspect a lot of dieticians in the NHS are pushing the wrong things such as low fat; following westonaprice.org conferences in London a few years ago now I buy full fat organic pasture fed.

[CDreamer in reply to secondtry]

Exactly! I am still astounded at just how many people still believe that low fat, low calorie ‘foods’ are acceptable! I spent a night in a B&B a while ago, pre COVID, where everything on the table was low fat, low calorie - I literally couldn’t find anything to eat and when I asked for fresh fruit I got a very weird look. I went out to local store and even there it was difficult to find.

[LaceyLady in reply to CDreamer]

I’ve never believed in low fat theory. I had to do Anatomy & Physiology, obviously not to a GP’s standard, but to a standard that was needed to practice Reflexology and other modalities and expected to do CPD.

[Auriculaire in reply to CDreamer]

I blame BigAg 's nefarious influence!

[CDreamer in reply to Auriculaire]

That as well....

[LaceyLady in reply to CDreamer]

You’re lucky. I hadn’t had a registered dr since mine left. The surgery were deliberately not transferring patients to other GP’s in the surgery, I’d asked and was fobbed off. I had to demand a transfer to a Specific GP quoting a letter the practice managers had had only a week before from the BMA I think it was. Hey presto, granted last September. I’ve yet to get to know her.

[CDreamer in reply to LaceyLady]

I realise I’m incredibly lucky and fallen on my feet here and give thanks and appreciation every day, especially when I read posts similar to yours! Our practice is recognised as ‘Outstanding’ - location now a closely guarded secret.

[LaceyLady in reply to CDreamer]

🤣🤣 I was just going to ask

[CDreamer in reply to LaceyLady]

Exmouth, Devon.

[Hidden in reply to CDreamer]

That is bloody amazing. Kudos to your doctors there they sound like they give a crap and are actually interested in medicine!!!

[belindalore in reply to PlanetaryKim]

That is such a big problem. I don't seem to be allowed to be involved in my own healthcare especially since being on Medicare. And many orher people face the same thing on other insurance. It just shows how insurance runs everything and dictates to Drs. Some Drs will try to get around the insurance but they are few and far between. When I tried to get the cardio Dr to consider more and better testing he blew a gasket and shook his finger at me. Lucky I kept my cool. He's just pills and procedures. Asked him about the vagus nerve. He said they didn't bother with that. I wonder if he even knows what it is. Lol. And Drs wonder why we go to these forums and do our own research. We are doing what they SHOULD but WON'T. Sad.

[PlanetaryKim in reply to belindalore]

My cardio also got impatient and dismissive when I originally tried to discuss vagus nerve with him and when I asked for more tests to identify possible causes or underlying imbalances that could lead to afib. These guys are totally useless except for pills and ablation. They truly believe there is nothing to be done for afib exept manage it with meds or try to end it with ablation. In their minds there are no other paths... afib doesn't just go away, they believe. Yet it absolutely can be reduced, and for some eliminated ("remission") without pills or ablation. I am so disgusted with the lot of them.

[belindalore in reply to PlanetaryKim]

I wish the Drs everywhere were more proactive with their patients. I think the big reason they aren't in the USA is because insurance companies rule over them more and more. It's sad that we have to do our own research. We do what the Drs SHOULD and DON'T do.

[FancyPants54 in reply to PlanetaryKim]

So do I! Mine looks bemused when I present my own test results for my records. I'm pretty sure the copies I give him never get onto the system. My biggest issue is thyroid (persistent AF is OK for me, I hardly know about it most of the time, but thyroid is ruining my life) and I get no help at all from the surgery other than he will run the tests my private endocrinologist asks for and did give me quite an expensive medicine for insulin resistance.

[Hidden in reply to CDreamer]

I was lucky to get 16 different tests done...with only three vials of blood as well...I wonder if the doctor really did them or just made to results to get rid of me. Lol.

[belindalore in reply to Hidden]

Did you get copies of the results? If the Dr can't give you copies then you may be right. He wanted to be rid of you. Lol (Not really funny though).

[Hidden in reply to belindalore]

I did ...and it had high (can't remember now the letters but means could be dehydrated) and high two other things...and she didn't actually do any iron test but said my iron was fine and everything was normal...and two of through high things ...potassium and the dehydration one can be a cause for palpitations... So I don't trust the woman as far as I can throw her. My mom said they usually take loads of vials and my friend had 8 vials taken for less tests...but then every lab is different. I have to laugh or I'd cry. The illusion that anyone is driving the bus is long gone... Lol!

[belindalore in reply to Hidden]

You are so right! I'm the same. Gotta laugh at these Drs. At least you did get tests even though they ended up useless for you. I just get basic labs and we all know those don't tell anything. 🙄I wonder what these Drs grades were when they graduated med school? Or did they send off for those diplomas you get in the mail!?!😂😂😂 You take care.

[Hidden in reply to belindalore]

Well the only guy in my class who used to get As and teachers would say " you could be a doctor" was the kid with brown streaks on his pants and we never played with him. Poor kid. And if he did go on to med school the lack of sleep during his formative years would have damaged His brain by the end of med school. As I recall as well at university the med students were the ones taking vast amounts of cocaine and pills bragging about having exams in the morning...we didn't play with those guys either. Lol! Guess they get their own back eventually!

[belindalore in reply to Hidden]

Yes. They were usually the nerds who stood in the corner of school dances. Yes poor things. I know a guy back home in Kansas where I'm originally from (live in Florida, trading tornados for hurricanes 😳). He wasn't really a nerd but he did some pretty heavy drugs. But he actually turned out okay and has a family practice in a small town and a nice family. He does well but he was never after the big money like some Drs. A rarity. I agree with you. I think and hope that these so called Drs will have to be judged when they leave this earth. I tell people I believe God has a trap door at the pearly gates and if you don't "pass", he hits the switch to that trap door and down you go. 😂😂

[Hidden in reply to CDreamer]

You are very fortunate- very few like that now hereabouts, sadly!

[Hidden in reply to LaceyLady]

Exactly, and as I wrote to the authors, I have never been overweight, have always eaten healthily, only smoked a very little many years ago, have given up the very small amount of alcohol I used to have and used to exercise regularly until a bout of shingles led to gradually increasing fatigue which was exacerbated by the drugs I was prescribed for AF. Sadly, though the authors ask for readers to write to them with their sotries, they do not even acknowledge emails and neither has the publisher who also asks for feedback! Guess they only want praise for people who had poor habits previously!

[waveylines]

Sounds a fab book. Am going to order it to see if it can help me. Thanks. Homeosteine levels are also raised when b12 is low. You absorb b12 less as you age and one of the symptoms of low b12 is palpitations among many others as low b12 affects multiple body systems. I doubt I can get all the tests done by GP. They've done some of them but hoping you can order them online through private labs like Blue Horizon.

[PlanetaryKim in reply to waveylines]

I am going to look into which of these tests has reliable home testing kits I could use in Canada. But I guess I will first see which ones a doctor will order for me. And some of the tests I have had done recently.

[Hidden]

I’m reading the book at the moment. I would say that just about everyone would gain something from it. One of the interesting recommendations is *fasting* from time to time. The only thing which I wasn’t too keen on was the material in the first three chapters where they talk about the risk of damage to the brain from AF- but I suspect that the intention was to shock the reader into action. I’m going to monitor all of these bio-markers. Overall, I would strongly recommend this book.

[PlanetaryKim in reply to Hidden]

I was a little alarmed by their brain damage/dementia information too. But as you say, I think these 2 doctors really want to motivate us to do lifestyle optimization. And that certainly gets our attention! lol!

[Hidden in reply to Hidden]

I felt my brain was damaged... I couldn't think...I kept going blank ..memory was shot...I've only been taking magnesium for a few weeks and the other day I was so happy because I remembered Alan is moisettes ironic lyrics all the way through one verse! I was literally going to the kitchen for a spoon forgetting what I was doing forgetting what a spoon is called just staring at a wall totally blank not even remembering how to remember anything...and as the heart got worse the brand did too...I figured it was lack of oxygen getting to my brain..and if you think about it that's probably the single most important thing. Three minutes without oxygen your brain is dead. That's not long. So hours of less than enough has got to be damaging. That is what scared me into action when I realised what was going on. I've been deep breathing as well ...I started basically hyperventilating at night and opened the window wide open and just if I woke up with heart going mad I would deep breath for a while. It helped my legs feel less like heavy weird sore achey as well. It is scary but I do think its very true. It certainly felt that way for me.

[Hidden]

Very interesting, still waiting for my copy (from Amazon), can't imagine I would get my GP to test for all that but I'll try !

[Mrsvemb]

Thanks for sharing Kim. I have just ordered the book.

[secondtry]

Thanks Kim, really appreciate it.

[saulger]

Thank you for this, PlanetaryKim. Must check all the above.

[Browncoat]

Thanks for posting this...it's sealed the deal for me! I have just placed an order.

Is your GP happy to get the various blood tests done? I can imagine mine would send me away with a flea in my ear if I asked!

[PlanetaryKim in reply to Browncoat]

I have not asked my GP for these tests yet. But I think when I explain why I want them as a baseline so I can track my progress on lifestyle optimization to end afib... and that I am making progress already... I think she will go for many of the tests. And If there are some she won't order, I'll go to my Integrative & Functional Medicine doctor for the rest. But visits to him cost me a bit of money.

The one I would REALLY like is Red Blood Cell Magnesium. But that is not readily available, or funded by system. I'm not sure it's even done anywhere in Canada. But that's the magnesium test we need to have approximate idea of magnesium level in heart muscle tissue. Our serum magnesium that is normally tested only accounts for 1% of magnesium in entire body and does not really tell us what we need to know on that score.

[AussieHeart in reply to PlanetaryKim]

Are there more than 10 biomarkers as Red Blood Cell Magnesium wasn’t listed in your earlier msg. In Australia and hope to access this book!

[PlanetaryKim in reply to AussieHeart]

They don't list red Blood Cell magnesium as its own biomarker - I think because they assume most people don't readily have access to that test, and they are trying to list biomarkers that we could conceivably get our doctors to requisition for us. SO they include magnesium (serum magnesium test) in the Comprehensive Metabolic Panel (#4). And they tell us somewhere that Red Blood Cell magnesium would be better test to get if we can arrange it.

[Hidden in reply to PlanetaryKim]

Isn't the red blood cell test testing serum? I read that it tests the serum left behind .... So I thought that was probably what I had had. My levels were midway between normal but I had taken about 4 tablets the night before to stop my heart going mental and I thought it should be high. I will keep taking them anyway since they seem to be working wonders for me. But it would be nice to be able to get tested for things. You can't really get tested here unless your gp decides they want you to. Even privately you need a referral. Gp Gate keePers. I was also reading about vitimin d and how it affects hearts use of calcium and diabetes insulin levels ...I had bene taking a high dose but I have stopped until I can get some vitamin k to go with it in case it was them causing a hyoercalemia affect which would cause some issues. Maybe I was taking too much more than nessiary.

[CDreamer in reply to Hidden]

The serum level of Magnesium is always the last to show decline which is why red blood cell or muscle biopsy is the preferred test to show magnesium levels.

This blog describes the process of how magnesium is used in the body. If your serum magnesium is low then you are in very big trouble, very quickly.

blog.insidetracker.com/magn...

[PlanetaryKim in reply to CDreamer]

Thanks for the link! I suppose even if serum magnesium is normal, we could still be low in muscle tissue where it counts for us in terms of Afib. My doctors look at my electrolytes and always say "your magnesium is fine". But they don't seem to comprehend that the serum magnesium is no indicator of what level i have in heart muscle cells. I am goign to see what it would take to test RBC magnesium in canada.

[CDreamer in reply to PlanetaryKim]

Your Functional Medicine Doc should be able to advise. It’s easy to find a lab to do it - harder to get a blood draw without doctor’s ok I found.

[Hidden in reply to CDreamer]

Well mine wasn't low it was midpoint bit considering I had taken four mag tablets the night before....they couldn't tell me what that would do. I think it would be well worth paying for a test if I can because I feel like its defo an issue. And my gp sucks. I need the same for my iron cos the Dr said my iron was fine but hadn't done any kond of feritin test. I guess she saw my platelets were fine and thought her iron is probably OK.if she thought anything at all....but i had done a finger prick iron test and my mom...the best test....pulled my eyelids down and said I looked anemic...lol...so ya know that's pretty substantial evidence of anemia in my book.

[Hidden in reply to PlanetaryKim]

Hey I just clicked on this link and realised its in Canada so no good to me but maybe for you didn't look into it but might be of some use...dynacare.ca/specialpages/se...

[Auriculaire]

Very few GPs order HA1C. If they bother testing glucose they rely on fasting glucose which is a mistake as this is often the last thing to go up when a person is on the road to type 2 diabetes. This can be got round by buying a glucose metre, lancets and strips at any pharmacy and testing after meal glucose at 1 hr and 2 hr. This shows how the body is handling various foods and you soon get to see what foods cause sugar spikes and can modify your diet accordingly.

[PlanetaryKim in reply to Auriculaire]

Is it hard to lance self? The thought gives me shivers. But I would like to be able to test myself that way.

[Bluesometimes in reply to PlanetaryKim]

Hi Kim

Thank you so much for your info on the Afib Cure; I have sent for it.

Self lancing sounds a bit medieval ; the kit includes a pen which regulates depth and intensity of the 'prick' so honestly not a problem.

[PlanetaryKim in reply to Bluesometimes]

thanks for the info!

[Auriculaire in reply to PlanetaryKim]

Piece of cake. The meter comes in a pack with a "pen". The lancet is a very short needle mounted in a piece of plastic that fits in the end of the pen . The "cap" goes over it , you put this against your finger and you push a button on the side of the pen which makes the needle come out through a hole in the pen top. Then you transfer the drop of blood to the strip you put in the machine. The only problem is how often you do it. The "injections" make tiny bruises on your fingers which I have noticed are far worse since I went on Apixaban. I usually do an intensive testing twice a year - fasting , post prandials at one and two hours after each meal and sometimes pre meal as well. I use up a couple of tubs of strips. So a week to 10 days. By the end my fingers are a bit sore. You are supposed to change the lancet each time which I don't bother to do. For diabetics this would be more important because of infection but having a slightly blunted lancet probably makes the bruising worse . I have been doing this for 10 years now. My fasting blood glucose is more often than not between 100 and 110 and sometimes just strays into the prediabetic range but my PPs are ok. Only the breakfast ones are higher than I would like but they are well under the normal ranges given for diabetics ( which according to Jenny Rule at Diabetes 101 are too high). I have noticed that they have gone up since being on meds.

[PlanetaryKim in reply to Auriculaire]

thank you for all this info.

[FancyPants54 in reply to PlanetaryKim]

It's easy. I do them all the time for thyroid. I cringe a bit but once the ping sound is heard the lance has done it's job and you can fill your tube.

[baba in reply to Auriculaire]

My GP (UK) tests my HbA1c with my other yearly blood tests.

[Hidden]

Nice. I had blood tests of everything normal...but had high potassium and high dehydration marker... And pretty low magnesium considering...does he talk about electrolytes metabolites... I also took a horrific drug that can stay in your system and fuck with your calcium channels which can also mess up your muscle contractions... And heart. I must take a look. It sounds very interesting. And we all have to figure these things out ourselves cos doctors don't even semester interested in the mysteries of the human body these days. Just robot scripts handed out.

[PlanetaryKim in reply to Hidden]

These authors have a couple of pages on Electrolytes. Other Afib books have more. Lone Atrial Fibrillation: Towards a Cure has 3 pages on magnesium alone, and quite a bit more scattered throughout the book.

These authors of The Afib Cure say: "The two most common reasons we see people with low electrolyte levels are either they are eating an electrolyte-depleted diet or they are taking a diuretic medication... Faithful adherence to the holistic approaches for beating atrial fibrillation discussed in this book may completely eliminate most people's need for diuretics."

And they urge people to eat foods high in electrolytes - spinach, bananas, avocados, butternut squash for example.

[Hidden in reply to PlanetaryKim]

Oh brilliant I think I will get some books about but because I'm only kinda making it up as I go along from bits and pieces I'm reading here and there. I don't take diuretics but I do drink diuretics like tea and coffee and I often don't drink water. I've started drinking hot cocoa ..it has magnesium and I can't stand drinking cold water when its cold outside... And a bit of Cayenne pepper ...its quite a soothing drink. And I've bought some pumpkin seed butter and still taking my mag tablets but it would be nice to get it naturally too. Thanks so much its a fascinating thing the old body. !! Wish my gp was as intrigued by my goings on as I am lol!

[PlanetaryKim in reply to Hidden]

We do have to learn about these things on our own it seems. Doctors not much interested in nutrition and lifestyle optimization for better health.

[Elephantlydia]

I have ordered the book,I look forward to reading it with an open mind.Thank you for letting us know about it.

[CDreamer]

Just a note on Biomarkers - I am also half way through reading the book and just got to the chapter on Biomarkers and just looked up the UK equivalents for A1C which the book says keep below 5.7 - the UK uses a different measurement and the equivalent looks to be below 42. My last test showed 41.

Just thought worth a mention.

[Bluesometimes in reply to CDreamer]

Hello

We use the AcuCheck home testing kit which uses the measurements system where under 5.7 is recommended; similar to the one Auriculaire talks about.

[CDreamer in reply to Bluesometimes]

That’s fine but on my NHS record it’s calculated differently and I had to look up the reference ranges my GP works with so thought worth mentioning. I know the lipid numbers are also different to the US standards. My last test was 01/02/2021.

[Pigleywigley]

Ordered my book on 20 Feb from the big A! & still not arrived yet must be out of stock in UK. I have a blood test booked on 14 Feb so will take with me what I need to have. My haemoglobin was borderline last time.Anyone use private blood testing for all of these?

[waveylines]

Does it matter why type of magnesium you take? Magnesium upsets my bowels so found I can only tale it intermittantly. I did try a spray for the skin but its very sticky not pleasent. Any suggestions welcomed!! Keeping my b12 at top end and going gluten free has helped but not the answer for me. In my case the damage is from cancer treatment so I suppose miracles are out but any improvement is most welcome!!

[PlanetaryKim in reply to waveylines]

I personally take magnesium gylcinate (when I take it). That is supposed to be a well absorbed form that does not cause bowel upset. But I have lately gotten worried about magnesium's ability to bind to some other medications, supplements and even nutrients in food if taken in same time frame, and reduce your absorption of those things. (It's contraindicated with tetracycline and some other antibiotics for this reason.) I have no idea which drugs and nutrients this applies to, or whether my 200 mg cap of magnesium is enough to have that effect. So I have stopped taking it and would rather try to get it dietarily. The Afib Cure book authors also encourage trying to get as much as possible dietarily.

[waveylines]

Thanks am with them about diet. Seems I need to eat more nuts and avocado!!

[PlanetaryKim in reply to waveylines]

me too!

[waveylines in reply to PlanetaryKim]

Cashew nuts and advocado are high in magnesium........ 😀🤗

[PlanetaryKim in reply to waveylines]

I like both cashews and avocados. Do tend to eat them daily anyway, Will keep them n the line-up!

[Seawalk]

Thanks Kim and thanks to all the comments, I’ve ordered the book!

[FancyPants54]

I'm in too poor a way thyroid-wise to cope with anything else. What do they say about thyroid? Do they talk about the likelihood of AF with low T3 as well as high? If they do, I might be tempted with a copy just to read that chapter. But if all they say is that high thyroid hormones cause AF then I'm way ahead of them on that and I won't bother.

[PlanetaryKim in reply to FancyPants54]

They do mention that underactive thyroid can also increase afib risk. And they mention that people in the high or low end of normal for thyroid hormones can be at increased afib risk - even without being out of bounds on the hormone. So far in what I have read, their advice is to stay on top of the biomarker monitoring of whole thyroid panel and and correct any imbalance (with pills presumably) to keep everything as close to centre of normal range as possible. There may be more on thyroid in later chapters. Or maybe someone who has finished the book can add more.

[FancyPants54 in reply to PlanetaryKim]

They are aware of it then. That's good. Our UK doctors are not. You don't have to be out of range either, as they seem to say. I monitor a lot of those things anyway on a regular basis for my thyroid treatment, but I'm convinced my persistent AF is hormonal, at least to some extent. When I take a dose of T3 medication (which I have to buy as NHS won't prescribe it most of the time) my heart rate calms down and I feel calm. Yet they try to tell me it will kill me!

So far I've managed to get my thyroid results to the 40% through reference range area. Still much more work to do. But at least I'm seeing some results of my new treatment now rather than totally out of whack results of of the past few years.

Thanks.

[PlanetaryKim in reply to FancyPants54]

I'm glad you're seeing some progress! And that is quite something that T3 med calms your heart rate. Seems like a pretty clear hormonal link there.

[FancyPants54 in reply to PlanetaryKim]

I am being really slow and careful with it. But I do think it's linked.

[Mugsy15 in reply to FancyPants54]

It's not quite true to say UK Doctors aren't aware of Thyroid abnormalities causing AF, Fancy Pants - after reading the book I asked my Cardio Nurse Practitioner to go through the tests I had done when I presented at the QE hospital Gateshead with AF last year, so I knew which I could tick off and which I needed to ask my GP to do. My Thyroid function had indeed been tested. There is an apparent difference in approach though - the book advocates Thyroid Panel testing, which covers TSH (Thyroid Stimulating Hormone); T3 (Triiodothyronine) and T4 (Thyroxine). In the UK, they test for TSH first, and if that is normal they stop there because the other 2 readings will be normal if this one is.

There is, however a test in the book that she had no knowledge of; the one for Homocysteine, which the authors say is a 'dangerous Amino Acid' which can cause AF. I'm going to ask my GP if he has any knowledge of, or access to, this test.

Other tests I've been able to drop from my list are the last 2; BNP and Troponin. These are routinely performed on anyone presenting with chest pain or other heart symptoms at A&E as they are markers for heart failure and heart attack. I've had both done in recent years and there is no appetite to test for these again now as other tests show that I have neither condition.

[FancyPants54 in reply to Mugsy15]

My cardiologist knows nothing about thyroid. He's taken to cribbing me for answers.

And there you have it, right there, where you said "In the UK, they test for TSH first, and if that is normal they stop there because the other 2 readings will be normal if this one is." Absolute nonsense. This is why so many hypothyroid patients in the UK are left bed bound and crippled by a disease their doctors just don't understand and aren't prepared to learn about.

TSH is a pituitary hormone, not a thyroid hormone. The thinking is that if your thyroid hormone is low then the pituitary will detect that position from the blood and send out TSH hormone (thyroid stimulating hormone) to poke the thyroid gland to make more T4 and T3. But there are many reasons why this fails. A pituitary tumour will stop that process. Central hypothyroidism where the thyroid just ignores the TSH completely and the gradual destruction of the thyroid gland with autoimmune thyroid disease. Then there are those of us who can't convert T4 storage hormone into T3 active hormone for some reason. Usually an inherited genetic defect in the diodinase enzyme pathway. This is my issue. The more T4 I take the worse I feel because it can't convert to T3 reliably.

To say the TSH test is the gold standard thyroid test, as the NHS tries to do, is about as useful as saying "you can't have cancer because I can't see it". At best it helps to warn of potential issues in the early stages, but once a patient is on thyroid medication the TSH is a red herring and the reference range is too high anyway so GPs get patients into the reference area and declare them well. Having a TSH of 4.5 is very different to a TSH below 1. And regardless of the TSH if the patient is taking Levothyroxine and can't convert it to active thyroid hormone TSH won't show this.

Thousands of thyroid patients in the UK have to do their own private blood tests to ensure they measure TSH, FT4 and FT3 at the same time. GPs don't even seem to realise TSH has a circadian rhythm and will tell you that you can have your blood taken any time of day and not to fast and it's fine if you take your meds first. All of which is wrong. So no. Being told your TSH is fine is not a reassurance that your thyroid is in trouble I'm afraid. As far as GPs or cardiologists go, I've not met one yet that understands that low T3 is as much an issue for atrial fibrillation as too high T3. Which is what I was talking about. But it is a problem. And it makes the treatment of hypothyroid patients worse because of the lack of understanding.

[Mugsy15 in reply to FancyPants54]

I bow to your vastly superior knowledge Fancy pants!I have little to none and merely reported what my Cardio nurse said when I asked about getting the tests done.

[Chrissy7]

This is great info ... But well over my head so I guess I’ll have to buy the book and start doing some research. Very interesting information Indeed! Thank you Kim!

[PlanetaryKim in reply to Chrissy7]

I'm not too familiar with some of these tests myself but have had most of them at one time or another in last couple of years. Not for afib monitoring but for other health reasons. So at least I now know what markers to track if I am not making the progress I want to on my afib reduction strategies (which are going well at moment, but who knows what future holds?).

[LaceyLady]

There are lots of Complimentary Therapists, who are dedicated to their patients and willing to try to help people. You do need to look at their Associations to find a good qualified therapist and word of mouth. Acupressure, Acupuncture, Reflexologists.

[Hidden]

Brilliant! This is just brilliant! Thanks so much for sharing! Imma look for it asap!

[Hidden]

I must have seen this before but not looked at properly at all cos I've liked and commented and totally forgot there was a book! Christ my memory is so bad!

[PlanetaryKim in reply to Hidden]

hahaha!

[Elephantlydia]

Thank you for bringing to my attention “The Afib Cure “ book by Dr John Day and Dr Jared Bunch.It took some weeks to arrive as it had been out of stock due to demand.It is invaluable for anyone with Afib or indeed if you have a loved one with Afib ,and want to give them the gift of more good years of life.If you consider the title of the book sensational,then they do qualify this by saying the National Cancer Institute consider cancer to be “cured” when a patient goes five years without a recurrence.If you apply the same standard to Afib,then they can tell you the stories of many people who have been diagnosed with Afib and have indeed been cured.Certainly in my opinion a must read for all Afib people and their love ones.

[PlanetaryKim in reply to Elephantlydia]

It is a fabulous book that is also very empowering for the patient and gives us much hope - legitimately so, I believe.

[Hidden]

Snookersteve recommended the book and I said I’d be interested if it did not assume that everyone was overweight, smoked, drank and didn’t eat a healthy diet- but sadly it does! I have never been overweight and used to be very active and exercised regularly until a bout of shingles led to increasing fatigue. I only smoked a very little for a short time many years ago. So I am very disappointed with it- especially as at the end though they say they’d like to hear from readers they have not even acknowledged my emails! I’d be interested to know how one could get a surgery in the UK to test for the bio markers - I’m going to have a blood test shortly but only to measure magnesium and potassium levels as I have been prescribed a proton pump inhibitor having developed acid reflux which I never had before! Guess it’s part of old age as I’m 77!