Not promoting any book or diet, I dont sell anything. I just got this book by american MD Dr Dean Ornish. Back in the 1980's( I think) he did a study showing how lifestyle changes, primarily plant based diet can stop or reverse heart disease, such as clogged arteries. None of my many docs push plant based. Even my progressive integrative doc doesnt suggest I drop meat. He is all about veggies, not so much fruits due to sugars. Anyway, I am going fo seriously study this book mostly because medicare here has now agreed to pay for Dr Ornishs 9 week program which involves a lot of education, twice weekly meetings, big committment to exercise, meditation etc. I think if our financially strapped medicare system feels it is worthy, it must be. Unfortunately his closest program is a state away but I can tweak my life style to mimick it minus the support group part.
plant based diet: Not promoting any... - Atrial Fibrillati...
plant based diet
Would like to know how to access the program please. Thx
you can get on line ...ornish.com
let us know if you get in to one of the programs, sounds like they are expanding here in the US
And it wouldn't surprise me if local or online support groups spring up for so many that can't get to centers offering the program.
I would b interested
Me too. I believe there are many ways people learn. For me I like reading and learning on my own. I never liked group projects in school. I always learned more and did better on tests when I wasn't forced into a study group!!! And I love online sharing. We can move at our own pace, tune out people who we may not resonate with, there's no wasted time, infighting over ideas, and we don't have to carry people who don't pull their weight.
I would join an online group. Also I like checking out books before I buy on amazon.com because they let you peek inside the book. I can get an idea if this book (writing style, info) will work for me.
I just took some time to read some amazon reviews. They are mixed. What I did get was the impression that if you can work with just having the book the information is there.
One thing caught my eye. A reviewer mentioned Dr Ornish offers a Quick Start plan that allows frozen dinners. One thing I have learned about healthy nutrition, esp those of us with Afib, is that cutting out as much added salt as possible seems to be the 11th commandment. I really believe this is key and the way to do it is eliminate ANY processed food. This would include frozen dinners.
If anyone knows what frozen dinners are truly low sodium please share because I have never found them.
Interested in others' opinions on the reviews on amazon. Also one reader complained Dr O. overpushes his program. I don't have a problem with this as everyone has to make a living and good knowledge and information is worth paying for. It sounded to me as though there is complete information available for those that just want to use the book.
And one person complained he didn't mention specific vegetables to eat. I see this as a plus. When I see an eating plan that gets too specific with food (eat spaghetti squash for lunch on Monday, eat green beans for dinner on Tuesday, you get the picture) I start obsessing on the need to do exactly as the author says or face failure. But that's just me.
Overall I liked the reviews I read and will probably buy the book. One poster had to return her kindle copy as it seemed difficult to use. I actually like hard copies of non-fiction, self-help books because (shock! horror!) I like to write in my books.
IMO, worth looking up the amazon reviews and see what you think. I also think the fact that program sites offered are not that plentiful yet is not necessarily a bad thing. I probably would choose to skip the trek, parking, a class with people I didn't click with.
With a book I can get comfortable in my recliner, read and make notes without distractions.
Thanks, Hoski for this info. I didn't know he had a new book or about medicare financially offering support.
I remember Dr Ornish, who is well trained and brilliant, being laughed at and denigrated by many peers when he first began to talk about his plant based diet in the 70's. Well, there is enough proof now that he was on target back then.
I also like that he never, in my opinion, has tried to cash in big time with people's health and nutrition problems. His info has been middle of the road sensible-no fads and he freely shares his info so anyone who can afford the price of a paperback can access his knowledge.
I browse the net and listen to many short youtube videos from many professionals touting their version of healthy eating but I've noticed one thing many have in common is this.
Their videos hook you with just enough info to feel hopeful their plan might help. But the specifics of how to follow their advice correctly leaves out crucial information that can only be obtained by spending money on their site to fill in the knowledge gaps.
Dr Ornish doesn't seem to do this. I am going to look for his book and may order it. I like a middle of the road approach and frankly, am tired of wading through so many, sometimes bizarre, tips that I know I will not follow through on.
I have a new goal for my healthcare. It occurred to me I'm spending an inordinate amount of time every day, sticking to routines; take these supplements, drink this every morning, eat this every night before bed, add (these herbs and spices, to all your food, etc.
It's exhausting. And never mind all the money this costs. I am even beginning to resent money spent on supplements as I'm not convinced I'm getting what they market. One example is how many supplements which may have value are capsuled in soybean oil, which is very inflammatory, not to mention can smell rancid when the bottle is opened.
Good health has to be simpler and less time-consuming. This pill has to be taken so many hours away from that one. It's like a chinese puzzle trying every day to do everything correctly. I'm tired of it.
Too much of my day seems to be spent on trying to deliver perfect healthcare to myself. Maybe Dr Ornish's ideas can restore some sanity to this whole healthy living process.
xx irina
.
I agree. I too am growing weary of the many supplements, and $$ they cost. If and when I consistently eat at least 75% plant based, I will kiss many supplements goodbye.
It would also be interesting if we knew which pharmaceutical companies many of our docs own stocks in and are piling up funds for a very nice retirement!
I am tired of all the supplements also. I eliminated a bunch that I was taking and after a couple of months, I don't feel any different (they were suppose to give me more energy). Everything in moderation
Thanks for sharing that. I take all the thyroid and a-fib recommended supplements and to tell the truth I'm not sure how much better I feel, And I wonder how much they contribute to my chronic, usually mild, under-the radar-abdominal discomfort. Fillers)
And just like Prescription drugs they really are a moneymaker for their companies.
Has anyone noticed when articles appear (esp in women oriented magazines)and a supplement starts to become 'in vogue' the price goes up?
Please don't think I buy these mags! My guilty secret is I peruse them in the checkout line in the supermarket; yes and also the National Enquirer! LOL
Here in the US, supplements aren’t regulated like drugs as they are considered nutritional. So you don’t know for sure what you are getting. Since Ive added Vit C and turmeric, I get more indigestion, not sure which or both but seriously considering stopping both.
I can not take turmeric. I have no gall bladder and was told not to ingest it. I tried a cream.....I didn't notice a difference.
Hi D. Telling you not to use turmeric because you have no gallbladder is interesting. Maybe another example of the diversity of medical opinions.
I had my gallbladder out over 2 years ago and I cook with a ton of turmeric with no problems.
My favorite food is Indian (have an Indian ex-husband) and frequently cook Indian and combine my own spices for curry powders. I would miss it if I couldn't eat it. Not only in homemade curry mixes but it is so anti- inflammatory,
I do leave out some of the spicier chilies.
🐱 irina
My wife has really bad osteoarthritis. She swears by the turmeric and says it makes a world of differnce. She takes 3 x 800mg capsules a day.
What a coincidence- yesterday I listened to him interviewed on a podcast
Hi HosKi,
As you know Dean Ornish has been setting his agenda for very many years, particularly in the U S A. Like many visionaries....James Lovelock with his climate change theories being one.... he was laughed at initially, but his message has stood the test of time,and been expanded by others. ...
Here in the UK the Anglicised version of How Not to Die by Michael Greger MD was published in 2016 by Pan, and builds on Dean Ornish's
work. It looks at how a plant based diet can help in much of our ill health
I have been a half hearted...pun....follower of a plant based diet for some years having a green vegetable phobic husband to cater for..who also enjoys meat. However I have now given in and prepare two different meals. ..mine currently being totally plant based with athe addition of very little milk and butter. I can only say that I have no reason at all not to continue.. I have also lost weight , which previously I have previously found extremely difficult not being too much overweight initially.
Our sons and their families have also moved in this direction quite independently of us, being in their 40s and living some distance away. M y G P is aware of this and supports. I wish I could remember where I read recently that a very senior cardiologist In the UK is a vegan.
I'd encourage your further investigations into this diet and assess the benefits for yourself. Best wishes.
Thankyou so much! I am preparing two diff meals half the time now as my husband is a die hard( pun) meat, potatoes, sweets guy. I just need to take the plunge. Your post is very encouraging.
Another resource is Dr Caldwell Esseltyn in the U S A, plenty of information about his regime books , family etc etc on the internet. See what you think! Just had pasta with courgette/zucchini , tomatoes , pine nuts and a very little cheese for lunch in a 'bistro' ,really enjoyed it. Like anything else old habits can be broken... I believe it is said the first three weeks are more difficult then the change becomes second nature. Hope you find your own rewarding way forward.,
Thankyou!
This book is great and his research has shown to reverse heart disease and other chronic illnesses that have now been show to be caused in a very large part to the western diet American's eat. One recommendation I would have is don't wait for his program or book to start eating more plants. Going to a full plant based diet is something worth doing but is a very big evolution for many people so to start (today!) just eating more real whole plant based foods. Stop or cut back on processed foods and replace them with whole fruits and vegetables. I went fully plant based about one year ago and watched my cholesterol drop by 30 points. Also if you want to learn more and have access to Netflix you can learn more by watching two very well known documentaries called "What The Health" and "Forks Over Knives". It's scary how we have been led to believe that our only source of protein is meat and we need meat to survive. If you eat a lot of processes foods and meats you will see benefits to going to a plant based diet in your cholesterol, blood pressure, glucose levels and other areas of your life. It's a huge change of lifestyle for some so just I suggest to just try to fill your plate with more whole foods. Try it for a month and see how you feel. Best of luck to all on a healthy lifestyle!
Thankyou so much!!! 3 yr ago when a fib entered my life, I went from daily fast food, diet cola, no water, sedentary to only fast food might b a salad, no soft drinks, minimal processed foods. Im much healthier BUT need to commit more fully. If I lived alone, no problem. Back in the 1970's when I was single and a self proclaimed " hippie", I did go vegetarian for a few years. It was easy. My husband of 41 yr is not the least bit interested in healthier choices. Funny( not funny) thing is he appears healthier than me!!!
Anyway, I know I am respondible to follow my beliefs and my heart and I know this is something I must get off the fence post about. Ive lost 40 lb and need to drop 30 more to reach bmi of 25. Your suggestions are spot on! Thanks for the encouragement, I am going to do this
Thatsso great! Just take it a day at a time and if you make mistakes dont beat yourself up. Jyst “begin again”. My daughter got us into plant based eating when she was living with us and helped us alot. Its harder if u go solo. I know we have friends who are so against eating healthy and they seem to think we are attacking them when we eat well in front of them. Some people feel threatened but this idea but you just need to think about yourself. Perhaps like my daughter your cooking of plant based meals ( which I have found to be more tasty than the chicken meals we were eating before) will rub off on your husband over time. If not just do this for you! Its really important to your longbrange health. Again best of luck!!!!!
💜
Dr Ornish was one of the few to step outside the box of drugs and he was very sucessful,, I wish we had more Dr's prepaired to take on big pharma.
Sadly in recient times farming is big buisness and rapidly gaining corperate control, owned by huge corperations like Monsanto, they are doing as much lobbying as Pharma to get the consesioins they want to make it cheaper to produce, if more and more toxic.
When government are prepaired to change the meaning of "Organic" to apease corperate entities what level of deciet will they not stoop to!
I believe the only way to get around this is start digging in the dirt, grow something and eat it.
I believe you are correct.
Sounds like a really good idea. Forks over Knifes is also another plant based program. Evidence to help with heart issues. I am working with a cardiologist in Melrose Ma with this one. Take care and may God Bless have an afib stress free day.
Thankyou💜🥦🥕🥬🍏🥝☺️
Thanks! Just ordered a copy from the library...there is one person on the list ahead of me. The program is not in my state either, but might spend a summer where the program is offered if the book seems beneficial!
Im just on page 49 of 506, lol. But I do believe this info to b lifesaving as based on evidence from past studies and our skeptical government willing to pay for it!
Dr Ornish is part of the Physicians Committee For Responsible Medicine (PCRM) as is also Dr Greger whose site is nutritionfacts.org and recently wrote the book How Not To Die, I love him. Personally I was already a strict vegetarian and went vegan and now trying to do mostly raw vegan
wow that is impressive! Do you mind sharing the changes you have experienced since switching your foods?
well at 80yo other than AF I feel extremely healthy and walk daily and hike often. I am 100% vegan but I don't use fast food vegan crap. For us older folk Mimi Kirk who is 80yo herself has great info on raw and her site is youngonrawfood.com if you need encouragement
thankyou! I will look her up.
Well worth while looking up drmcdougall.com for masses of plant based information. Dr McDougall was a practicing doctor, has written many books including "The Starch Solution" and has an incredible website full of information about his vegan life style. His way of eating is starch based and filling.
I've been thinking along plant based lines too (I love prime rib!) But... It's very compelling.
Look up "Forks Over Knives." This is a plant based diet, book, and movie you can watch and it is VERY compelling. They also have a werbsite with a meal planner that one can subscribe to that assists you in moving to a plant based diet.
Trailer - youtube.com/watch?v=O7ijukN...
and from the website forksoverknives.com/the-fil...
website forksoverknives.com/
Review s:
rogerebert.com/reviews/fork...
evolvingwellness.com/post/m...
commonsensemedia.org/movie-...
rottentomatoes.com/m/forks_...
I've triued a few of their recipes such as sweet potatoe tacos and they taste amazingly good. Check it out. My wife and I are moving in that direction and will probably sign up for their subscription plan as it helps you schedule, purchase and prepare your foods in an efficient manner.
Thankyou for the info! I wish my hubby was even a little interested. I find myself making two meals, and when I give him the food he wants, I almost feel like I’m giving him poison. It’s really conflicting
It's his choice of course. MAybe you can make a deal with him to try every other night hace the plant based meals. Could also offer a carrot (something he really likes) as a reward for trying it.
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