Teeth

[atrialfib]

Let me get this right, my gums are receeding big time because I have crowns for years, need 're doing, every year or two abscess, could all this be the cause of AF?

[BobD Volunteer]

You have AF. What caused it may never be known. Too many people add two and two and make five. There is some evidence that gum or tooth infections can infect the heart but it is usually a far more serious matter than AF.

AF needs a predisposition which can be genetic or acquired ( over exercise, binge drinking etc or NSAIDs). Any inflammation can exacerbate the problem but it would be a brave person who said it was the cause. Don't beat yourself up about it as there is nothing to gain and lots to loose that way.

[atrialfib in reply to BobD]

I just wonder if I sorted my teeth out would my AF go?

[Hidden in reply to atrialfib]

It's very important to your overall health and particularly heart health that you are free from oral infections. As Pete says do look at jeanjeannie50s post relating to dental treatment.

Sandra

[BobD Volunteer in reply to atrialfib]

It may help your general health and that may help your AF.

[Aph-12_mpt in reply to atrialfib]

Sorry, I very much doubt it I think AF has nothing to do with your teeth.

[jeanjeannie50 in reply to Aph-12_mpt]

Not normally it doesn't, but if like me you had a symptom free infection in the root of a tooth it may well. Also who knows what any infection, in the body, that goes on for a long period of time can do. There have been many reports talking about the connection between bacteria in the mouth affecting the heart, you can Google it and see.

I had trouble with a tooth about 12 years ago (around the time my AF started) and two dentists at different times tried unsuccessfully to root fill it. The tooth hurt slightly for many years after that but eventually the pain subsided. In February of this year my dentist noticed a red spot on my gum and x-rayed the tooth and told me that the tooth had to be extracted because of infection in the root. I was amazed because I had no pain whatsoever in that tooth, but he told me if it didn't come out fairly soon I risked the infection spreading to my jaw and then I would know it was there.

The tooth came out and then 10 days later my AF disappeared and for the last 5 months I've been totally AF free. I feel healthy again for the first time in years. Regulars on this site will know how I suffered with my AF having 3 ablations and many cardioversions. I could never go more than a few weeks without an attack and those attacks could last for months. I can tell you they left me quite disabled and unable to do much or walk far. My EP had told me earlier this year that there was nothing more they could do for me and that for some people ablations don't help and I was one of them.

Tooth out and now AF FREE!

Jean

[mincde in reply to jeanjeannie50]

Great news and I hope you stay AF free!

[RetaMay in reply to jeanjeannie50]

I agree with posts relating to keeping an open mind. I rarely post, but read all most days and I would like to say that I have been "oil pulling" with coconut oil for three years now and the dentist is amazed and tells me to keep doing what I am doing. Might not assist AF, but a healthy mouth just could effect your overall good health. I started liquid magnesium and have been AF free for nigh on three years now (cardiologists not interested). I was told last week, you've had AF that makes you an AFibber. Anything that doesn't hurt you and is cheap is always worthwhile I think. Keep posting JeanJeannie, positive outcomes can give those suffering a lift and a tiny light at the end of the tunnel.

[jeanjeannie50 in reply to RetaMay]

Morning RetaMay, interesting that you too have cured yourself. I also use coconut oil as a mouth wash if needed and gargle with it if a sore throat or cold threaten.

Your post is inspiring too. May I ask what liquid magnesium it is that you use. I found magnesium taken orally made my stomach sore, so I now use a powdered form in the bath and have a spray.

Jean

[RetaMay in reply to jeanjeannie50]

Not too sure if I can say online Jean, but I'm in Oz and I order it from USA from Caroline Dean. I make it with much more water in a 2L glass bottle and just drink it through the day. Take it on holidays with me, never miss a day. Marls

[jeanjeannie50 in reply to RetaMay]

Thank you.

[Sunshine89 in reply to Aph-12_mpt]

To Aph-12_mpt: Even if you have doubts why not err on the side of caution.

[RichMert in reply to atrialfib]

Probably not.

[jeanjeannie50 in reply to RichMert]

See my post above.

Jean

[RichMert in reply to jeanjeannie50]

To my knowledge, the only documented potential cause of AF via dentistry is through Amalgam fillings. If you have a lot of fillings made from this mercury based product the breakdown of the filing into the blood can cause AF. I am not a doctor, this is only what I have read.

[jeanjeannie50 in reply to RichMert]

Please don't close your mind to new ideas. After my experience I personally think infections could well be a major link to the cure for AF. Like a lot of other members on this forum I welcome new suggestions as to what could be the cause of AF. See Meadfoots response below.

Jean

[Hidden in reply to jeanjeannie50]

Jean,

Some minds will be closed. I have no problem with this concept and have often read of links between dental health and heart health. It's like some people don't understand how my diet/ food intake changes can stop my AF. Sadly, I can't recall the source material now.

Hope your AF stays as under control as mine has.

John

[jeanjeannie50 in reply to Hidden]

Glad to hear you're keeping well John.

Yes, we are all entitled to have different outlooks on cures for AF and everyone has a right to their own opinion. As you know I too changed my diet and am still gluten and lactose free. Also stick loosely to the Fodmap diet. Doing my best to cut down on sugar now.

Stay well.

Jean

[RichMert in reply to jeanjeannie50]

I gave up trying to find a trigger. Every time I thought I knew what it was, the next time I ate or did the same thing, I was ok. I think the biggest problem is that the trigger could have happened prior to birth or soon after. I say that because most of us have suffered from AF for some time before it is actually diagnosed, that makes finding the trigger difficult. The consultant suggested that we are all prone to AF from age 65 onwards (it got me at 48). This would suggest that we all have the same defect or there is something in the water. I suspect there is something in the water.

[Bagrat in reply to RichMert]

That's me re huge amalgam fillings. Years ago there were theories that if they migrated into your jaw they caused M.S However if left alone ( like asbestos) they cause little trouble I believe.

[Sunshine89 in reply to atrialfib]

Fixing any issues with your teeth is not a specific cure for anything in particular but it is a proven fact that dental care plays a very big part in a person's overall health.

[pottypete1]

You will find jeanjeannie50 's post of a few months ago,related to teeth, will be of interest.

Pete

[Polski]

Teeth and heart are very closely connected - so yes, there could well be a connection. So sorting one may well help the other, but it is unlikely to stop the AF completely!

[jeanjeannie50 in reply to Polski]

How do you know this?

Jean

[Polski in reply to jeanjeannie50]

I'm not good at remembering precise physiological details, so please check, but my understanding is that a major artery (or vein?) goes straight from the teeth/mouth area to the heart, so any poison from the one goes immediatley to the other and then gets pumped round the body. This is why tooth problems eg an abcess, can lead to septicaemia, and so should always be taken seriously.

I went to the doctor once saying I thought I had a virus which started the day after a visit to the dentist (with a problem tooth), but that I felt as though I had just been in hospital for a week! She was just about to dismiss me, when she connected the two and gave me a stong antibiotic, saying she sympathised with tooth problems. I had a lot more courses of antibiotics before the problem was finally fully diagnosed and dealt with.

AF seems to be sensitive to any other problems in the body, so, with this close connection, it stands to reason that tooth problems could be a source of increased AF. I'm about to start a course of treatment to deal with just such, and hope the AF will be less by the time I've finished!

[jeanjeannie50 in reply to Polski]

Polski, sorry I think I must have misread your first post unless you've changed it. Going mad I think! I agree with all you have said.

Jean

[notkidding]

I agree with Jean, apologies in advance for the long-ish post.

Definitely worth seeing if one's tooth and gum health affects their Afib.

The traditional medical community relies far to much (only) on "studies" which are almost always funded by large pharmaceutical companies; hence there are few/no studies for supplements, as there is no money in it for the pharmaceutical companies.

Ablations are very profitable - for physicians, hospitals, etc. - surgical Afib interventions and have no standard as a "fix", e.g., "Afib-free for 'n' months". One ablation doesn't work? Have another, and another ...

Drugs, supplements, ablation all treat symptoms, not cause. Afib has a cause. Given the complexity and interactions - chemical, physical, systemic - within the human body, finding the cause of Afib is very difficult.

So - each has to decide if looking for and addressing the Afib cause is worth it.

The net is that one owns one's health, and has the ultimate decision on how best to proceed, given the available information, risks, etc.

[meadfoot]

I certainly would not dismiss teeth and gum issues out of hand. Anything causing inflammation is counterproductive to the body. I was speaking to a chap in hospital who was awaiting cardiac surgery. His consultant refused to operate until the dental hospital had sorted out his teeth saying the chance of infection was far too high to operate.

So why not impact on af, who knows. Once upon a time renowned people thought the earth was flat and would accept no other truth when challenged. Well we all know how that turned out. Look at all possibilities say I that's the way research brings cures. Time will tell. Remember how kids had their tonsils taken out at a rate of knots, any throat infections lets whip out the tonsils. Now they do it rarely.

[teach2learn]

I have, in spite of diligent and exceptional dental hygiene, a tendency to deep pockets around molar crowns, as well, but no infection because of what I consider a bit of a miracle drug: chlorhexedine gluconate 0.12%. Rinsing with a teaspoon of that cures everything from the occasional mouth sore to gum disease. Requires a prescription here in US, but works wonders.

[Coco51]

Since reading Jeanjeanie's post on dealing with a tooth infection I have had my teeth rechecked and they seem fine. But it set me thinking about other infections and AF.

My AF became persistent 24/7 a few months after I got a painful infected sebaceous cyst on my back which needed antibiotics for 3 weeks before it was lanced and cleared. The antibiotics triggered stomach inflammation and gastritis not helped by the daily aspirin I was then taking for my paroxysmal atrial fibrillation. So lots of inflammation going on. I was prescribed omeprazole and after six months of that the stomach improved but that's when the AF got a grip. (I have since read omeprazole can sometimes deplete magnesium).

This summer just before my second ablation the cyst got infected again. Luckily with antibiotics it cleared in time for everything to go ahead, but devastatingly I am still getting episodes of AF 3weeks after after this latest ablation. So now I am determined to get this cyst removed. I'll let you know if it makes a difference.

[jeanjeannie50 in reply to Coco51]

Interesting post of yours Janet, it would be amazing if by having your cyst removed you were cured.

By the way, I thought my teeth were in perfect condition and I hadn't had any problems for many years. My dentist only discovered my tooth was infected in the root after he noticed a small red spot above it and did an x-ray. I was having no problems with it at all.

It would be so great if AF could be stopped by getting rid of body infections. Make sure you let me know if you find yourself cured.

Will keep my fingers crossed for you. Good luck.

Jean

[Coco51 in reply to jeanjeannie50]

Jean, I will certainly let you know. I have had two sets of Xrays on my teeth by two different dentists so I guess they are OK. But the cyst is quite sore and I am on the list to have it removed. So let's see!

Janet