Embr wrist cooler for hot flashes

[spencoid2]

As I mentioned previously I used my micro fridge to test the theory of cooling your wrist to reduce hot flashes. I only put my wrist on the cold plate after a flash had begun. I thought about buying one and if it worked fuck the absurd price if it did work This is such a small market only millions of women and how many men. It is understandable that they would need to charge $350 for about $15 worth of hardware.

So my next step is to use a n $8 dollar peltier junction cooler made for pc microprocessors. The one I ordered has a heat sink on it on the hot side but peltiers can be run the other way too. So when it arrives I can make a little thing to velcro it on and can control it with a simple variable voltage supply. I can also reverse it if i want to heat instead of cool.

Once I try it I will have an idea if it does anything or not. Then if it does I could add precise temp control for about another $10.

If it works at all I would like to see what it does for others. This would be a $20 to $40 investment depending on what stuff you have lying around and what my test results show. It mightwork just fine on a 5 volt phone charger in which case it would cost almost nothing other than the peltier module for $8.

If anyone wants to try one I can buy a bunch and share them. If there is a hope that it really works I can build and share a more advanced one. This would be a simple Arduino running as a temp controller and programmable.Or just a $10 prebuilt temp controller. I have a fair amount of Arduino development experience and could even do bluetooth or wifi control but really prefer not to. My guess is that if it works at all, simple control is enough and that all the rest would just be marketing hype.

[Javelin18]

This sounds interesting. I backpacked in the sierras when I younger and we would shove our wrists into cold streams to cool ourselves. I think I’ll try some cool packs on my wrist as a proof of concept test

[Javelin18 in reply to Javelin18]

That actually stopped the hot flash cold. Pun intended

[Javelin18]

Cooling my wrists seems to work, but I’ve had hot flashes while my hands are cold. I’ll have to see if they are less intense when my hands are already cold.

[spencoid2 in reply to Javelin18]

my laboratory quality (bought surplus for maybe $15) cango down to WTF well below freezing or up to boiling. pretty amazing peltier can do that but it must be a cascade system, should be for list price of almost $3000 anyway tests with it produced absolutely no results but i only put my wrist on it after the flash. i was going to try gluing myself to it for the night but i think it makes more sense to use the little thing i have on order. if it does nothing i would like to get info from people who do have success so i can duplicate it. as is pretty obvious i am an electrical engineer

[Javelin18 in reply to spencoid2]

Yea, I could tell you were an electrical, “I have a fair amount of Arduino development experience.” That reminds of when I took an introductory Ada programming course. The compiler manual said it was “suitable for recreational programming.” Is there such a thing?

I’m a mechanical engineer, although I’ve forgotten a fair amount of what I learned.

[spencoid2 in reply to Javelin18]

Arduino is definitely not ready for serious development. There are great micros, all the teensy stuff and if you want wifi and or bluetooth and have infinite patience you can fight with the esp32. Recreational? Interesting one of my favorite projects is an amazing sex machine with multiple methods of control. The code is quite complex.

Since you are an ME would you mind reviewing something? I am having a fight with my sister who makes weaving looms. Recently the cost of the aluminum they use had more than doubled and shipping costs have gone up over 30%. I suggested a couple of ways to dramatically reduce the use of material but was shot down as meddling. It works great and we are not going to change anything. The latest loom was designed by a well meaning blind guy who has no engineering experience. He just stuck on more metal. I suggested that they get a review of the design by an ME who should be able to tell them how to save a lot of metal. If you are willing, please contact me at spencer (at) poodlex.com and I can give details.

[Burk]

Could you possibly get the same response by cooling your feet? When I feel a hot flash coming on the first thing off is my socks.

[Javelin18 in reply to Burk]

I’ve found that helps too. The strange thing is, if I take my forehead temperature during a hot flash, it isn’t any warmer than before.

It seems like you need to shut down the autonomic system that’s causing it, instead of cooling the core temperature. Maybe cooling anywhere shuts it down.

[spencoid2 in reply to Javelin18]

yes it has nothing to do with core. i am pretty good at judging temperature by feel and can tell when i have a fever by feeling my forehead. when having a flash, i feel hot i doubt my body temp is actually higher. it is a problem with nerves or ??? Ido not expect to lower my body temperature with this littl 5 watt cooler. The idea that the embr might work for whatever reason is what prompted me to investigate.

[spencoid2 in reply to Burk]

i am concerned about hot flashes while sleeping. not sure i canrip off my shoes and socks in public bad enough that i have my fly down most of the time

but seriously when I am having major hot flashes at night i often pull the covers off my feet. I will try the cooler everywhere when i get it,maybe forehead ?

[Burk in reply to spencoid2]

I sleep with a fan blowing across me all night. Since this is a public forum I can't be specific regarding my nightime attire. Got it?? Covers go on and off multiple times throughout the night, although I can say the I do seem to arrive at an equilibrium sometime toward morning.

[spencoid2 in reply to Burk]

I cover and uncover and fan with the sheets. I have not tried a fan. We have one of these absurdly overpriced Dyson fans that I got at a thrift store. It is very quiet so I might try it. Unfortunately my bedroom is in an upstairs loft and the heater is below so the only way to not overheat is to keep it very low which precludes no covers. You can tell us about your latex body suit, we won't judge

[Burk in reply to spencoid2]

"Latex body suit"?? Sounds unbearable!

[spencoid2 in reply to Burk]

to me too but some people like it?

[Javelin18]

I’d be happy to try your prototype. It sounds like you need to be plugged in. Do you think you could use a battery for power?

[spencoid2 in reply to Javelin18]

first i really doubt that this will work nor do i think the embr does but i am willing to spend $50 to try it. I am not going to make a pretty compact consumer device. I do not need more projects with die case housings etc etc. Let embr do that. I just want to test the theory. My first attempt will be a small DC power supply with a variable voltage regulator so the degree of cooling can be controlled "open loop" If that has any promise I can add a cheap ready made temp controller like the one I put in my hot tub when the utility company blew out the $2000 control board. costs about $8 Peltier cooler is $8 A lithium battery could power it for who knows how long depending on how cold you make it. Anything from a little camera battery to a power tool battery could be used. If I get any results worth repeating I can put together instructions with parts sources and possible ways to make your own. here is the cooler the adjustable voltage regulator and a temp controller in case anyone wants to try it before i figure out if it works

peltier ebay.com/itm/192142241559

thermostat mpja.com/Digital-Temperatur... can get a farenheight one for a couple dollars more

voltage control only need thermostat or voltage reg but throttling the voltage will lower thea mount of hysteresis, maybe. sorry the ebay link is so huge,hope it is right

ebay.com/itm/382761568583?_...

[Javelin18]

I found a link to this research paper on embrlabs.com,

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/318...

Really unusual to get a link to actual research paper.

I haven’t read the paper yet.

[spencoid2 in reply to Javelin18]

I will check it out but I think I already did and it was bullshit, not any kind of study of the embr or the principle of operation. But I may be remembering wrong. I read so much bull it is hard to keep it straight. However I do believe that the covid vaccine makes you so magnetic that brass keys stick to you have you seen that one.

[Javelin18 in reply to spencoid2]

Hadn’t seen that ony, but heard plenty of others before I asked my sister to stop sending helpful articles.

[spencoid2 in reply to Javelin18]

totally different article. the one i remember was hidden on the embr web site and as i remember was total BS strange that they did not link to this one that is largely supportive of their claims. will definitely test the cooler now but i was going to anyway. I might be remembering something totally different thant the embr web site because if you drill down really far there is a lot of information abouit the theory etc. do not have time to digest it now.

[Javelin18 in reply to spencoid2]

I don’t have time right now either. I’m still working, and although the home office is on the East coast, I have to send out enough emails to give the impression I’m still worth paying

[spencoid2 in reply to spencoid2]

well i had tome to digest it and it is essentially all bullshit. no controlled studies and only really basic abstracts that discuss nothing about methodology. also the groups are very small and most importantly there is no control against placebo effects. these are attempts to sound scientific but are bullshit. please if anyone else has the time check out the "scientific" support of the Embr.

The main study cited has nothing at all to do with using a cooling device for hot flashes. it goes on and on about social thermoregulation and the historical benefit of mammals sleeping together and warming each other. the attempt is to flood you with so much BS that you assume it is scientific and will eventually say something about reducing hot flashes. it doesn't

the sellers of the embr are careful to make no medical claims. this is pure snake oil as far as i can tell so far. but snake oil can work for the gullible. i am going to try the cooling method when i get my peltier device which should be soon.

the one study that seems to almost suggest something is a study of 39 women and it is an "exploratory" study no control so after something like 6 years of selling their product they have nothing to say about its effectiveness other than an exploratory study of 39 women. you can get 39 women to say just about anything if you ask the right way and they are motivated by the placebo effect.

Exploratory research is defined as a research used to investigate a problem which is not clearly defined. It is conducted to have a better understanding of the existing problem, but will not provide conclusive results. ... Such a research is usually carried out when the problem is at a preliminary stage.

questionpro.com/blog/explor...

[HopefulSis]

Hi there! My brother w aPCA is using the embr device for his hot flashes…he received it free through a clinical trial for men w prostate cancer and it really helps him.

clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show...

[spencoid2 in reply to HopefulSis]

thanks checking this out. satellite internet is so slow it might take me a while

[spencoid2 in reply to spencoid2]

looks like it is not recruiting

[spencoid2 in reply to HopefulSis]

trial has started and no results yet. get something for free and you are quite likely to think it does something. try paying $350 for it ans see how it helps. But that can also motivate you to think it works because you do not want to be thought of as a fool for spending the $350 and 59 participants is not much of a study. there does not seem to be any control group for this "study " either so what are they comparing the results to? it seems you can list a study on clinicaltrials.gov without any vetting. looks like more BS to me.