Benefits of Testosterone Proven in Pilot Study

[ronton2]

Medscape just published the results of a pilot study that showed considerable benefits for men with PCa who received testosterone to improve quality of life while on ADT. Amazing, yes, and the study doctor says it may represent a new protocal. Check it out at the website. This defies the age-old formula for treating men with advanced disease. Read it and take heart!

[Beauxman]

medscape.com/viewarticle/88...

[pjoshea13]

Morgentaler used Delmeades's BAT protocol.

A shot of T every 28 days. T doesn't always become supra-high, but maybe it doesn't need to. It might still be ~1,000 ng/dL at day 8, but will be at castrate levels for the latter part of the 28 days.

Continuation of ADT throughout the cycle might be misleading. It would be too difficult to switch back & forth. The muscle injection also seems to be a convenience. Why not use T patches for 7 days, say? Injected T doesn't clear quickly.

"The seven men with advanced/metastatic prostate cancer, identified through a retrospective chart review, were treated with testosterone therapy between 2005 and 2016." Seems like a lengthy period for a pilot study.

The BAT approach is designed to prevent PCa cells from adapting to ADT. T oscillates from super-high to super-low on a 28 day cycle.

-Patrick

[Hidden in reply to pjoshea13]

That would scare the hell out of me. When it comes time to give up on myself, I will quit all the drugs, let the T come back naturally, and just ride it out.

Kinda like the ride Slim Pickens took in Dr. Strangelove. Yee-Haw!!!

Joe

[ronton2 in reply to Hidden]

Joe, Way to go! Just offering the article for consideration.

[ronton2 in reply to pjoshea13]

Patrick, I take it that you have serious questions about the length of treatment. Medscape is usually a reliable source, isn't it? Anyway, I just put that out to see what others thought.

[pjoshea13 in reply to ronton2]

Ron,

I thing that the BAT approach clearly benefits some men, based on Denmeade's work & now Morgentaler's. However, the approach is crude - some men do not achieve high T levels. I know that T injected into muscle on day 1 gave me a T of over 1,000 ng/dL on day 8. I should have tested T weekly to see when I became castrate.

SHBG can be quite high in some men & free T correspondingly low.

Ideally, in a cycle, IMO, we want free T to reach a therapeutic level for "x" days; followed by a rapid shift to the castrate state for "y" days.

Medscape? Yes, but I always like to see the source paper.

-Patrick

[Break60]

This is very positive news. I’d like to know the criteria Dr Morgentaler used to qualify patients for this treatment.

Bob

[vandy69]

Good Morning ronton2,

Before I began chemo and after all drugs had failed me, my Med Onc, Dr. Oliver Sartor, tried a "Hail Mary" with high dose testosterone. Daily I rubbed on AndroGel into my upper arms/shoulders with the target of getting my T to 1000 (started at 2)!

Never could reach 1000, only 750, and of course, over 7 weeks, my PSA shot up from 4 to 19. We pulled the plug and PSA dropped fairly fast back to 7.

His goal was to resensitize cancer cells to needed a high T environment and then hitting them with Xtandi, which I had failed after 1 year several years ago.

Made sense to me, but I was very apprehensive the first day I applied AndroGel. At least it leaves the body rapidly, so when we stopped, T also went down rapidly. Throughout I was still taking Trelstar.

Best wishes. Never Give In.

[Hidden in reply to vandy69]

I agree with Never Give In!

Do you know why your MO targeted physiologic T levels vs. supraphysiologic? And do you know what your free T or bioavailable T was?

[vandy69]

PSA was 10.8 when I began chemo in September. Dropped to 6.9 after 1st cycle. Have 3rd infusion on Tuesday, 11/7 and will have blood work to include PSA. Mets now in liver, so options become more limited.

Best wishes. Never Give In.

[E2-Guy]

Nalakrats,

Where is your pharmacist located?

Ron

[E2-Guy]

Thank you Nalakrats!

[Hidden]

I was shaking the first time I did a T shot. Conventional thought was that I was committing suicide.

So, I hear the fear, but got past the shakes. 14 months later, give me the juice!