Sad Music: Every so often, we fall across bizarre... - Thyroid UK

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Sad Music

helvellaAdministrator•

Every so often, we fall across bizarre ideas that have been put forward, whether in the spirit of scientific investigation or for more prosaic or base reasons - such as trying to sell something.

In this case, I just happened across a couple of BBC radio programs in their The Why Factor series from the World Service.

The Why Factor: Sad Music

bbc.co.uk/programmes/p01gmhx6

The Why Factor: Sad Music: 2

bbc.co.uk/programmes/b06n6fj0

(The programs could be the same - but I have not carefully listened to be sure.)

If you really want to know, they played briefs extracts from the following:

Billie Holiday: Gloomy Sunday

James Taylor: Riding on a Railroad

Joni Mitchell: River

The Beatles: I Want to Hold your Hand

Kylie Minogue: Can't Get You Out Of My Head

Johann Sebastian Bach: Prelude in B minor, number 24

Mikhail Ivanovich Glinka: La Separation

Felix Mikhailovich Blumenfeld: Etude Sur Mer

Arvo Pärt: Spiegel im Spiegel

Ջիվան Գասպարյան: I Am Outcast By You

The Rankin Family: Chi Mi Na Morbheanna

Oliver Mtukudzi: Neria

Víctor Jara: Te Recuerdo Amanda

محمدرضا شجريان: Rain

Chris Isaak: Wicked Games

Samuel Barber: Adagio for Strings

I realise that you have either completely stopped reading - or maybe you are getting to screaming point - "Just what has all this got to do with thyroid disorders?"

A paper was published in 2011 which speculated that prolactin and sad music have some sort of an interplay. That idea was included in the radio programs.

And what many realise is that prolactin very often rises in hypothyroidism. Hence my wondering if there would be any relationship between thyroid disorders and choice of music!

This is the paper:

Why is sad music pleasurable? A possible role for prolactin

David Huron

First Published July 13, 2011 Research Article

doi.org/10.1177/10298649114...

And, eight years later, another paper, dismissing the whole idea:

Enjoying Sad Music: A Test of the Prolactin Theory

Olivia Ladinig, Charles Brooks, Niels Chr. Hansen

First Published December 25, 2019 Research Article

Abstract

Philosophers have long wrestled with the apparent paradox of the enjoyment of negative emotional portrayals in the arts. An example of this apparent paradox is the enjoyment among some listeners of nominally sad music. An experiment is reported in which 39 participants listened to sad and happy music while serum prolactin (PRL) concentrations were measured. The purpose of the experiment was to test an a priori theory, proposed by Huron, that liking sad music is mediated by elevated PRL levels. Contrary to the theory, sad music did not result in a significant increase in PRL; nor was the pleasure of listening to sad music associated with increased PRL. Nominally happy music did result in a decrease of PRL, especially for those participants who most prefer happy music over sad music. The effect was greatest for those who score high on a measure of loneliness. Consistent with other studies, the degree of liking sad music over happy music was found to correlate with trait openness to experience, although this effect was not echoed in PRL levels. Post-hoc analyses indicate that PRL decreases were most marked for male listeners and those who score high on a loneliness measure. In general, the results are not consistent with the theory proposed by Huron.

journals.sagepub.com/doi/10...

I don't think anyone will have learned very much from this. But some of that music is ever so powerful. Also, I was a touch surprised that Leonard Cohen didn't get a look-in.

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24 Replies

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Tythrop3 years ago

Puff the Magic Dragon by Peter Paul and Mary breaks me up.. "... sadly slips inside his cave" when the grown-up Jakie Paper doesnt want to play with him anymore. Breaks my heart.

helvellaAdministrator3 years ago

A song that has stuck with me for about fifty years. And a very simple but nice video.

Not totally sad; apposite to this time of year. It does look into winter gloom.

But next year, summer will...

Dante - Tír na nÓg

youtu.be/A0YsIHcLVHY

grumpyold• in reply tohelvella3 years ago

OMG that's a blast from my past! I saw them live back in the earlyish 70's. I also used to play Cat Stevens "Sad Lisa" whenever I broke up with a boyfriend.

Sad music seemed to work for me.

helvellaAdministrator• in reply togrumpyold3 years ago

Just played that - suspect I haven't heard it in at least several decades!

TSH110• in reply togrumpyold3 years ago

I saw a pal recently and we listened to Cat Stevens - what a wonderful blast from the past!

janeroar3 years ago

leaving Leonard Cohen out is a serious omission!!

helvellaAdministrator• in reply tojaneroar3 years ago

Hallelujah! I hoped someone would agree.

If you follow this to YouTube I think it will work:

youtu.be/ttEMYvpoR-k

• in reply tohelvella3 years ago

This is my 5 year olds favourite song; I feel I have succeeded as a parent. 😂

TSH110• in reply tohelvella3 years ago

Magically morose!

I forgot It’s Immaterial. I can’t find “Homecoming” but “New Brighton in the Rain” is one of theirs I love, it’s deliciously bleak and poignant:

youtu.be/qMZZ1XeOHTQ

janeroar3 years ago

Beautiful

Christa23 years ago

I love sad melancholic music…it keeps me quiet and calm.

I know for certain, that aggressive hard-rock makes the listener aggressive!

And I know when my husband is listening to his beloved western and country songs while driving he can easily go 20/30kmh over the limit!!

Music has a way to direct our way of daily live.

TSH1103 years ago

Yes Leonard Cohen’s omission is surprising, who else could do a song about the many gruesome ways one could die - I think it’s called Who by Fire on that glorious album Old Skin for a New Ceremony. I think Lou Reed’s Berlin might be the most desolate album ever. I listened to lots of music (including but not exclusively the melancolíc) before the thyroid disease was treated, but now I rarely listen to anything. I find that odd but I am sure they are related.

MirandaIV• in reply toTSH1103 years ago

That’s me too. I used to love music. Especially emotional and sad music. But in the last year I find myself almost indifferent and often don’t even play music. Interesting. I have been wondering about it.

TSH110• in reply toMirandaIV3 years ago

I do enjoy it if I listen but I have to be lead to it, it’s no longer something I initiate.

Alanna0123 years ago

Interesting concept! Personally, I hate sad music, I'm like a sponge: I absorb and take on the 'sad' mood. I almost never play sad. I'll rather start the day with 80s tunes. 'Break my stride' is regularly played in my house on a Saturday morning!

I'll even turn over the television if an Advert runs a sad song in the background. Expedia with their 'All by myself' (shudder) It gets switched immediately. I did find anecdotally that when thyroid levels were on the floor it's worse somehow, probably feeling low already is why.

I wonder if there would be a correlation between sad music lovers and enjoying sad movies?

Zephyrbear3 years ago

I don’t know what I’d do without music from Elgar’s fabulous Cello concerto played only by the equally fabulous Jacqueline du Pre to Imagine Dragons “Demons” with everything from hard rock to Mozart thrown in between. I’ll admit, I do tend towards the slightly sadder end of the spectrum, but then I’ll listen to Bruch’s Violin Concerto No 1 and the world is sweet once more…

penny3 years ago

I attended a lecture from a forensic psychiatrist and recall that she mentioned Gloomy Sunday and that it had been banned after a spate of suicides. She was very small and in her 70s but a live wire and had interviewed Fred West. Her talks were very well attended and really interesting. I liked her explanation of humour and how people differ:

A woman visits an undertakers where her late husband is laid out and asks if he might be changed into a blue suit as blue looks better than the black suit he is wearing. A week later she goes back and sees her husband in a lovely blue suit. She asks the undertaker how much she owes him. He says ‘nothing. A man was brought in who was wearing a blue suit and the relatives wanted to see him in a black one.’ ‘Oh, the woman says, so you changed the suits over.’ ‘No, the undertaker tells her, I swapped the heads’.

Now I think that this is funny but I apologise to those who do not find it so. Whenever my pilates teacher says ‘change heads’ I think of this.

Elly Ameling singing Schubert’s ‘Shepherd on a Rock’ I find uplifting; also most of Beethoven, Schubert and Mozart. Rita Streich singing ‘The Nightingale and the Rose’ by Saint-Saens is a wonder to hear. (I have a record which says that it is sung in French albeit that there are no words.)

Gingernut44• in reply topenny3 years ago

Am I weird, that made me laugh out loud 😂

tattybogle• in reply toGingernut443 years ago

If you are .. so am i

TSH110• in reply totattybogle3 years ago

Me too - I think it made me laugh cos I had not expected such an utterly bizarre answer!

penny• in reply toGingernut443 years ago

I found it hilarious but not all do; just my sense of humour.

DeeFish713 years ago

I heard the stories about Gloomy Sunday as well and always feel a little apprehensive about playing it - the versions I have are by Swans Way (the B side to "Soul Train") from 1984, and the best version is by one of my favourite bands, The Associates, found on their "Sulk" album from 1982. In a chilling twist, their singer ended his life after being unable to cope with his mother's death.

Miffie3 years ago

I have found this really interesting, it has led to some great responses from others. I always liked everything from classical to rock and opera to folk when younger. In my sixties I found I listened less and enjoyed silence and a good book. Still the same . I do still however listen to either dodgy old rock or classical pieces when driving alone just have the volume a bit high.

Timetraveler673 years ago

That’s interesting because I refuse to listen any song that disturbs me because I know what it can do to me, some people can listen to something that makes them sad then be able to pop back into a happy mood but I can’t seem to do this so I’ve banned myself from listening. Another reason is back in the 70s my neighbour played nights in white sateen on repeat full blast for 2 days, someone reported him and the police went round to see what was happening and found him dead with a suicide note in his hand.

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