Underactive thyroid

Hi I was diagnosed in 2011 and I'm taking Levothyroxine 75mg. My ts4 and ts3 are well within the normal range. Does anyone know about antibodies affecting the brain eventually affecting cognition?

[greygoose]

I presume you mean TPO or Tg antibodies, for Hashi's? As far as I know, they don't affect the brain. But, if you are hypo, that will definitely affect the brain.

Just saying that the Frees are 'in-range', doesn't tell us anything. Do you have the exact numbers: results and ranges?

[Hidden in reply to greygoose]

What did you mean by 'hypo'?

Hypothyroidism or hypochondriac?

🤔

[greygoose in reply to Hidden]

Good lord! What a question! I would never call anyone a hypochondriac! I meant hypothyroid, of course. Meaning having low T3 - and possibly high TSH. The brain needs a lot of T3, so if it's in short supply, you can get all sorts of symptoms connected with the brain, like anxiety, depression, paranoia, forgetfulness, etc. etc. etc. But, that is caused by low T3, not antibodies.

[Hidden in reply to greygoose]

Apologies. I didn't mean it in that way. I suppose I would prefer being labelled an over worrier because I'm genuinely concerned. Watched a video by Dr Izabella Wentz and it explained that the antibodies attach themselves to the brain affecting cognition chronically. I'm extremely worried.

[greygoose in reply to Hidden]

I'm rather worried by Dr Izabella Wentz. She seems to be saying some pretty strange things, lately. I've never heard of that before. Do you have a link to that video?

[Hidden in reply to greygoose]

Hi yes I do. Will forward later this morning.

Thanks.

[Hidden in reply to greygoose]

Hi, it's The Thyroid Secret, a series of nine free videos. I do still have them on email but they're not replaying right now. Seems the time was limited.

I am very green re all of this but when you hear an endocrinologist stating that antibodies attack your brain and eventually affect your cognition it's very worrying.

[greygoose in reply to Hidden]

She's not an endocrinologist. She's a pharmacist. She wouldn't even have the title Dr in the UK.

I've had Hashi's - with very high antibodies - practically all my life. I'm now 73 and my brain is as sharp as a knife. I do get a bit foggy early morning and late at night, but the rest of the day my cognition is just fine. I think you should stop worrying, it won't do you any good at all.

[Hidden in reply to greygoose]

She was speaking with an Endocrynologist. I'm scaring myself I know but I just want some clarification as to whether this would be reversible or if it's what we have to look forward to! I've been very blasé regarding my diagnosis and ironically when I was diagnosed I was very fit and healthy. I have within the last few days researched diet etc. and I'm determined to be very careful from now.

[greygoose in reply to Hidden]

It would only be reversible if it happened in the first place. And, I don't think it does. Most endos, I would trust as far as I could throw them! I've certainly never believed anything any of them has said. And they seem to enjoy scaring the proverbial out of us. Honestly, I've never heard anything like that before, and I don't believe it.

As long as you're taking enough replacement hormone, and your nutrients are optimal, you should be ok. Antibodies are not your enemy. They have a job to do. Each type of antibody has a specific job. They don't go rampaging around the body like rioters in Paris, setting fire to cars and smashing up everything they see. TPO/Tg antibodies are released when traces of TPO and/or TG are detected in the blood. They remove these traces and then retreat. They are there to protect you, not destroy your brain. Or anything else.

[Hidden in reply to greygoose]

Thanks, that's reassuring. However, you did say in your first reply to me 'but, if you are hypo, that will definitely affect the brain'.

[greygoose in reply to Hidden]

You don't have to have antibodies to be hypo. And, being hypo doesn't necessarily mean you have antibodies.

Yes, lack of T3 will affect the brain, but not permanently. If you restore the T3, you restore the brain.

Low T3 affects every single part of your body. It is needed by every single cell in the body to function correctly. And, it's low T3 that causes symptoms.

[Hidden in reply to greygoose]

You're very patient with me and I apologise for interrupting your day.

I had my Serum free triiodothyronine level (XaERq) taken privately last year and they were 4.0 pmol/L well within the range of 3.1 - 6.8. I'm not clear how often I should have this done.

It's still the antibody statement that is concerning me from the videos that it appears I'm unable to download now.....it wasn't clear how bad this could be or if it were permanent. I've actually tried emailing the Dr Wentz team but they're not responding now.

[greygoose in reply to Hidden]

Oh, please, don't apologise. That's what we're here for.

Your FT3 is rather low. Most hypos need it a lot higher than that. The FT3 is the most important number, so ideally, it should be done at every test. It's just that doctors have no idea what T3 is, so wouldn't understand the result even if they did the test. Therefore they pretend - and possibly even believe - that it is of no importance.

I agree with you that that is a rather terrifying statement. And rather irresponsible, too, to make it without a lot further explanation. I find people are getting increasingly hysterical about antibodies, whilst doctors totally ignore them. It's a confusing situation, I know. But, I don't think either side of the argument really know what they're talking about. But, then, cynic is my middle name.

[Hidden in reply to greygoose]

In my ignorance I thought my T3 results were ok - doc said they are when my private results were forwarded to him. How do I raise them?

[greygoose in reply to Hidden]

Well, it depends how well you convert. Did you have an FT4 test done at the same time as that FT3? If you convert well, then you just need an increase in levo. But, if you don't convert very well, then you need to take T3 to raise your FT3.

Your endo would say it was ok, because it was in-range. He doesn't know any better than that. It's rare to find an endo that actually know mucha bout thyroid.

[shaws Administrator in reply to Hidden]

Most on this forum have had disappointing consultations with Endocrinologists and some of us following their advice didn't improve their health but have done so with comments and advice made by Members' experiences.

[Hidden in reply to shaws]

Hi, thanks for your response. I'm getting in a fluster over this, finding it very worrying. The video via Dr Izabella Wentz stated that even with low antibodies, they attack your brain and I'm so concerned that my cognition will be affected permanently. They didn't specify if it were reversible or how serious it would be.

Enough to worry me though.

[MaisieGray]

Hidden greygoose It is Dr K who writes about Ab's' effect on the brain: "Hashimoto’s is more than an autoimmune disease that affects the thyroid. It creates inflammation that impacts the entire body, but especially the brain, the tissue most sensitive to inflammation. The autoimmunity of Hashimoto’s keeps the brain in a constant state of inflammation that impairs brain function and atrophies the brain"

drknews.com/poor-brain-func...

[greygoose in reply to MaisieGray]

I thought Hashimoto’s Encephalopathy was an entirely different disease, just discovered by the same man. If it were true that 'thyroid antibodies bind to the brain' we'd all be zombies by now! Plus, what are 'thyroid antibodies'? Does he mean TPO or Tg antibodies, that indicate Hashi's? As far as I know, there aren't any antibodies that target the thyroid itself.

Besides, he doesn't give any references for this information, so - frankly - I don't give it much credence.

There is inflammation, of course there is. But, saying that Hashi's causes inflammation that can affect the brain, is an entirely different thing to saying that 'thyroid antibodies bind to the brain', like some sort of science fiction monster. I find that all a bit sensationalist, and not very scientific.

[MaisieGray in reply to greygoose]

I've never "got into" Dr K myself, although like all such guru-types, including Izabella Wentz, he has his many followers & adherents. I'd need to read more on it to reach a view - I'm non-autoimmune but my brain fog became noticeable nearly 30 yrs ago and is now horrendous, even with T3 - so antibodies:brain is not a subject I've particularly looked into in any depth, for myself. I just wanted to suggest who it might have been that Wentz had been talking to, although of course, he is not an Endo (his bio describes him as "PhD, DHSc, DC, MS, MMSc, FACN, clinical research scientist, academic professor, and a functional medicine health care provider").

[greygoose in reply to MaisieGray]

I am so glad you said that about 'gurus'. I thought it was just me! No, I'm not a fan of either of them, either. But, thank you for pointing out who might be responsible for spreading this alarm and scaring the proverbial out of our OP.

[Hidden in reply to greygoose]

Can someone explain brain fog to me please?

[greygoose in reply to Hidden]

You mean what it feels like? Or what causes it?

You know when you go into the kitchen and then wonder what you went in there for? Well, it's like that x 10 - or even greater. You're confused, can't think straight, forget what you're talking about in the middle of a sentence; read one page in your book 15 times and still have no idea what they're talking about; can't work out simple arithmetic or do the quick crossword in the Daily Mail; get lost driving to work when you've worked there for 20 years (yes, I did that ) - if you can drive at all, that is.

What causes it? Low thyroid hormone.

Is it reversible? Yes, absolutely.