Is this a mad idea?

My son, who is desperate to see his Mum feel well again after over ten years of suffering, has sent me this link from Hypothyroidmom. I know quite a few people on the forum have shared her articles and I would appreciate comments on what people on the forum thinks about this it feasible or just mad?

45 Replies

Stiltzski, What a lovely son. CBD oil has helped a lot of people with chronic pain. I'm not sure whether it can be legally imported into the UK but if you can get it and try it, I think it's worth a go.

Yes, he is very caring. Thank you for your reply. Liz

Yes what a lovely lad. :)

I've read of the benefits of cannabis oil for pain, there's lots of petitions about it.

Yet I for one daren't try it - yet! (not as a gran anyway)

what about hemp oil? (near cousin) anyone tried it? I have some in the cupboard for emergencies - I need a bigger cupboard... full of 'in case' stuff...

Whilst browsing your recent threads I noticed you were waiting for a VitD result. Did you eventually receive it and what was the result ? Being low can cause horrid aches and pains as well as a host of other issues.... You once mentioned it was OK - which doesn't tell us a great deal - it needs to be OPTIMAL :-)

You are quite right! Thank you so much for the prompt: I will ring the GP surgery and see if they have it.

I now have the Vit D result but it means very little to me. It was 72 last time it was done in January 2014 and this time round is 70 (28th April 2015). The reading is under the heading '250H VitD imm'assay'.

I have a feeling that the measurement would have been in nmol/L - so divide that by 2.5 and it puts the result into ng/L - which is 28. So that is way BELOW optimal of 60. So you need to be taking at least 3000IU's of VitD - with fatty foods as D is fat soluble....

The chart in the above link illustrates the dose required according to the results....

I live in Crete where the measurement is the same as the US....

Thanks. That's an interesting link.

Wow, Marz, thanks for that really useful Vitamin D chart! I think my GP is seriously under dosing me, now I can discuss this with her with some ammunition on my side. My Vitamin D was 17.5, yes that low, and I am taking 1600mg daily after a loading dose.


I think I mean 1600IU daily, 😀

You need around 6000IU's daily. It is cheap enough buy your own. Be aware that VitD encourages the production of Calcium which is not good if it ends up in the bloodstream - so take VitK2 as well to ensure calcium reaches the bones. Something else that your Doc possibly forgot to tell you :-)

Thanks Marz for this helpful advice, I am waiting results for latest Vit D testing so will go armed with all this to the GP. She didn't mention VitK2, so I will ask her about it, she does listen and I will try first to see if she will prescribe or agree to it before taking my own steps.

I thought the maintenance dose was wrong considering how low the Vit D was to start with, though she did give a loading dose of 300,000 IU over two weeks. But I still have pain in the rib cage and if I bang my toes (excruciatingly painful!) so I am sure it needs increasing.

Not heard of a Doc prescribing K2. It is readily available. Not sure GP's are aware of all these tweaks we learn about on the forum :-)

Ahh! I will look It out then, thanks. Is it classified as a supplement or food? Will it be in a health food place or online?

So glad there is so much information and help on this forum, not to mention moral support.

It's a Vitamin - so is a supplement. I buy mine from amazon or other places on the net - when I am buying my other bits and pieces.... Bound to be in Health Food shops....

Stiltzski, 70 is adequate. 75-200 is replete. Most people are happy around 100. If you are able to get sun on your skin a few hours a week you can top up naturally. If not supplement 2,500iu vitD3 daily.

Thanks, that is very helpful. I already supplement with a multi-vitamin which supposedly gives me 100% of NRV but I am off to sunnier climes soon (I live in Scotland!) so that should help top it up. I always do feel better when I am in a sunnier climate...

Stiltzski, In UK, more so in Scotland, we need to supplement D3 Oct-Apr when ultraviolet levels are too low to stimulate vitD. 2,500iu is a maintenance dose for those like you whose levels are adequate/replete.

I do supplement all year. The dose in the multivitamin is down as 5 u (with a leg down on the left side of the u) g. How does that translate into iu?

Stiltzsi, 5mcg = 200iu.

Thanks. So 5ug is not much of a dose at all, despite what the packet says. I think I will get some of those capsules from Amazon that have been mentioned in another recent post.

Best to take supplements individually to get the required dose. Multi-vits are OK for maintenance and if you are healthy. I take 10,000 IU's of D. eg to obtain the required amount of B12 in a Multi-vit you would have to take several tabs and then that would cause you to overdose on something else.

Hi, stiltz. No, it is not a mad idea and if you find a way to participate please let us know of how it helps.

The hype about cannabis has driven the usage of the plant 'underground' and created a ridiculous neurosis about it. It is a plant that has mind-boggling potential but its illegal status has been driven by international politics that has nothing to do with its so-called dangers.

One of the issues that is problematic about the culture of illicit use is that it heightens its evident attraction to young people, who are drawn to using it more so because of the rebellious-seeming nature of its use as well as the fact that it feels good. And therein lies the problem for those people who ban it - yet probably use it themselves; it feels very nice. But cannabis use in young brains is dangerous since brains do not finish developing until around the age of 25 and are extremely susceptible to its effects. Another problem is that young people are developing skills of survival in this increasingly hostile world, and often feel distressed. To bypass the learning curve from handling these feelings by using cannabis is unhealthy. But its judicial use, like that of alcohol, can be pleasant.

There are other issues around its illicit status, such as the creation of a criminal subculture of ordinary people, as well as the creation of very rich drug lords. But its unfettered use is also problematic - but none of this can be openly discussed whilst the public have been whipped into such an ignorant frenzy about its use at all.

The only way to begin to gain some control of its use and to stop the real madness - the illicit use of stronger and more potent strains and the criminalisation of people who are caught using cannabis, is to legislate its use. A bit like alcohol and prohibition, I guess. But there is no political will to do that - too dodgy in the eyes of the electorate, so poorly people will have to toe the pharmaceutico-medical line.

There is no doubt whatsoever that cannabis and its derivatives will be more freely used some time in the future - probably very a needlesome prospect for Big Pharma, who could never control it and who, it would never surprise me, have a vested interest in keeping its use illegal. So no, stiltz, you are not mad. The fact that you even ask that question is a sign of the madness of the hype around cannabis and the madness of how the masses are manipulated into thinking what powerful legislators want the masses to think. You must be very poorly for your son to have sent this to him. The only harm you might incur would be to face a legal problem, but I wouldn't know about CBD; it looks really interesting, so thanks for bringing it to at least my attention.

Good luck be yours.

Thank you , Schenks. That is all very useful and interesting.

that's kind - but the replies below are the ones to watch!

I know little about CBO so can't comment on this.

Am with Martz -what is your vitamin D level? I was in so much pain I could barely walk as mine was low. However as Martz says you can be in range but not optimally treated and it is once you are that the aches, pain and fatigue go. I was amazed at the difference taking my vit D made to me.

What was your level please? I have just found out mine is 70 but that means nothing to me!

Hi Stilzki. It's absolutely worth a try. I get it for my son to ease his anxiety and it works a treat. It doesn't alter perception or behaviour, just makes him feel calm and at peace. It's completely legal in the UK as it has no psychoactive ingredients but there are lots of weak, ineffective brands out there. I don't think I'm allowed to mention or recommend suppliers here, but PM me and I can you give the details. There's really nothing to be nervous about -- it won't get you stoned! Believe me, I wouldn't give it to my son if I hadn't read stacks of research.

The best CBD oil is made from cannabis flowers. Hemp oil is not the same thing.

Hope that helps. Let us know how you get on.

Thanks so much. I have PMed you (I think!).

I think CBD oil and cannabis extracts will be very important in helping recovery from auto-immune conditions amongst others. I would like to see it made possible to grow it in this country for medicinal purposes so it could be included in juices etc.

CBD oil is obtainable here, I don't know if I can say where but pm me if you're interested.

There is a UK company, GW Pharmaceutical which is licensed to make cannabis products for medical use. They started with MS with great success and have also been working on pain relief for terminal cancer patients amongst other things. Their products are prescribed across Europe. It has been a battle because of the political views on the drug but they have done many clinical trials to prove it's medical worth. I'm sure we will see much more use of it in the future.

Thanks for that info. I suffer from Hashis and have terrible trying to sleep. I've always been told by friends to smoke some hash but declined because needed to feel in control but this sounds like something that would solve my problems. Would be grateful if u would PM me with source. Many thanks.

As far as I know you can only get GW products on prescription in the UK and I don't know if they are licensed for anything other than MS at present. Sorry. I posted because I think it is relevant that products derived from cannabis are available for medical use and I know they are testing them for various other diseases.

A few times now I have used cannabis oil to help me sleep, and the next day I have felt like a 16 year old, clear headed, full of energy and able to function in a way that hasnt been been possible for me in 20+ years. Coincidence maybe?

That is amazing! If I can get hold of it, I am definitely going to give it a try. Thanks for replying. Liz

The GW product is a drug called Sativa. It has been developed with fewer of the active ingredients in cannabinol in order to get a patent. It's not available on the NHS according to NICE prescribing guidelines.

Thanks. That's a shame.

The GW pharma product is call Sativex. It is in the BNP for use in MS, and also on a named patient basis for RA.

HOWEVER, try getting it, cost is the stopper. I have had RA for over 20 yrs. now badly disabled. The powers that be will now give me biologics at about £2,000 a month but wont let me try Sativex.

As I have never tried Sativex I do not know the cost as it is unknown how much I would need, but no one is prepared to consider it.

I may be wrong but it could change my life.

I am so sorry to hear that you aren't able to get Sativex, Siskin. I gather that genuine CBD oil is quite expensive. I have been given a source is you want to PM me.

So are you still suffering in spite of good thyroid treatment? Or are you getting bad thyroid treatment? Normalizing thyroid+adrenal function, and the nutrients that support them, is key. However if you don't have access to a good doc and the proper hormone supplements, then by all means, use CBD oil or vape a little weed. It isn't a permanent fix like getting the right hormones, but it can reduce pain and make you feel better for a while - and there is nothing wrong with that! All the stupid stuff about it being habit forming, a gateway to hard drugs, etc. etc. is lies. There are lots of people who perversely find joy in the perpetuation the politics of paranoia.

--A resident of Colorado USA, where it is fully legal

Thanks for your post all the way from Colorado! I am getting no thyroid meds or support from my GP but the practice will do 6-monthly blood tests. I get my thyroid meds from a private doctor. I am better than I was (am now on T3+T4: Nature Throid rather than Levothyroxine), but I still have quite a bit of joint and muscle pain and am tired most of the time. I also have gut issues. As I am no longer on pain killers (and attendant PPIs), I am finding it hard staying on an even keel and if I make any sort of effort/exertion, like going away for the weekend, I pay the price for quite a while afterwards.

Yeah, I had gut issues too. Celiac: gluten was killing me. Are you in the UK health system? How is it that your health system gets off scott-free by not having to provide you any thyroid hormone? Joint pain says low cortisol, or low estradiol, to me. So will your GP do just TSH, or will he/she do TSH/FT3/FT4? You might need a little T3 on top of your NDT, to feel well, but it's hard to figure that out without a FT3 test.

It would still be a medicine, that you would have to take and be dependent on, like LDN even. I would only use it as a last resort once food sensitivities and germs, parasites..everything is ruled out as a cause.

Yes, a good point. I have been on the Sativex UK website and realise that there are quite a few side effects and contraindications. I avoid wheat, gluten and dairy products already. I also have another auto-immune disease, lichen schlerosis, which is no fun at all.

Hello stiltzski!

Well, most of our more important medicines are derived from plants, the useful alkaloids are taken out to prevent dangerous or unpleasant side effects. What about aspirin. ( from willow tree)' digitalis (foxglove) or tamoxifen ( from Yew)?

But it wouldn't do us much good to just eat the plants, because they contain a mixture of good and bad ingredients., hence the need to refine the active parts of the marijuana plant and to test carefully.

It sounds like the oil can be very helpful, maybe it is worth a try, but if it were me I would make sure first anything else which may be causing problems is dealt with, such as deficiencies of iron, Vitamin D or B12. Otherwise, these potential deficiencies may be masked by using a medicinal oil and so wouldn't be dealt with.

I can't countenance smoking marijuana, as the dangers to the brains of young and old are significant, long lasting and potentially disastrous. To say that we need to legalise the plant in order to pursue health research and benefits is like saying we can only get to use aspirin by making it legal to smoke willow!!

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